Rush Limbaugh and drugs

[Tuckerfan]

@black rabbit

You haven’t?

Really?

Clearly SA’s not been paying attention. Just plugging Oxycotin into Google News yields 1,300+ results for the past month, with the majority of the links being crime related.

[Little_Nemo]

No, my opinion of an addict (as opposed to whether or not they are an addict) is based upon the harm they do to themselves (and their husbands, wives, children, etc.) and the risk they pose to the rest of society. I haven’t heard of too many Oxycontin users becoming dealers so as to afford their own habit. I haven’t heard of them breaking into houses for loot to pawn or drugging their children with Nyquil so they can go off and perform blow jobs at truck stops for meth money.

Then what’s your point? Heroin and cocaine and meth should be illegal because they’re against the law? People are addicted to drugs. If they’re well connected and the drug they’re addicted to is marginally legal, they don’t rob houses or turn tricks. If they’re poor and they’re addicted to something that’s illegal, they start breaking laws. Criminalizing drug addiction just turns drug addicts into criminals.

[11811]

@Starving Artist

I haven’t heard of too many Oxycontin users becoming dealers so as to afford their own habit. I haven’t heard of them breaking into houses for loot to pawn or drugging their children with Nyquil so they can go off and perform blow jobs at truck stops for meth money.

:rolleyes:

Now it’s coming to the rest of America. In three months, 14 Boston-area pharmacies have been robbed, while Philadelphia, Kansas City, and Milwaukee have also seen heists. The lure is the drug’s potency - as much as 16 times more powerful than similar painkillers on the market.

Not everyone addicted to Oxycontin is in the upper crust, and those that aren’t will do what they have to in order to support their habit.

Rush may have been one of the lucky ones in that he didn’t have to go to outlaw dealers (just unethical doctors) to get his fix, and his money didn’t enter the illegal underground economy and support other crimes. Yet he is still an addict. And all addicts should be treated the same.

[Squink]

@11811

his money didn’t enter the illegal underground economy and support other crimes.

Just what do unethical doctors spend their ill gotten booty on?

[Merijeek]

@Squink

Just what do unethical doctors spend their ill gotten booty on?

Campaign contributions. Surely enough people around here have read Starving Fruitbat’s posts to know that all things are forgiven if there’s a (r) after their name.

-Joe

[Typo_Negative]

At one time or another, we all probably thought we were above the gutter junkie. Having held that opinion once myself, I can’t really point a finger at Rush.

I hope that he understands now.

[Wee_Bairn]

@askeptic

Why are you so concerned about why someone gets hooked? What fuckin difference does it make? An addict is an addict and they should all be treated with compassion. You do realize that some people can try oxycontin on a whim and never do it again and some people can do coke recreationally without problems and others can do it once and destroy their lives. It is not a matter of morals or will power.

Because this addict makes it a point to blast other addicts every chance he gets- he spent weeks mocking Kurt Cobain. So if he’s your garden variety pill popper and not a victim, then he’s a hypocrite, that is my only point. If he loves his oxycontin, good for him, but don’t blast those who like similar street drugs, and think you’re any different or better becasue you buy yours from KVS and not some guy.

[ArizonaTeach]

@Maureen

This much is true, at least. Had he gone further and had his stomach stapled or a lap band performed, he’d probably have helped his back a lot more. Not to mention shortening his dependency time on ineffective pain killers

I’m not sure what your implication here as, as he had lost a lot of weight years prior to these events.

And with you being a nurse, I’m a little shocked that you would suggest a procedure like that for someone for whom obesity isn’t an issue.

[Qadgop_the_Mercotan]

@Starving Artist

I haven’t heard of too many Oxycontin users becoming dealers so as to afford their own habit. I haven’t heard of them breaking into houses for loot to pawn or drugging their children with Nyquil so they can go off and perform blow jobs at truck stops for meth money.

Well, I sure have. Many of them are my patients. The prisons are loaded with them. Plenty of women have prostituted themselves for another oxy. So have plenty of men.

Plenty of them ‘doctor shop’ or get their prescriptions from multiple physicians, not telling their doctors that other doctors are supplying them, too. This sort of thing is both immoral and illegal. And it’s also what Rush was accused of doing.

