DeSoto, TX Waffle House Armed robber with AK-47 shot by customer who was legally carrying a concealed handgun
DGU with one robber on life support. Police seeking assistance to identify him
In other news, UPDATED: Home invasion suspect killed today
DGU with one death. The characterization of a “warning shot” is by the police, though the elderly resident may have thought it better to describe it that way. Generally warning shots are a terrible idea.
Does the end justify the means? I can’t believe the stupidity of someone armed with a handgun who would pursue a criminal with an AK-47 as he was leaving the scene of the crime. This crosses a line. The robber was no longer an immediate threat and any threat to the man’s wife was imagined–she wasn’t even there. That sounds to me like an excuse from a guy itching to be a hero. The robber had left the restaurant and was in the parking lot, presumably to make his getaway.
I have to admit this is my thought as well. Following the guy out was foolish and reckless. Shooting the robber while still in the restaurant would have been completely justified, but following him out after the threat had (mostly) passed is very questionable.
Shooting him in a room full of people, or out on the street.
A Bad Guy was killed. Good job.
If I was a good guy with a gun, and I saw a guy in the street getting shot in the back, what is the appropriate action?
If he is getting shot, hide, you have no information and no need get into it.
If you just think he might get shot, be sure to look first to see if both have weapons. If so, hide.Get your phone out and video what is happening.
If I was in the cafe and I thought the guy might come back and there were too many people around for a gun fight, I would go after him outside if I felt a gun fight needed to happen right now.
If I am reading about this after the fact, I would refrain from giving opinions on what others were thinking during the event that they were at and I wasn’t.. I don’t want anybody to think they know what I think, what I would do or think that I will just stand by.
But that is just me.
When someone needs killin, it does not make any difference to me which way he is facing. In my house or in the street. But again, that is just me.
So a guy walking down the street with an AK-47 who you know just robbed a restaurant and several patrons is not a threat? Is it unreasonable to believe he may be a danger? And how long must patrons cower in fear?
Use of deadly force is justified in defending yourself or others. Others. Like anyone this violent criminal might come upon… like the wife of the customer who had just been robbed. The wife who was reportedly on her way to the restaurant.
And when the patron went outside the robbed pointed his AK-47 at the patron. Use of deadly force to defend your own life is justified.
I definitely agree there. But the question remains - why did he follow the guy out of the restaurant? And you can be sure that question will come up if there is a civil trial where the robber’s family asks for millions of dollars in damages. And, no, I’m not saying everything you do should be prefaced with thoughts of civil damages, but it is pertinent in this instance. I wouldn’t cast a guilty verdict in either a criminal or civil trial, but following the guy out of the restaurant and yelling to him MAY go beyond self defense to a lot of people.
IANAL. But, could his defense be that he was attempting to effect a citizen’s arrest?
In either case, an armed citizen pursuing an armed criminal *leaving *the scene of a crime is Wild West vigilantism. I have never heard of police simply walking up and confronting an armed suspect. The article says only, “The customer called out to the robber, who turned and pointed the rifle at him, police said.” We don’t know what he said, or where he stood as he said it. We do know that he aggressively placed himself in danger after the immediate threat had passed.
The article said the citizen was not arrested, so apparently he needs no defense. (Defense of stupidity masquerading as bravery is another story.) It seems that he could have legally made a citizen’s arrest (PDF file); the criteria in this case for a citizen’s arrest were clearly met (does not constitute unreasonable search and seizure, felony, and committed in the presence of the citizen), but it is not clear that is what he was actually attempting to do.
Like I said, the end doesn’t justify the means. “Bad guy dead. Good.” is not how our law enforcement system works.
I can see that one guy is shooting and the other isn’t. I sure don’t want to make a mistake and have him shoot others. That would make me a sheeple.
Texas has civil immunity in cases of self defense so the shooter should be covered unless the DA determines the shooting wasn’t justified and obtains a conviction.
I wouldn’t recommend pursuing a person in that circumstance myself, but the fact pattern may dictate other action. The article doesn’t give more information to make a different determination but it certainly does not say that the AK-47 wielder was shot in the back. It presents the necessary conditions for lethal self defense.
In other news, Man skipped sentencing, now faces murder charge
DGU with one death. 3 vs what appears to be 1 and the one prevailed. Looks like one of the robbers would have been better off serving a sentence for assault rather than than a murder charge. Why a person convicted of a felony assault is out on bail is beyond me.
Nah, caution makes you old. Lack of thinking stops that progression.
Getting shot is not ‘about to get shot.’ :rolleyes:
I don’t get into it until I can see if the living guy is a good guy or a bad guy, how far away he is, what weapon I am carrying right then and other things that to me indicate I need to go fast slowly in determining whither I get involved.
Oh, he is an off duty cop, oh he is a mad crazy killer, it is someplace in-between, oh their are obvious civilians just past the two involved in the shooting right in my line of fire… Yeah, I don’t need to get into it. 
Once I decide to get into it and actually kill someone over it, then the gun comes out and I try real hard to get/be behind the one I am going to shot and then shoot until he quits wiggling, reload and get to a safe place to wait for the cops or be able to defend myself from the bad guys friends that are now pouring out of that place with (oh my God, assault rifles with cop killer bullets special made for piercing armor. ) and this is gonna get bad real quick, I really should have just stayed out out of it because I did not think it through. :smack:
I get in a lot of trouble when I turn my brain off and then I pull out my weapon. I am trying to get better.
The only name calling that I listen to is from me to me.
So far, no one, not even me has ever called me ‘sheeple.’
In other news, Man holds would-be burglar at gunpoint
DGU with no injuries. Burglar brought a pole to a gun fight. I like the description, “convinced the man”. Another very good neighbor.
Dammit Bone, almost exactly what I was going to post!
Wayne LaPierre blows off his pecker while cleaning his six-shooter.
- Just wish’in. Hey! You asked…
This is a warning for threadshitting. I am not going to assume you read the entire thread and ignored the previous instructions but you should know that responding to a thread just to dump on the premise is being a jerk.
I can’t tell from the video if the bad guy’s finger was outside the trigger guard. I guess the clerk thought so. Otherwise he wouldn’t have grabbed the barrel. Still seems like a very risky move.
It’s is a positive gun story. Bad guy flees. No shots fired. The robber put innocent customers and the clerk at risk.