The trial of the young immigrant that was slayn in NYC by four police officers is currently taking place in Albany, NY. I was outraged by this abuse of police power when it happened and that outrage remains with me today. I can’t help but wonder the outcome of this case. However, this specific case is not my only debate.
My ex-SO’s brother is an officer in NYC, my sister’s SO is an officer,as is his father, in a metro NJ area. My last BF was a corrections officer. I’ve seen first hand “The Blue Wall of Silence.” It exists and it is horrendous.
Got a family member that is on a force? Well hey, guess what, you get a nifty little card that allows you to speed, illegally park, and break, oh, I’m sorry, bend, lots of laws that were put in place to protect the safety and morality of our society. Ok, granted, you’re not gonna get away with murder, that perk is usually only granted to famous football players, toss in a cop here and there along the way for good measure. Happen to have a badge yourself? Wow, how about a night of motorist beating, broomstick weilding and target practice on unarmed men? Don’t worry about it, you got the handy-dandy ‘Get Out of Jail Free’ card. Christ.
It just disgusts me that this kind of behavior continues in this grand country of ours. I know not all cops,judges, whatever, partake in these monstrosities, nor do they turn a blind eye. I salute them. I admire them. Justice should be just that. The men and women put in place to protect and to serve, unbiasedly, should do just that.
Always be ready to speak your mind and a base man will avoid you.
-William Blake
I, too, have seen many cases where seemingly obviously guilty officers of some sort get away with monstrosities. Fortunately (unfortunately in this case) the principle of “innocent until proven guilty”, “just cause” and “reasonable doubt” are in place in our legal system. With this kind of protection in place, many more people get away with crimes than they normally would. But, I believe in these principles and give the judges and juries who follow them credit. Something to consider also is the fact that officers are many times placed in very difficult ethical situations in which they have to react with speed and don’t have time for a philosophical debate like we do here. I am not familiar with this particualr case, can you post a link please? With four officers against one though, it would seem like it could have been resolved more peacefully. It definitely takes incredible moral fibre to be an ethical officer of the law and many of our officers just don’t have this.
And look what they let Judge Judy get away with… Sheesh!
"Every one is bound to bear patiently the results of his own example. "
-Phædrus
There was a case a few months ago in Rhode Island (I think), where a man was not hired by the police department because he was considered too intelligent. His I.Q. was 120.
I and the people I hang out with would not consider 120 an especially high I.Q.; but granted it is higher than the national average.
Although I’ve never been arrested or had any “trouble with the law”, I admit I don’t have a high opinion of the police. Sorry if I’m stepping on people’s toes, but most cops I’ve met are the type of people who would say, “Alls I know is…”
Personally, I’d like to have intelligent human beings policing the city I live in; not someone who’s on a power trip and digs the job because he likes to carry a gun.
[Note: The hyperbole is for effect; not to start a fight.]
Wait a minute, four cops fired 41 times? That’s an average of more than ten bullets per cop! How many bullets in the clip of a NYC police firearm, anyway? Less than ten, I would suspect, even if they’re not revolvers. Doesn’t his mean that at least one of those cops emptied his gun into the guy, stopped, reloaded, and commenced firing again?! Given that the guy was unarmed, this seems a little…um ,“extreme” doesn’t seem to quite cover it.
I think the primary goal of “law enforcement” officers is to raise revenue as opposed to public safety.
Just how many crimes are there going on at any one time? Enough to justify the swelling numbers of cops at every level? Probably not, so they have to raise revenue.
Those are just opinions. I have no evidence for them, but would be very interested in finding out at whatever level, just how often cops get involved for “public safety” purposes, and how often they are just out raising revenue.
Yeah, cops can buy higher-capacity magazines than we proles can. For example, I own a Sig Pro, for which I have two 10-round magazines. There are 12 or 13 round magazines available (depending upon the caliber of your ammo) only for law enforcement.
Makes you proud to be an American.
About the IQ thing: their reasoning almost makes sense. They claimed, if I recall correctly, that a brighter person would get bored with the work more easily. Still, I say, if he wants to do the work, let him on; there should be a floor, not a ceiling.
Read here for the LAPD Rampart Division scandal. If that story whets your appetite, do a search and read more stories about this. Here’s the opening paragraph:
And there may be even more convictions overturned in the future.
Ok, corrupt cops is a Bad Thing, not much of a debate there.
So how the hell do you go about building a police force that’s not corrupt ?