So consider yourself more educated on the subject of addiction now.

Oxycontin is the new heroin, and is just as, if not more, devastating, since it is available by prescription.

An addict is an addict is an addict. I know, because I am one, too (thankfully recovering for a fair while now).

[elucidator]

@Qadgop the Mercotan

… I know, because I am one, too (thankfully recovering for a fair while now).

Good for you! Yaaaaaay, Qadgop!

[wring]

@Qadgop the Mercotan

Well, I sure have. Many of them are my patients. The prisons are loaded with them. Plenty of women have prostituted themselves for another oxy. So have plenty of men.

ding ding ding ding.

Too many people (RUsh and Starving Artist included) have this sort of dichomtomy going on , like there’s ‘good addicts’ and ‘bad addicts’. Drunks are notorious for this, since their drug of choice, too, is legal. Reminds me of those who will have symapthy for HIV victims who got infected in a socially acceptable way.

From working w/convicts on the outside, I see lots of addicts. Doesn’t much matter what they’re addicted to.

[DoctorJ]

I think it’s silly and more than a little disingenuous to equate people who have become addicted to painkillers (usually as the result of surgery or some physical malady) with people who are stung out on meth, heroin, cocaine, etc. This practice usually occurs primarily, in my observation, with people who are politically opposed to the ‘drug addict’ in question.

And given that one rarely hears of people addicted to pain meds becoming prostitutes or drug dealers or breaking into houses or offering to sell their children in order to obtain the medications they’ve become addicted to, I think it’s both reasonable and understandable for them to be critical of…and lobby for the incarceration of…people whose drug use leads to that type of lifestyle.

I haven’t heard of too many Oxycontin users becoming dealers so as to afford their own habit. I haven’t heard of them breaking into houses for loot to pawn or drugging their children with Nyquil so they can go off and perform blow jobs at truck stops for meth money.

Wow. Let me introduce you to a little place called eastern Kentucky. We coined the term “hillbilly heroin”. I’m not exaggerating when I say that prescription painkillers have had an effect on our region very similar to the effect crack cocaine has had on the inner cities. Their underground traffic has a significant effect on our economy. Every day I hear the kinds of stories you say you never hear.

I also support treatment rather than incarceration, at least for first offenders who are motivated to get better. But let’s not act like it’s a totally separate problem from other illicit drug use.

[11811]

@Merijeek

Campaign contributions. Surely enough people around here have read Starving Fruitbat’s posts to know that all things are forgiven if there’s a (r) after their name.

-Joe

Thank you. I didn’t mean to understate Limbo’s crime. I did mean to state that he probably comforts himself with the delusion that his money didn’t go to “bad people.”

[F.U.Shakespeare]

I had friends and relatives who were in denial about Elvis Presley’s drug addiction for decades. A standard part of this denial was to ratchet up criticism of ‘real’ drug addicts. Elvis, my friends claimed, had a problem with prescription medicines, but he wasn’t a drug addict, like those marijuana smokers.

There’s a great bootleg of Elvis talking to the audience at a Las Vegas concert where he confronts rumors by claiming he’s “never been strung out in (his) life – except on music!”, and promises to break the “goddamn neck” of the “son of a bitch” who started the rumors.

In addition to Cobain, Rush also joked about Jerry Garcia’s death. When I heard about Rush’s addiction, such intentional cruelty made a little more sense.

Rush is not a drug addict. And Larry Craig isn’t gay.

[Tuckerfan]

@11811

Thank you. I didn’t mean to understate Limbo’s crime. I did mean to state that he probably comforts himself with the delusion that his money didn’t go to “bad people.”

Actually, he probably doesn’t think of where his money goes at all.

[Really_Not_All_That_Bright]

SA, if you hang around a pharmacy for a few hours you’ll shut the fuck up about how people hooked on prescription meds aren’t dangerous to themselves or others.

