I got a friend out of a parking ticket in college. He was bitching and moaning about the fine when I noticed the ticket was dated a month from the actual violation. He went to court and argued that he never parks illegally and for that matter, this incident didn’t even happen yet. Judge looked at it, saw the erroneous “future” date, and dismissed it.
And you will, if 10:05 is listed as the time of the violation - but the OP says “they issued a parking ticket at 10:05.”, which suggests to me that either 1) there is both a time of issue and a time of occurrence/violation on the ticket or 2) the driver returned at 10:05 and saw the agent putting the ticket on the car.
Maybe a different example will help clarify - my son got a camera speeding ticket in the mail yesterday*. They are treated like parking tickets, written against the registered owner, no points etc. The ticket was issued on 3/24 but it very clearly stated that the offense happened on 3/20 at 3:50 pm . It doesn't matter if he can prove that the car was elsewhere from 10am until 9 pm on 3/24 ( the day the ticket was issued) - the ticket was for a violation that happened on 3/20.
- similar to a red-light camera ticket.
Well, that’s the question then. Are there two times on the ticket? Or just the 10:05? I’m almost certain here that that would be enough to dismiss the ticket.
Sure. Except the person who wrote the ticket wont appear, so none of that testimony will be admitted. The “Meter maid” will not be a witness for the state, at least not in California.
The only evidence or testimony will be the ticket, and *maybe *some supervisor there saying how they issue the tickets. More likely, nothing but the bare ticket.
So, what does the ticket itself show? That it was issued after the prohibited time. Thus, not evidence of a violation.
Now, the Judge may ask if the driver was parked there before the time. You should never lie. “I am not sure” could be OK.
I once witnessed a guy trying to get out of a speeding ticket (I was in the courtroom on a different matter) because the officer did not use a radar gun, but instead estimated the violator’s speed as he drove past and determined it was beyond the limit. The guy claimed, therefore, that there was no proof he’d been speeding.
The judge essentially laughed this off, saying that the officer’s testimony that he witnessed the violation was all the proof he needed. The ticket stood.
I suspect you might be in for a similar outcome; if a law enforcement official (whether a police officer or a third-party contractor) says your car was there at 9:48, that will likely be good enough for the judge.
Of course there’s nothing to be lost in trying to fight it, I guess, other than your time. I just wouldn’t get your hopes up.
Yes, if the “Meter maid” shows up, their testimony will be enough. At least here in CA, they will not be called, nor will they show. The only “testimony” will be the ticket.
If it said that the time of the occurrence was 10:05, then proof that the regulation was only in effect until 10 would have been enough to dismiss the ticket anywhere I can think of . But the OP did appeal it based on his belief that “the ticket was invalid as it was written when parking was unrestricted” , and he lost his appeal based on someone saying in some way that the “car was observed in the lot at 9:48”. Now, Dr. Deth says the meter maid won’t show up at a hearing in California and he or she certainly wouldn’t show up for a hearing by mail - so where did the 9:48 time come from if it wasn’t written on the ticket somewhere?
The question is absolutely when the ticket alleges the violation occurred - and I would find it strange if the OP talks about the ticket being *issued* after 10 if in fact he meant that the ticket alleges the violation *happened *after 10.
Perhaps. But I have the same question as doreen: Where did the 9:48 time come from in the first place? Whatever report or document that was written on could conceivably be accepted as evidence by the court.
Same here. Where is the 9:48 from?
The 9:48 is from their denial of my appeal. Not sure if I said this before, but I never got the parking ticket. All I have is the courtesy notice that listed the ticket issuance time as 10:05, and their response to my appeal added the “observed at 9:48.”
@gotpasswords
My advice would be first to see if the ticket is even legally enforceable. My understanding for my jurisdiction is, that tickets issued by private agencies for violations on private property are not legally enforceable. They issue them under the expectation / hope that they will be paid and as a deterrent, but can’t do anything if you don’t pay. I was told this by a police officer roommate years ago. After that I never paid one in my life and never heard anything more.
@moes lotion
I can attest from personal experience that the process is deliberately designed to stop people from appealing. Municipal tickets are a massive revenue source. I was given a ticket that was time-stamped 12 minutes before the violation period even started, this is quite common.
I was parked in downtown Toronto and went to my car at 2:55, knowing the street I was on became a no parking zone at 3:00. When I got here, it had a ticket time stamped at 2:48. The guy was still issuing tickets to the line of still legally parked cars. I went up to him asked WTF did I get a ticket? He actually gave me a smartass smirk as said I could fight it if I wanted.
I contacted the city and sent it to them and they said once it was issued all I could do was fight it in court (i.e.: I can’t go to the police station and request it cancelled etc). Meaning a court date months away, take at least half day off work, hope that I wasn’t away on business at the time. If they don’t get to my case that day, reschedule, take another day off etc.
I just paid it.
Were you in fact in the lot at 9:48? I haven’t seen you respond to that, maybe I overlooked it.
Not in California. The Judge cannot act as the prosecution.
Not in traffic court, they arent real judges, you can’t ask for a jury, there is no prosecutor. It’s not a real trial.
I really can’t remember exactly what I did on some day in February. It’s common practice to arrive near the end of the restricted time, park, but not get out of the car until 10:00 when parking is unrestricted, resulting in a swarm of people leaving their cars at the same time. I can only guess the ticket writer did see my car there and decided to be ornery and ticket the cars they saw arriving before 10:00, even if we (me and probably a dozen others) didn’t leave our cars until after 10:00.
GMANCANADA - It’s a transit station parking lot, so not private property.
I was able to find out that the tickets are written and processed by someone called Data Ticket.
OK, this is where they got you. Lots of people think if they stay with the car until the restriction is over, they *can’t *get a ticket , but that’s not true. The definition of “park” doesn’t require the vehicle to be unoccupied. There are lots of times you won’t get a ticket if you are in the car, but the ticket won’t be dismissed based on “It says I was illegally parked at 9:48 but I didn’t leave the car until 10:05”. To get it dismissed, you would have to be able to say you actually parked after 10.
And yet I know a guy who got a DUI when he was asleep in his parked car. The cop said as long as he was in the car it was not parked. 
ETA: nm
I don’t know exactly what your friend told you or what the cop told your friend- but in my experience , the explanation for how you get a DUI in a parked car is usuually ( and more accurately) expressed as “The definition of “operating a motor vehicle” includes being in a parked car with the keys” rather than as " if you are in it, the car isn’t parked".
I would have taken his picture and let him know that I will put him on my facebook/twitter/instagram feed with the note that “if you ever get an improper ticket in Toronto that you might want to talk to this guy”. No threats, just exposure. Folks might see and recognize him in the future and get into their cars before he has a chance to screw them over.
That’ll wipe the smile off his face.
Bolding mine.
Sounds to me like your car was there. I’d pay up and not get any more fuss made about it.