Please tell me you saved your marriage.

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

Right now I’m roomates with a friend ‘with priveleges’.

By that I mean: I’ve been married for 11 years, to a woman I’ve known for 15 years. We have 4 year old twin boys. We’ve lost 3 family members in the last year. In dealing with our own demons, we’re on medication, she’s been suicidal (not attempted, thank god, just pondering the release), We’ve both not had enough emotional reserves to be there for each other in the past.

We’re both experiencing highs and lows.

We’ve both made friends in new groups. (For her, through the first part of our marriage, her friends were my friends first.) I’ve encouraged and assisted her in developing her own outlets. (pushing out space in the basement for her own hobbies, sending her off this past weekend to a Conference for her hobby in L.A.)

We care for each other, we care for the kids, we don’t want a divorce. We’re communicating, and doing so in a way that’s not degrading to the other…But there’s no spark, and there doesn’t seem to be time enough to maintain US in between maintaining our Identities, kids, work, and grief for the dead.

Fidelity doesn’t appear to be an issue…but I can’t say that would always be the case. There’s a sexual void due to the medication that certainly doesn’t help things. The Zoloft keeps her functional, but it doesn’t do much for her libido. She’s regaining her self-image after losing the weight from the kids, and gets an ego boost from being noticed. I’ve been working out for the last 7 years and am just becoming aware that other people find me attractive. (Never was when I was a teenager).

So. You have two emotionally spent people. 19 tons of baggage. They are unable to meet each other’s needs. How the hell do you go on from here if both seem to want to make the marriage work?

2

Counseling. Get counseling. Right away!

3

Well, I won’t lie to you and tell you that I saved my marriage.

But I think you can save yours mostly because you both want to. I think the most important thing to do at this point is not make any major decisions when you’re still dealing with the grief of losing three family members in one year. That’s quite a load to take and you’re going to need some time to get through that.

Couples therapy can help. It seems to me, without getting too simplistic, that maybe you both just need a different perspective on your marriage. There are small ways to make time for the two of you. I think a therapist might be able to help you see those things that you might be missing because your attention is focused elsewhere.

It’s good that she has her outlets and you have yours now maybe you need a shared hobby or passion.

Try not to be tempted to enter into an extramarital affair. The rush of an illicit affair can be a delicious counterpoint to the grief/numbness you’re dealing with but ultimately it will be damaging and regrettable.

Good luck.

4

If you both really, honestly want to make it work, you can. If one or both of you aren’t sincere in wanting to make it work, nothing will fix it. Couples therapy could help you cut through some of the bullshit and facilitate better communication but it will take a lot of work for both of you.

Good luck. It’s definitely possible.

5

I feel like we’re both on the same page and both truely want to make things work out. I say that because there was a period of time where she spun off and started doing things that were, perhaps, not the safest thing to do. During that time, we were NOT communicating. Towards the end of that period of time, we had a pretty big blowup and during that arguement…started really talking to each other again. You could tell it was like letting the air out of an over pumped baloon. The Stress seemed to go out of the situation.

We’ve been pretty good about talking since then…even when it’s something we don’t want to say or hear. I think a big problem is the tendency to dwell and worry over the bad stuff while easily ignoring the good. A pretty typical depression behavior.

I don’t know if we’ll go the counselling route. We’ve done a session or two seperately, but at the time, her feelings were still too strong over our loss of my Dad. It was emotionally draining and I don’t think she wants to go through that again.

Me, I’m just concerned that something I do or don’t do will contribute to this going away. It’s more a confidence thing. If it’s saveable, I don’t want to f*ck it up by worrying it to death.

6

BINGO! This saved the marriage I’ve shared with Razorette for nearly 35 years now. Our first real smashup came about ten years ago, and it took more than a year of constant “marriage therapy” to get all the dents knocked out. The thing is, you have to WANT the marriage to work. In our case, we’d been through so much together that we were reluctant to just walk away from each other. The first thing that happened in therapy was that we discovered we really did love each other, and we were worth salvaging. You owe it to yourselves to at least take this step.

7

I second (or third or fourth) the recommendation for counselling.