People exhibiting drug-seeking behavior are every bit as desperate as the crackhead outside. When I was a pharmacy tech people with prescriptions for control drugs (and people without them, too) tried all sorts of ways to get me and/or the pharmacist to give them a refill early. Offers of money, sexual favors (once from a mother with her preteen kids standing behind her), and threats. We’d get at least one drug-seek type a day; they were always easy to spot, too. The people who wanted their Vicodin a day early usually really were going on vacation; the people who wanted it three weeks early, not so much.

[Starving_Artist]

There’s a hell of a lot of conclusion-jumping and biased attitudes on display around here with regard to my stance on this issue, so let me try to clear up a few things:

1. I’m not a fan of, nor am I a defender of, Rush Limbaugh. Like many others, I was turned off to him initially when his t.v. show 'accidentally" (but with chuckles) made fun of the appearance of thirteen-year-old Chelsea Clinton. Subsequent to that time I’ve come to care for him even less, and now view him as many of you do: a puffed-up, self-important and mean-spirited blowhard.

2. My initial post was intended to illustrate to the OP how it is that people like him (and in this case me as well) can come to view heroin, cocaine and meth use to be much more harmful to both the addict and society at large than dependency on pain-killers. IOW, it wasn’t intended to defend Limbaugh; it was intended to show how reasonable people of good will - of which I consider myself one - could come to feel that imprisonment may be appropriate in the case of this type of drug use as opposed to abuse of pain-killers.

3. I am not scornful of drug addicts as people though I can certainly be scornful of some of the things that they do. As I said, I’ve had occasion to know several people with this problem in the past. I spent a great deal of time, money, effort and understanding support in trying to help them deal with the problems caused by their addictions. Some of these were people I cared a great deal about, and a few of them have looked me up subsequent to their getting clean to let me know they turned out okay. Some others have not been so fortunate. They will all tell you they got nothing from me but patience, understanding, forgiveness and whatever help and support I was able to offer. To automatically assume that I’m hateful toward or harbor punitive lust for these types of people simply illustrates your own ignorance, because nothing could be further from the truth and the people who truly know me know that. The vast majority of the ignorance, bias and stereotyping displayed in this thread is not mine, I’m afraid.

4. I am extremely scornful of people who deal in drugs and who entice others to use it and supply it to them for financial gain. I am also scornful of the element that exists in the drug world who thinks it’s cool, or badass, or whatever, to be robbing people in parking lots, breaking into houses, or getting women hooked on drugs in order to pimp them out. These are the people I would like to see punished.

5. It is apparent (with thanks to Qadgop, DoctorJ and the other posters who were correct in this regard for the education) that I have underestimated how widespread is the abuse of pain-killers and the consequences thereof. My ignorance has at least been reduced in this regard. I do still think that pain-killer abuse, as a percentage of the overall drug problem that exists in this country, is still a relatively minor one.

And, as I alluded to earlier and which has nothing to do with classism or who has money, I still contend that people who are hooked on heroin, cocaine and/or meth pose a greater danger to society than do people hooked on pain-killers. Be honest, who would you rather have living next door to you: a couple of crankheads with their coterie of friends, or someone hooked on Oxycontin and bouncing from doctor to doctor to obtain their prescriptions illegally?

I anticipate examples of pain-killer abusers who do all sort of awful things…and I’m sure some of them do…but it’s going to have to take some pretty hard evidence for me to convince me that, in the main and at their current numbers, people who are addicted to pain-killers pose anywhere near the threat to society that meth/heroin/cocaine users pose.

6. Really Not All That Bright, I never said people hooked on prescription meds aren’t dangerous to themselves or others. Merijeek (“Surely enough people around here have read Starving Fruitbat’s posts to know that all things are forgiven if there’s a ® after their name”), it’s interesting to know that you apparently regard disdain for drug use to be a Republican trait. Little Nemo (“Then what’s your point? Heroin and cocaine and meth should be illegal because they’re against the law?”) I don’t even know what you mean by this. Perhaps you should calm down. askeptic (“Starving Artist will defend all things conservative but the fact is Rush is a pill popping hypocritical addict.”) I didn’t defend Rush, I attempted to explain the dichotomy that exists among people who are addicted to pain-killers but still have disdain for street drug use. Maureen - pffft, I’m not even gonna bother. Your posts are so full of bigoted misinterpretations and erroneous conclusion-jumping that I’m not even gonna take the time to refute them. Besides, adequate refutation of most of them are already contained in this post.

