You don’t know this. Even if Trayvon threw the first punch (and we don’t even know this for sure), he may have been in reasonable fear for his life because a stranger (whom he may or may not have known was armed with a gun) was following him for no reason. He may have lashed out in a “fight or flight” response- he may have thought he’d get shot in the back if he ran.
Unfortunately we’ll probably never know. I do think if you follow an unarmed person for no reason at night, and a fight breaks out, you are at least partially responsible for his death if you shoot him. I think the law in FL should be changed such that the killer would be convicted in such a circumstance.
You have to be one of the most despicable fucks on the Dope. Why don’t you climb your racist ass up Lonesome Polecat’s and leave the conversation to the adults?
None of those things happened, you fucking moron. It’s his right given by the people of Florida (or rather, not taken away by them) to follow whomever the fuck he so desires. There’s no evidence he brandished his gun, and lots that he didn’t, and also no evidence that it was him specifically, rather than the owners of the private gated community he lived in that decided who had the right to walk there.
This was not a public place anyone had the right to walk through. Questioning strangers there is not just acceptable, but outright good practice.
Facts. Try looking at them sometimes, instead of whatever nonsense you’re basing your opinion on.
Being followed is not reason for fear of imminent attack or harm. Whether the follower is armed or not. My cite is about 3000 posts in all these threads, by several different lawyers, policemen, 911 operators, and other people who would rather refer to the law than their own baseless imaginings when determining what people may or may not do in a particular circumstance.
Being followed at night, by an armed stranger, who may have been shouting things at you, might reasonably cause fear of imminent attack. There’s no way to know for sure if Zimmerman had been acting in such a way, but with no witnesses at the scene (except for the killer) I find it just as reasonable that Zimmerman was behaving in a threatening manner that would cause a rational person to fear for his life as Zimmerman was “sucker punched” for no reason.
See, that’s Doper Land. We insist on accurate statements about Martin’s height. We rely on things like tape measures and scales. But we’re fine with “…who may have been shouting things at you…” That one’s just fine.
Trayvon martin was 71 inches tall, because that’s what the evidence showed. And he was 158 pounds at his autopsy, because that’s what the evidence showed.
The evidence did not show Zimmerman shouting things at Martin while following him.
You didn’t mention me. But since you’re at least suggesting that Martin supporters are the only ones who have reason to find your comments distasteful, I thought I’d clear that up.
Trayvon Martin did not deserve to die. He died, yes, and it was a tragic circumstance, not a matter of “just desserts.”
I’m not making a legal argument. Of course this is just my opinion. I’m saying what I find reasonable. You might be totally right about Zimmerman- and the jury may have made the exactly correct legal decision. That has nothing to do with my opinion, or what I find reasonable. I’d love to hear your opinion on the likelihood that Zimmerman has any moral (not legal) culpability for Trayvon’s death.
That may be the case. Ultimately, though, it doesn’t affect Zimmerman’s right to self defence. For that to change, you’d need to prove he was committing a felony when he caused reasonable fear in Martin, rather than acting legally.
Don’t forget, though, Zimmerman was not the only witness. Rachel Jeantal heard the confrontation prior to the fight, and said nothing that suggests Martin thought Zimmerman was threatening him with a gun, or shouting threats at him. That, for me, would mean that there’s more evidence that Martin did not have reason to fear imminent attack.
