This topic was automatically opened after 10 minutes.
Yes.
- You’re trying to make conversation with the purpose of getting to know me, and I’m trying to read. Or
- If you’re not trying to make conversation with me, then don’t ask what I’m reading.
But you can read anywhere.
People who are looking to date complain about having to use the apps, so they want to meet someone “in the wild” so they go out to places and hopefully a conversation develops. I’m not sure everyone is going to be able to distinguish which people want to be approached and which do not.
I’m sure there’s a lot of grey area but someone reading a book almost certainly doesn’t want to be interrupted.
Not my problem. I’ll read wherever I like. Maybe I won’t mind the intrusion, maybe I will, but DD asked if it was pestering, and it is.
By interrupting someone reading to ask them what they’re reading?
If I want to be approached, I’ll probably be glancing up as people go by, catching their eye, smiling at them. And seeing if they respond. Not barging up to ask what they’re reading.
Only two people are allowed to interrupt while My Beloved is reading: The author of that particular book, and Mercedes Lackey.
I don’t want to come off too harshly - I’m not going to be pissed off if someone wants to see if I might like to have a conversation. But an interruption is an interruption.
There is a 3. there, but okay , thanks for your answer.
Yeah.
If you want to discuss the book or the author- briefly - like “Have you read xxxxx by that author, I loved it?” Or “I like mysteries , do you recommend that author?” I am happy to oblige. But not to start a general conversation about life, politics or the weather. But I am answering only for me.
There is no 3 there. If you wish to learn more about the book, ask some who’s actually finished the book, or look online. Don’t use it as an excuse to interrupt me.
You (and I) don’t have the issue where they are pretending to like the book just to get in your pants.
hid off topic post. WE?
True today for sure, but in my youth,…
In a thread about women dealing with potentially dangerous men, you’re cracking jokes about what a hottie you used to be??? Why are you even in this thread?
Moderating
I’m just going to ask @DrDeth to leave off posting to this thread now. Hijack complete. No more.
To all: no more about the book scenario, it was tangential to this thread at best.
For me I think I’m halfway decent at picking up on why someone is talking to me. The creepers give off a vibe.
Every woman is going to have a different response, but I don’t have a problem with people being friendly. I don’t have a problem with being approached for conversation. I also live in the Midwest where strangers are pretty friendly to each other, but not as much as where I grew up in a rural part of Michigan.
Once I ran out of gas on a highway in the middle of winter. I was 17. A guy pulled up and offered to give me a ride to the gas station. Because of my training in general safety I declined. He took no offense. He drove away and returned 15 minutes later with a full can of gas. That’s the kind of culture I grew up in.
Like someone else upthread I don’t think I’ve ever been particularly attractive. If it happened all the time I’d probably have a different answer.
I mentioned in the previous thread that I grew up with a sister and two step sisters and I have more close friends who are women than men. I’ve heard enough horrible stories that my immediate answer was “bear”.
The anecdote above reminded me of one of my own. Several years ago I was at the gas station and saw a young woman in tears. I asked her if everything was ok and she told me that she was totally out of gas and her card was declined and she had no cash. I handed her $10 and told her to pay it forward and walked away. I didn’t want her to get the least bit nervous or creeped out. I always give a wide berth when walking faster than a woman and am about to pass her.
That’s enough virtue signaling for me for now but I’m very sympathetic.
Through my own personal experiences, I’m very cautious around men in situations where I am alone and help is not readily available. A few of the personal experiences:
-
The father of a childhood friend who molested me when I was around 6. Not the worst molest, but no mistaking what it was.
-
A neighbor who was a cop, invited me on a ride-along when I was around 12 and spent the entire time trying to grope me. I clung to his partner, who seemed to know what was up but didn’t actively try to stop the behavior. He did act as a buffer, at least.
-
A man who nearly raped me in my own home one night when he came looking for the boyfriend of an ex roommate. I firmly believe it was only my own indignation and fierceness at his actions that got him to back off and leave. And I was lucky.
-
Two date rapes.
-
Many years working in the field of criminal justice and seeing how many ghastly ways men can and do abuse women.
So as a result, I avoid putting myself in situations where a man could gain an advantage.
I will read alone in a coffee shop and I don’t mind if someone interrupts me to see if I’m interested in striking up a conversation. It’s a public place and I don’t automatically ascribe motives to people making an approach. They might really be interested in what I’m reading or they may be interested in getting to know me. Either way, I don’t find a single approach bothersome. If they persist after I’ve made it clear I want to be left alone, then that’s a different matter.
As for how comfortable or safe I generally feel “out there,” I’m probably hyper-aware. Don’t get me wrong. I love men and have enjoyed them all my life. I’ve dated too many to count, lived with several and married two. But our society does a poor job of validating women and their experiences and an even poorer job of protecting the victimized. Give me the bear every time. They’re far more predictable.
I assumed it must be a man who would purposely obfuscate the question with this reframing, and was surprised it was not (although I was less surprised when I saw who the author of the OpEd was).
You’re right that it completely changes the question (intentionally so). This turns it into a question of statistics and risk mitigation strategies, rather than a discussion of what women face. The former conversation is much easier for people, especially men. The latter is uncomfortable and forces us to confront our failings as a society.
This phrasing is important, and helps me think about what troubles me about so much of the conversation around the question.
We are, as a society, really bad at thinking about things on a societal level.
A lot of men are responding to this question by saying, in effect, “You would choose the bear? But I’m a man, and I’m not dangerous!” And a lot of women are responding by saying, in effect, “We’d choose the bear! You’re a man, and if you don’t like it, it’s your own damn fault!” and nobody is listening to anyone else, because both of those are shit framings that miss the essential issue, which is that we need to be thinking about it–men, women, everyone else–on a societal level.
What can we change, as a culture, so that women don’t feel this way? And then how can each of us as individuals contribute to that change?
Sure, if you’re a creeper dude, your change is pretty obvious, but you’re probably not open to suggestions from me. But what if you’re not a creeper dude–what can you do to help make the changes that we need?
It’s a much trickier conversation, but it’s the one that is, IMO, worth having.
I agree with this and, unfortunately and IMHO, the bear-woods-man thing is a red-herring disguised as a clever analogy; it has no real relevance in the real world. The choice between man vs bear is essentially meaningless, especially when the choice really is “can I go out by myself to the local club and just sit and enjoy the musicians’ skills without getting constantly pestered, or do I have to stay home, or can I rustle up some friends as buffers? Because FFS, just once I would like to do that without every man and his dog hitting on me.”