It’s a rotten job in most respects - the hours suck, the pay is low, and you meet a LOT of people who’d rather you weren’t there. You’ll get lied to all day, you’ll get assaulted sooner or later, and you’ll see a lot of people you KNOW broke the law walk on a technicality.
It’s a recipe for fortress mentality. I’ve met a lot of cops - trained with them, been commanded by them - and a lot of them really have a “them-and-us” mentality. Either you are a colleague (sp?) or you’re one of “the other guys” - whether you’re an axe murderer or an upstanding citizen doesn’t really make that much of a difference, as long as you’re not a cop, they can’t really be bothered.
FWIW, the police officers I’ve met have NOT been corrupt (that I knew off), haven’t let people they knew (me, for instance - grrrr!) off the hook for minor violations and have followed whatever rules they had to. But they still had this “them-and-us” way of thinking, and it can’t be good.
I guess most would agree that every society needs a police force. But does anybody have a constructive idea as to how you get a good one ? In other words, how do we hire the people that WANT to be “protectors of the law” ?
Norman.
Worrying is the thinking man’s form of meditation.
On the magazines: A few years ago magazines (“clips”) were limited to 10 rounds for civilians. You can still buy high-capacity magazines that were manufactured before the ban, but they are expensive. For example, a 30-rd. AR-15 mag used to go for about $6, used. Now the same mag will cost about $40-$50.
Police forces have dropped the six-round .38 calibre revolvers in favour of 9mm semi-automatic pistols that have a capacity of 15 rounds. The idea is to be armed with the same firepower as a criminal.
Personally I think that the NY case is murder. NY has virtually banned handgun ownership, therefore there is virtually no chance that a criminal will have a gun. Thus, there was no “probable cause” that the man was armed and the cops ventilated him anyway. Either that, or “gun control” is a crock o’ shit.
Come on folks! Some of you are making generalizations about a group of people based upon anecdotal evidence.
If one of us were making the same kind of generalizations and doing the same kind of stereotyping about say…blacks…there would be an outcry on this board.
There are good cops and there are bad cops. Just as there are good doctors and bad doctors, good attorneys and bad attorneys, good politicians and bad politicians, good moderators and bad moderators. I’m quite sure that the “good” ones vastly outnumber the “bad” ones. Sure, we hear the stories about the bad ones and far too few stories about the good ones…isn’t that the way it really is?
I think they’re making generalizations about the bad cops, not cops in general. Nobody in this thread said there weren’t any good cops.
However, I do believe there are more corrupt, asshole cops than there are assholes in the general populace. I have a couple theories about this :
The intelligence factor - It’s abusurd that they won’t let a smart person become a cop. 120 or thereabouts is the cutoff? Sheesh! I’d venture a guess that most of the people who post to this board will never become cops, except of course for (insert favorite troll or arch-rival poster here).
The Power factor - Many who become cops do so because they want to have power over people. The most picked-on kid (besides me) in my school went on to become a cop.
Solutions? Study officers’ performance and weed out the power-hungry. They’re nothing but trouble. Let the smart guys in. So what if some of them quit? It’ll be worth it to keep the ones who don’t. Any cop who steals, frames someone, or commits any other heinous crime should be immediately subject to criminial prosecution and permanent disbarrment from law enforcement. This should go without saying, but you’d be surprised how many cops do this stuff and just get suspended for a couple days, or even have nothing at all happen.
Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous. If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion.
–Writer Ron Hubbard in 1949 who later founded the Church of Scientology
For years, NYC cops were really good guys. Heck, The ramones did benefits for them to get Bulletproof Vests back in the early '80s.
When LA was going nuts, New York was sedate. Sure there were bad cops, but not the massive amounts of bullshit that helped spark LA and other cities.
This is all about what happens when you get a fascist mayor - the police department turns into a bunch of thugs!
Everyone I know in NYC hates what a lot of the police force has become since Der Mayor cam into view. This case, while an eggregious example of this, is only too telling.
The Internet Elves have been busy. Yesterday, that link worked perfectly. Today, I try it and not only does the link not go to that article, the pages look different than they did yesterday. If you want to read the corruption scandal, click on that link and then have their search engine look for either Rampart or Rafael Perez. You’ll get a lot of stories including today’s story entitled “Rampart Settlements Could Hit $125 Million”. That’s another reason to stop police brutality and violation of civil rights: The huge settlements. That’s YOUR tax money going to help these wronged individuals and their families.
Someone once said, “Freedom isn’t free,” but I don’t think that’s what he or she meant.
