I think this is it. The end of the American experiment.
I think Trump will threaten Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania to elect Trump electors and that they will go along with it. Weirdly enough I think GA will be the hardest but he may succeed there as well. The Supreme Court will say…hey states can do what they want.
Trump ‘re-elected’. There will never be a Democratic President again as they will use the 4 years to set it up. Then they will start working on the Senate and the House to make elections irrelevant.
What are the Blue States going to do? The Republicans would like nothing better but to use the military against Blue states and set up puppet governments if they refuse to accept. The Judiciary is behaving right now but they will see the writing on the wall and swing over. The USA is gone.
I watched Biden’s press conference today. He seems very relaxed about the situation and focused on his call with governors, the content of that call (coronavirus vaccine facilitation, economy, stimulus etc). If he’s confident to carry on as it is then it gives me confidence. He will have his own legal team and the Biden-Harris campaign has far more cash on hand than Trump-Pence.
Look mr/mrs Republican state legislator. Now that I got you alone, you do this or I will tell your constituents to not vote for you next election. In addition, I will tell my supporters to harass or kill you and your family. You want that? No? Then do it. It will look much like what happened recently after a private call with Trump. OH! We changed our mind…look at all the election irregularities!
I do hope you are right. I am certain Trump and his allies are going to try this. My only hope is that they do it as incompetently as they have done other things and it gets out.
I don’t think you’re a fool. You’re reacting appropriately to a unique and terrifying situation re the future of our way of government. I share your terror. It’s good to look at things rationally (if you are able), but when DJT was elected, we never in a million years predicted that he would bring us to this moment.
As has been said in other posts in other threads, our way of government depends on all sides honoring some basic norms and boundaries. Trump and now a huge chunk of the Republican party have overthrown and crashed through those boundaries. The country has not been in this precise situation before and as much as we’d like to blow sunshine up our own and each others’ shorts, we can’t be sure how it’s going to turn out. What’s going on now is NUTS. It is reassuring that Biden does not seem upset (at least in public). He is displaying the kind of rational leadership that we need. But he’s not the official leader yet.
Yeah, I guess ultimately it will “all be okay,” but in my lifetime? I’m 72 years old. I think maybe not.
I think many ‘it will be ok’ people just really do not understand what threats can do. I think these ‘it will be ok’ people are under the assumption that laws matter and institutions matter and that people will blink and think before agreeing to this. Even strong people can succumb to threats. Republicans have dubious morality anyway and, I don’t think, it would take much for them to succumb. Trump and his allies don’t even have to say it directly. Just threaten you will tell your voters to vote for a different Republican next election and not that 'some people might be upset with your decision not to play along…".
No, Trump has promised him that he’ll be paid after it’s all over. This is a maneuver Trump has pulled for decades with the whole spectrum of employees from bottom to top. Then he stiffs them if the result is not what he wanted. So when Ghouliani’s tactics fail, Trump will refuse to pay him.
Basically, WRT electors, the electors needed to be named before election day. New ones can’t be picked. Also, if electors are faithless, members of Congress can raise objections, which they will. An objection means the electoral vote count stops dead in its tracks until the issue is resolved. And you know what happens on Jan 20 if the electoral college hasn’t finished voting? Trump gets escorted out of the WH by the Secret Service (many of whom hate him, remember), and Pelosi is inaugurated as interim president.
Seriously, a coup isn’t going to happen. I agree that Trump is doing everything he can to become dictator for life and then have the torch passed to his hand-picked successor, but it’s not going to happen.
I think you’re right about all this (my bolding). And it worries me that Bill Barr has been out of the public eye, letting the clownish Rudy distract the left with how ridiculous and ineffectual he is. Barr is not ineffectual.
I believe threats such has you describe have been made and are still being made.
And some state GOP officials are going to try to play along with the coup—unless they are fully confident that they will be caught and prosecuted for it. And I’m not sure if there are any safeguards on which we can count to give them that confidence.
It’s worrying. Those saying ‘the rules prevent all these scenarios from playing out’ are placing too much reliance on The Rules. I mean, I hope they’re right. But at least a third of this nation is made up of people who think a dictatorship would be fine and dandy, so long as it’s run by the “right people.” That’s a problem.
“Citing the well known, but fictional case of State of Alabama v William Gambini and Stanley Rothenstein your honor – I would like to know if you had magic grits for breakfast, and the condition of Marisa Tomei’ biological clock”
Judge: “WHAT?”
“Sorry your honor, I am a little rusty so I watched My Cousin Vinny as a refresher course on trial law.”
It’s extraordinarily concerning. And it’s extremely concerning that it comes down to individuals in a patchwork system where every possible weakness is being probed. If it’s any help, the Michigan head of the Senate is term-limited out (serving a final term) and has been more vocal than many Republicans about upholding the vote. I don’t know how he’ll come off in a meeting with Trump but he seems to be in the same mold as the Georgia SoS:
Here’s Trevor Noah talking about faithless electors. There are too many of them for Trump to convince the number he needs to go along with him. The states are also aware of this, and many have spoken out that they won’t be allowing this.
The rest of your scenario hinges on this, so no, I don’t think it will happen that way.
If Trump has enough power to change three state’s worth of electors without consequence, then the entire election didn’t matter anyway. He could’ve just declared himself Permanent Supreme Dictator and bypassed all the democracy stuff.
Also, I put up a poll on this topic. Would OP feel any comfort knowing that those agreeing with their fear is, by far, the tiniest of minorities under the hundred plus who responded?
