Random Mafia

The Game Room
1341

Wait, you think Drain and I are likely Scum and yet you want to work out a voting block to with us to vote for yet another person?

Really?

PS. I think we have different ways of answering cases. While you take the stance of, I’m innocent and I’ll prove it by showing how I could be framed, I tend to look at it as finding different conclusions for the same set of facts.

Here’s a brief summary of the strong points in the case against you. I should have made my case brief previously.

  1. You voted for Rysto when it was very obvious that Iredigger had Scum reasons for claiming and Rysto didn’t. It was pointed out repeatedly and you ignored it.

  2. You demanded a 3rd mason to claim despite the discussion about how anti-Town and superfluous that was.

  3. You’ve cast votes with weak reasoning (the object of the vote isn’t important). Scum often feel forced to vote and come up with weak reasoning (see Oredigger earlier)

Add to this:

  1. You’ve stated that you think Drain and Ed are Scum, yet you tried to create a voting block with them in the thread.
1342

To answer your somewhat out-of-game questions, Meeko, everyone has bad games. I’m one of those people who is driven mostly by gut and get it right relatively frequently, but it’s somewhat useless because people rarely go along with my cases (because they’re often weak, especially early in the game) and the Scum can use that as an impetus to start a bandwagon against me. Not sure which is worse, really. What I’d advise you to do is leave emotion at the door. Realize that people are going to suspect you, and those people’s motivations may be pure and they may not be. Make cases based on reasoning and not on hunches. Ask yourself “What would I want a player on my team to do here?” and then do it. I say “on my team,” of course, because you could be Town or you could be Scum here, and either way your goal is for your team to win. Specific roles, of course, have different strategies, but in general, a VT’s goal is to ask questions, provoke response, and get nightkilled. :wink:

1343

At this point, I think people should give their current thoughts on the remaining players. I mean, I know I have to evaluate things carefully; I’ve been focusing on Tom a lot the last few Days, and now he’s dead, I am moving on to my next suspicions.

Right now, I suspect Meeko the most. Mainly, his weird choice to not vote Oredigger. I know it would be stupid to not vote Oredigger, especially if it draws attention to another scum, but I think Meeko might have done that to hope we would think that(yes, this heads toward WIFOM). Having said this, I think Meeko is good enough to do something like that.

Our player list looks like this and I’ll give thoughts on what I’m thinking:

special ed - I think ed is playing quite well and I suspect he is town.
Red Skeezix - No read at all. I have no deep thoughts on Red.
Meeko - Top suspect for me right now.
Cookies - Very little read right now. Hard to say.
Rysto - Again, little to say. He does seem to be playing pro-town, though.
Drain Bead - Weak cases a bit, but not hugely pinging me right now.

Mahaloth - That’s me! :slight_smile:

Anyway, perhaps that’s not so useful since I don’t have thoughts on some. However, I definitely want to get my thoughts out there for everyone and I suggest others do the same.

1344

Not sure how to address Ed’s rehashed arguments that I already addressed.

Ed, I’m town. If Red is scum, and we can vote him, why wouldn’t we? Your vote would count the same against Red, even if you are his scum mate, right? Stranger things have happened in this game.

Again, I wish I had the words you had on things. To your first half, I am pretty much “” This. “” yet sub Meeko for Drain Bread. Obviously.

The latter is … interesting space for you to play in. I mean, doesn’t help your case.

1345

I can see why you included Rysto in there, but why include someone with a confirmable role? Cookies is our only confirmed Town player, so why include her as if she’s unconfirmed?

1346

Ah, of course. My bad!

1347

The latter part is very true, and something I think you’ve never wrapped your head around.

Scum are going to kill a Town player each Night. It’s better that they kill a Vanilla.

1348

I think what Meeko is saying is specific to me in this game–I am a claimed Vanilla, and I’m not dead yet, so clearly I have not accomplished my goals.

1349

Does this post scream Scum! to anyone else?

First off, a trust list where just about everyone is trusted or neutral except for the leading lynch candidate.

Second, it seems to ignore almost everything that’s gone on in the game. It’s almost just a post to have a post. The only actual point made is that Drain has had some weak cases.

Third, It completely ignores that claims made and such.

In fact, there’s no substance whatsoever to this post. I see strong Scum motivation. It snuggles everyone except for Meeko.

I’d like to adjust my thoughts. Meeko and Mahaloth are Scum. Maybe someone else.

1350

:smack:

oh, of course

1351

And, for the record, here is what I think about the remaining players

special ed - He’s Town
Red Skeezix - This is a tough one. I didn’t like the defense of Meeko, but I don’t recall much more. This will require some research.
Meeko - Scum, see previous case
Cookies - Mason.
Rysto - Doctor
Drain Bead - I was probably wrong in the case I built previously. She’s playing a Town game at this point.
Mahaloth - Scum, see recent post

1352

Since we’re doing lists, here’s my list:

Meeko - Pretty Scummy, wanting to vote in a block with people he believes are scum

Mahaloth - I was reading him as town up until that post. He was pretty much single tracking Tom Scud as we saw. Could have been both trying to gain credit after the other one’s demise. Oredigger and Alka played this game during cecil pond. I need to read and think about his play this game more.