7. It is obvious that many of the posters in thread have reacted to how they perceive me politically rather than to the things I’ve actually said. It would do well on this board allegedly devoted to fighting ignorance if fewer people were so eager to demonstrate it.

[DMC]

@Starving Artist

I am also scornful of the element that exists in the drug world who thinks it’s cool, or badass, or whatever, to be robbing people in parking lots, breaking into houses, or getting women hooked on drugs in order to pimp them out. These are the people I would like to see punished.

Even if all drug use was legal, we still have laws to deal with robbery, breaking and entering, and pimping. That’s not what your argument has been. There are coke users who have never stolen a dime, and Oxy users who have committed multiple crimes to support their habit. For some reason, you seem to think that we’d choose which is acceptable based on the political leanings of the two addicts, and you certainly seem to think that the cocaine user above is the dangerous one.

That’s a pretty fucked up take on things.

[Starving_Artist]

@DMC

Even if all drug use was legal, we still have laws to deal with robbery, breaking and entering, and pimping. That’s not what your argument has been. There are coke users who have never stolen a dime, and Oxy users who have committed multiple crimes to support their habit. For some reason, you seem to think that we’d choose which is acceptable based on the political leanings of the two addicts, and you certainly seem to think that the cocaine user above is the dangerous one.

That’s a pretty fucked up take on things.

:: sigh ::

It has nothing to do with politics! Did you actually read my post or just skim it?

It also has nothing to do with the odd Oxy user who commited a crime or the odd coke user who didn’t. The exception doesn’t prove the rule, and unless convincing data would appear so as to indicate that pain-killer abusers commit just as much criminal mischief as street-drug users do, I will continue to be of the opinion that more damage is done, and more danger is presented to society, by street drug users.

Further, we obviously have laws dealing with robbery, B&E, and pimping. I was responding to the opinion of some of this thread’s posters that I’m gung-ho to punish drug users, which isn’t the case except in the instances you quoted above.

(If it makes you feel any better, I would view cocaine users as being being the most benign in terms of street-drug induced miscreant behavior.)

[DMC]

@Starving Artist

It has nothing to do with politics! Did you actually read my post or just skim it?

Of course I read your post. That’s where I got it from. Remember saying this?

@Starving Artist

I think it’s silly and more than a little disingenuous to equate people who have become addicted to painkillers (usually as the result of surgery or some physical malady) with people who are stung out on meth, heroin, cocaine, etc. This practice usually occurs primarily, in my observation, with people who are politically opposed to the ‘drug addict’ in question.

It also has nothing to do with the odd Oxy user who commited a crime or the odd coke user who didn’t. The exception doesn’t prove the rule, and unless convincing data would appear so as to indicate that pain-killer abusers commit just as much criminal mischief as street-drug users do, I will continue to be of the opinion that more damage is done, and more danger is presented to society, by street drug users.

You’re the one who was saying it was okay for lobbying for incarceration for someone whose choice of drug leads to a specific lifestyle.

Further, we obviously have laws dealing with robbery, B&E, and pimping. I was responding to the opinion of some of this thread’s posters that I’m gung-ho to punish drug users, which isn’t the case except in the instances you quoted above.

I’m all for punishing people who break into houses, but I could give a rat’s ass whether they do it because they need money for Oxy, coke, or new curtains for their living room. Rush wanted to imprison drug abusers, not drug abusers who break and enter. Rush IS a drug abuser. Rush doesn’t think he should be imprisoned. Rush IS a hypocrite. See how this works?

(If it makes you feel any better, I would view cocaine users as being being the most benign in terms of street-drug induced miscreant behavior.)

Unlike crack, perhaps? Why would that make me feel any better? Again, I don’t differentiate between the types of drugs that someone is addicted to. There are heroin users who commit no crimes, other than the possession and injection of heroin. There are meth users whose only crime is meth possession and consumption. They are NO different in my book than Rush Limbaugh. If he wants their ass in jail, then he needs to open the door for them from the inside.