I wonder if it might help refresh the “spark” for you to start “courting” your wife. Make her fall in love with you all over again. Start asking her out on “dates”, sending her flowers or other little gifts (doesn’t have to be something you spent money on-- making her a card out of construction paper may mean more to her) and generally pursuing her just like you did when you first met. Make her feel like she’s the hottest thing on two legs (which some women yearn for after kids and a battle with mood disorders.)

Be inventive. Be creative. I know it will be difficult with all of your time constraints and the issues that you’re facing, but in this sort of thing, little gestures mean a lot. How much time would it really take to hide a love note in a place she’s sure to find it while you’re gone? Call her up in the middle of the day and say you were just thinking about [happy or funny memory] and wanted to tell her that you love her. Ot may be worth a try.

8

I can empathize with this feeling very strongly. There was a time when things were sort of hanging in balance and the only thing positive was that we both were pretty sure we wanted to save the marriage. It passed, with talking and work and I think just somewhat the passage of time and some of the stresses receding into the distance. But that was the worst feeling. What if I make it crash because of my anxiety? What if I drive it into the gutter? But it didn’t happen. Deep breaths and keep doing the things you can to make things better. I like Lissa’s advice a lot.

I called Mum at some point during that period and talked about how it felt, and she said she and Dad had a few times when things felt like that during their 27 year marriage. (Which ended, but not before its time, and not before they had a lot of good years.) So I guess you’re probably not alone in that boat, for what it’s worth.

9

Well. I’m reluctant to give out much detail in this matter, so my story will be vague. I apologize in advance.

My wife & I had problems for the first 3 - 4 years we were married. The kinds of problems with life-altering consequences. The kinds of problems that result in ugly, nasty divorces. But, we came to our senses and decided we wanted our marriage to work.

We didn’t go to counseling. We sat down & told each other over & over again “I want this to work.” We told each other a lot of other things too - we can both be mean & spiteful. There was a lot of yelling & fighting & crying & occasionally throwing stuff for a year or so. But neither of us was willing to walk away.

We were both committed to making it work, and I think our sheer stubborness is what saved us. In the end, it got better. Not magically, not without a lot of work, and certainly not without a lot of doubt. But it did get better, and we’ll be celebrating our 12th year this May. I don’t have any specific advice for you, I just wanted to let you know my marriage lasted, against the odds.

Good luck to you & Mrs. Blank

10

I want to second this, especially in light of your comment that she’s struggling to regain self-confidence and shed the baby weight, and that it makes her feel good to be noticed (of course it does!). It goes a huge distance in bringing the fire back to my loins to know my Mr. is thinking about me (and particularly thinking about me in adult-type ways :wink: ). Tiny things mean a lot.
It’s still true that you should treat people how you want to be treated, and I find that when we act like we are madly-in-love newlyweds we feel that way, too. It might not be the solution to your problem, but I’d be very willing to bet that it’ll help loads.

Edit: emphasis added to quote

11

Counseling. And you sound like the perfect couple to respond well. If she’s depressed, I’d recommend some individual Cognitive Behavioral Therapy for her too–but couples as well. I can tell in your post how much you love her and are committed to her. If she has even 1/8 of that level of commitment you have a really good shot at making it.

My husband and I got through a really tough spot with the aid of couples’ therapy (before the marriage.) It only took 6 months mostly because we just loved each other so damned much we could not stand things ever getting that bad ever again, and the way we hurt one another. We were both very willing to change our behavior–it definitely takes that–willingness to take the time.

Really, I think you both need to see someone, and fast, because your situation is exactly the kind that is most likely to be helped with some guidance from a professional.

Good luck,
Olives

12

Bolding mine.

Ot may be worth a try. If Og can’t smash some sense into the two of you, maybe Ot can caress it into the two of you kids.

…not funny? Wrong time? I’ll be slinking away now…

13

Naw, just right.

I’m going to run this thread past her tonight. Your experiences have done a LOT to improve my spirits. I suspect we could get by without the counselling if absolutly necessary (it really depends on her at this point…her experiences haven’t been that great with it in the past. Too much ‘How do you feel?’ ‘Why do you feel that way?’ ‘What makes you think that’s the case?’)

14

A good couples therapist won’t do that. They are there to facilitate the conversation and stop you from talking over each other and keep you from going off track. When you have a prospective therapist, call him or her and have a brief phone conversation. They should tell you their style and you can get a general comfort level from them.

