In my view, Zimmerman is morally culpable for Martin’s death.
Knowing he was armed, and knowing the police were on their way, Zimmerman had no good reason to go on foot at all. He did, and set in motion a chain of events that ended with Martin’s death. Zimmerman’s actions were completely legal, but unwise and foolish.
I don’t know the history of Lonesome, so I don’t know what his deal is. But there is nothing in that post to justify a warning, and certainly nothing to justify a banning.
People have said horrible things about Zimmerman without getting warnings.
Basing your moral argument, and your reasoning, on things other than the actual evidence - and I don’t here mean just the evidence at the trial, but everything we know about the case and the people - will not lead to a worthwhile result.
Jeantal heard part of the confrontation prior to the fight (through a phone), though all her testimony indicated to me was that there was some sort of physical fight before the gunshot, and we already knew that.
I totally agree- I strive to take into account everything when making a moral judgment. Like Justice herself, I carefully weigh every piece of evidence, poring through every permutation and possibility. Lo, my moral proclamations carry with them the weight of the gods- all shall hear them, tremble, and nod their heads vociferously for my righteousness!
Hubris is a dangerous thing. Like Icarus, you may fly too close to the Sun of Truth on wings of insufficient Reason, and your fall will be a lesson to all.
None of that is even warning-worthy? And he got his warning after the first post. Perhaps LP deserves a bit of admiration for not dissembling his true feelings on this matter, perhaps unlike some who are taking Zimmerman’s side in all this, but he can go be admired somewhere else.
I don’t want to stray too far OT, but he referred to blacks as “feral proto-humans”. That’s not exactly the same as calling them “niggers” but it’s pretty close.
Why Zimmerman was following Martin means 'D" for diddly squat. This whole tragic circumstance rotates on one axis, the decision by M to play a “gangsta” and punch out Zimmerman. Had he just talked to him, instead of hitting him, none of this would be happening now. He didn’t, and his decision is the crux of the biscuit.
Martin is responsible for the death of Martin. Period. Full stop. Trayvon Martin is dead because Z made the wrong decision - that is, to punch Zimmerman in response to a question.
If I could only find the news article that said The Martin family told CBS news that their son was 6’2’’ and between 140 and 160 lbs. The fact most photos I’ve seen him in, (at his oldest anyway) he seems to be head and neck taller than some people, and always taller than anyone else (even males), add to the fact the medical examiner can’t get his facts straight, lead me to believe he’s over 6 foot. I’m not rallyin for anything, other than, I’m good at judging height (I should work at a carnival). So if anything, I’m trying to prove to myself, I’m not insane in thinking he’s the same height as me.
I don’t care for the “Hispanic” tag but it’s required under “ethnic background” then they name a few countries from Latin America with the most immigrants and if you don’t belong to then they ask you to list “other” and specify. So it goes like this
Hispanic ->other->Spaniard->white
Only “racism” I ever experienced in the US is when I say my name and people respond: “But you don’t look Hispanic at all nor do you have an accent” :rolleyes:
Or not. We don’t know how the fight started, or even who threw the first punch. I think (just an opinion here, based on the little that’s actually known about what went down that night) it’s just as possible that Trayvon felt reasonable fear for his life. But we’ll never know.
You don’t know that he did. You weren’t there, and we have no solid evidence that Martin assaulted Zimmerman first.
What we do know for sure is that Zimmerman made a stupid error of judgment in assuming a person engaged in legal, unsuspicious behaviour of no significance was a criminal, and then inserted himself into a situation that didn’t need him in it. That we know for sure. And had he not done it, nobody would have gotten hurt. Whatever moral responsibility Martin bears - which we’ll never know for sure, since he is dead, and Zimmerman is not a reliable witness - Zimmerman must also bear moral responsibility.
He did not have to fear for his life in order to throw a punch. That is not considered lethal force, and non-lethal force can be used to protect oneself against a reasonable fear of imminent harm by another using force against you. We know that he was afraid because he said so to Jeantel. Therefore, if Zimmerman did anything at all that under the circumstances Martin could reasonably perceive as a prequel to greater harm, even if Zimmerman only reached out, without actually making contact, Martin would be justified in using nonlethal force to protect himself. And for myself I am absolutely sure that is precisely what occurred.