Special Ed: I always have trouble deciding with him. He’s aggressive, and seems jump a lot both as town and as scum. He’s pushed hard on meeko several times this game, but I don’t think he’d risk a meltdown like C3. So IMO, they’re not both scum and Meeko looks scummier.

Drain: Pretty Scummy. Here’s why: Every time I read drain’s posts from after the Tom lynch, I keep getting a hard sell vibe on the meeko lynch. The one post where drain compares cookies claiming with meeko’s claiming from cecil pond, really strikes me as trying to generate some sort of false/forced perception of events. On top of all this there’s seems to be a lot of places where Drain’s actions are ambiguous enough to go either way.

I’ve run into the problem that I think everyone in the not at all confirmed pool, with the exception of myself, has at least the tinge of scum, so I’m going to vote on who I think has been most scummy. That’s meeko, his rysto vote really does not make sense from any standpoint that could reasonably be called town.

vote Meeko

1353

VooooOOOOOoooooOOOOOOOOOoote CoooooooOOOOOooount:*

Meeko (3) - Voted by: special ed 1322, Drain Bead 1326, Red Skeezix 1352
**
Drain Bead (1)** - Voted by: Meeko 1327

*I’m a ghost, remember? Get it? HA!

1354

I think Drain and Freudian did this in Colorless as well.

1355

I’m in the weeds on Meeko. My gut tells me the case against him is wrong, but if it were any other player I’d probably be voting for him right now.

Mahaloth and his oversight as to my confirmedness would be very sloppy scum play. It also look like it could be the play of a Townie who’s just not invested or paying close attention, which would suck, but not as bad as mislynching him.

I’m going to have to look over Ed, Drain, and Red in greater detail.

1356

On the third hand, playing the distracted and apathetic Townie would be a viable scum play.

So Vote Mahaloth while I go re-read Ed, Drain, and Red.

1357

I’m Vanilla.*

Did that clear anything up? No?

Darn, thought that would work.

I can understand “It is vanillia’s job to die”.

I can barely understand it from a VT.

I can understand it a LOT better from a scum, who would take the guise of a VT.

Again, there are MANY things our group does that is self defeating.

No town player should be THAT excited that "Yay! we lost another VT!"

I mean, it just seems like scum carving out a “Safe” VT attitude.

**Better yet, if you always say it, in previous games, when you have been VT, better for you to claim it again in next games when you are Scum. **
Drain, I’m not the best at picking stuff up, the further they get away from being blunt.

However :

I am a claimed Vanilla, and I’m not dead yet, so clearly I have not accomplished my goals.

I think,** I just think I can eke out sarcasm here.** Your sugar coating on this, your, embellishment of sarcasm doesn’t help.

Do you need the added “cute” to be the spoonful of sugar for the scum medicine?

If I can draw the sarcastic angle to it’s conclusion :

Yes. I don’t think you have accomplished your goals.

But don’t worry, looks like my wagon is here at last.

I will see you at the end of the game, would appear I have a first class, non-stop ticket to it.

*** If my claim didn’t clear anything up, perhaps Drain’s claim should be met with the same disdain. **

Not going to fight this one, beyond telling you that I speak the truth. If I die, it might as well be my funeral, but it would be the (rest) of town’s loss more than my own.

1358

Red: Explain “block” when you mean “vote in a block”. **I don’t see an alternative here. **

Town has numbers, town’s most common, arguably most reliable kill [with obvious exceptions] is the vote.

What is the better play for town?

Oh, but you said block voting with “Scum”.

That changes… nothing.

Town gets things wrong. Town doesn’t know who is, and who is not Scum. If Town can’t form wagons I don’t see how they can win.

If you would like to to call a wagon “block voting”, so be it. **Rinse lather repeat my entire argument. ** Re-run from start, GOTO 10.

**
If your vote on me boils down the fact that I took the road less traveled by then I deserve to die. And apparently, Town EVER getting out of it’s reccently slump deserves to die as well. **

Opportunistic move from Red here. By any other name,.

1359

Hrm. Not sure what to think of ed at this point. Is it Scum snuggling me, or are we having a Town moment where the OMGUS haze has lifted? If it’s truly OMGUS, then we have the last Scum, in Meeko, Skeezix, and Mahaloth, all of whom have done things that were more Scummy than ed has been recently.

And Meeko, you’re missing a fine distinction here. It’s not Vanilla’s job to die. It’s Vanilla’s job to be nightkilled* by Scum. Look at it this way–the Scum are going to kill someone every Night, barring intervention. And we want that someone to be a VT, rather than a power role. Naturally, due to sheer numbers and attrition due to roleclaims, endgame is pretty much always gonna be a bunch of unconfirmed VT and Scum. We’re actually doing well in that we still have a Mason and (ostensibly, not confirmed by a blocked kill but also not counterclaimed) Doc left over.

If we do well toDay and nab Scum, toNight’s WIFOM game will make or break us, I think. If we can get through toNight without a kill, we wake up with two confirmed Town and three unconfirmed to choose from. Town should then vote with our confirmeds in a bloc.

1360

I hate not being able to edit in this game, so my retarded coding errors are there for the world to see.