15

Avoid this at all costs. Especially if she decides to go for individual therapy. Cognitive Behavior Therapy is much more no-nonsense than this approach and has way more evidence to support that it works than the style in question (psychodynamic.) All therapies are not created equal.

16

Erm. I’m gonna buck the trend, here.

Define “save”.

Whaddaya want, hearts and flowers and sexy lingerie? What does she want, an always-on-call pool boy?

If you answered “no” to either of those questions you’re both liars.

When I look at long-lived marriages (and when I say “long-lived” I mean 50 years, not 5), here’s what I see:

I’m not trying to discount the counseling suggestions, but before you even go that route it would be useful to figure out what, exactly, it is that you want to “save”.

17

Neither of you must give in to the thought that ‘the marriage’ is in trouble. You are both worn out. Of course you haven’t much energy for each other or anything else. I totally agree with counselling (I like John Gottman’s ideas or you could even go get a book like Dr. Phil’s Relationship Rescue which a lot of people like.

But don’t expect miracles. You’ve had a hell of a time and it will take a while for you both to be hale and hearty again. As for sex, again, it’s absolutely not about lack of love - you need energy for sex and us wimmens are sooo affected by things emotional and stressful. It’s kind of crazy, how fragile libido in a woman can be. It’s crazy-making, too, and no doubt your wife isn’t overjoyed about it.
Really, make Rosie Palmer your friend (I hope your wife doesn’t mind that) until you are both back in good form. Don’t take it as rejection.
Right now you’re two wet noodles made droopy by a lot of stuff - and if you can strike two wet noodles together and get a ‘spark’ then you’d be a miracle worker.

You both need to be patient. This, too, shall pass and you’ll be able to grow together, happy that you weathered a bad storm.

18

My parents’ “couples therapy” was this Catholic group, Teams of Our Lady:

US page

UK page

Australasia page

While the Bible is one of their main tools and they require being part of a group (which can, among other things, serve as an occasional sounding board), a lot of the “individual” and “couple” steps can be used by anybody. Things like setting aside individual time and couple time; never go to bed mad at the other; yell if you need to but if you do need to you need even more to find out what is causing that need and uproot it; tell each other “I love you”; always finish conversations on a positive note (if you can’t think of anything ‘more relevant’, “I love you” is always relevant). Sounds trite? Maybe, but perhaps it is because some of those truths have been told so many times they’re just overused and need a good shining!

Trivial, if Mom had bought any sexy lingerie, Dad would have called the Bishopry…

19

We’ve been religious in the past (a great deal of my growing up was colored by Methodist, Protestant or Catholic influences in church and school.) About the LAST thing my wife is feeling now is spiritual. She feels let down that so much of her life has been allowed to be taken away by God. Lets just say they’re not on speaking terms and leave it at that.

"Whaddaya want, hearts and flowers and sexy lingerie? What does she want, an always-on-call pool boy?

If you answered “no” to either of those questions you’re both liars."

I can answer this in two ways: Who WOULDN’T want a new fling? Who DOESN’T miss their misspent youth? Recognizing it is one thing, expecting to get it back is another. Thinking you can bail on responsibility for a fleeting thing is stupid.

Honestly though, we had a few minutes at the end of the day last night that were pretty nice. We don’t yell at each other much, neither of us are particularly schrewish.

Want to take away a sound bite? It feels like I’m the one doing all the home-life stuff, and she’s the one who’s extremely driven…won’t stop won’t stop won’t stop till she falls down. But the drive is towards work, and a couple of her hobbies. My problem is: At the end of the day, when work’s done, kids are bedded, details of the hobby handled, there’s not enough time to maintain the relationship we both want.

We’ve both discussed this and she’s doing a good job of managing the time lately, and I’m doing the best I can not to let my neuroses stir things up. Things in both our heads are pretty messed up and the time spent individually getting better (on top of life’s other responsibilities) means not much time is spent getting together as a couple.

To look at it clinically: I’d say the relationship is on life support, and could go on indefinitely like that, but it wouldn’t take much to wake up one morning and thing ‘now why am I still with him? We have nothing in common, we do nothing together…’

20

I’m intensely curious…what is this hobby that has so captured her heart and her time?