I’m on the fence about the sack penalty. I love the concept of basing it on 6 yards lost regardless, but I found Jules’ point about how it should be losing 6 passing yards pretty compelling. However, I also found compelling Beef’s point that a 6 yard sack is much more harmful than a 6 yard pass is good. So I’ll be happy with either of the proposed settings.
I’m pretty strongly against 0.5 PPR, but wouldn’t consider it the worst thing in the world.
I’m for whichever defensive options are closer to the keeper league settings. That means I’m against safeties being worth 4. Points is points, IMO, and since they’re worth 2 on the field I like them to be worth 2 in fantasy. It would be wrong to me if they were anywhere near the value of a TD.
I don’t see a logical need to have the actual scoring value of a play in fantasy to be the same as its real world score. It feels natural when it works out best that way - but the movement from 6 points per passing TD to 4 improved the game.
Safeties are pretty hard to achieve by the defense and usually require outstanding special teams/defensive plays to achieve, so I’d like to reward them more than a more common play.
We’ve got 4 days until the draft, by the way, so please get some more opinions in on the potential scoring changes since I want to rule by consensus. The discussion isn’t only limited to the proposals I outlined - I’m fine with other suggestions - but I’d at least like you weigh in on the specific numbered proposals in post 39.
Come on guys, the fun of playing in a league with the same people from year to year is that you get to know people better before crushing them brutally. I created this league to ideally be the highest skill/participation league on the boards… and while everyone has done well with attending drafts, setting rosters, etc. there’s been a lack of discussion, smack talk, trade offers, and generally all participation outside of the day to day activities of the league.
So are return TDs, but I’d be against them being worth more than 6 for the same reason I’m against safeties being worth more than 2. Not a huge deal either way, though.
I can respect that, it’s consistent. I disagree, since whatever other scores we add to the system are arbitrary and so I don’t see a need to attach specific point values to correlate to the actual score. It does create awkwardness sometimes, when, for example, I’d like to increase defensive scoring in general, but 3 points for fumble recs/ints while still having safeties locked at 2 seems wrong.
This is my issue. I don’t care what the score for safeties ends up, I just want it to be justified versus the fumble recs/ints score. Rather all three be 2 than see safeties undervalued to fumble recs/ints.
There’s still time for trading picks if anyone is interested. Since Kid_A hasn’t responded to my offer, I’m interested from moving from my spot (#4) in the first round to 6-10 somewhere. Anyone interested in the pick? PM me.
You guys make an excellent point on the relative values of safeties vs turnovers. I don’t see how it matters either way in practice, though, because safeties are uber-rare and even if we made them worth 10 points they wouldn’t impact FF much at all. I recognize that safeties are undervalued in fantasy; part of what makes them so valuable in the NFL is that you get the ball back after a score, which is unheard of otherwise. That doesn’t help you in fantasy.
As I (hopefully) said already, in the end I don’t much care either way.
Sorry, I haven’t been able to keep track of anything this year, just haven’t had the time. I was finally able to give this thread a thorough read tonight, and it looks like you are looking for answers to the above, so:
Oppose, but not at all strongly.
Don’t care. I think .35 is probably more balanced, but as long as we set it before the draft, .5 isn’t exactly radical and is still relatively balanced.
Don’t care.
In favor.
Very in favor.
In favor, but not strongly.
Support but probably not in conjunction with all of the above - like Jules I think we should keep going too overboard on the defenses
I’m particularly concerned in that defenses are (seem to be?) more luck-based than anything this side of kickers, in terms of which are the best from year to year.
Am I allowed to go two weeks into the past and bitch about the 11th pick? No? Okay, I guess I can live with it if I have to.
Alright, I’m going to leave the discussion of scoring changes open for the rest of the day (and hopefully others will chime in) and enact the settings tomorrow based on the consensus. We draft on Monday.
I’m giving Ellis Dee the #4, #117, and #141 picks for the #2, #167, and #170 picks.
That’s me moving up 2 spots in the first round, in exchange for him turning his 14th rounder into a 10th rounder and his 15th rounder into a 12th rounder.
He gets the better value out of the deal (to the tune of an equivelant to a 12th round pick), but it’s not unreasonable. I assume there are no objections.
There’s a chance my guy would’ve been there at #4, but there’s a decent dropoff between the top 3 on my list and the 4th, so I was willing to give up value to make sure I get one of my top 3. I tried to trade with Kid_A to get the #3 spot but he never responded to my e-mail.
If any of you want to work out trades, you can… just be quick about it.
I like all your proposals, except the raising of the sack points against the QB (It could be a stupid reason, but I feel then you are also drafting an O-line along with your QB).
Change the sack penalty from -.33 to -.4. It slightly increases the penalty (but not nearly as much as I proposed) and makes it an even number. Since Jules Andre/Ellis Dee mentioned the .05 increments thing, the .33 has been bugging me. This is a sort of consensus - some of us support increasing the penalty, most want to keep it the same - so bumping it up just a little bit seems reasonable.
Change PPR value from .35 to .5 - seems to be liked by almost everyone
Do not change individual return yard points - not a very strong consensus for changing it.
Do not change kicker penalties - not much support for it.
Make safeties worth 4 points to a DST - seems strongly supported by most.
Change defensive scoring from 15/10/6/3/0/-5/-10 to 16/11/7/3/-1/-6/-11 - this is a relatively minor change that also ups the negative penalty for bad defenses - I would guess that the average defense score doesn’t change much at all from this change but it gives a slight boost to the best points allowed defenses.
Don’t change fum/int scores (remain at 2) - people weren’t as enthusiastic as me about making defenses a bigger factor.
Number 7 is a much bigger proposal than either 5 or 6, so by approving 5 and 6 but rejecting 7 we haven’t given the defenses much more power at all.
Does this seem like a reasonable plan? Does anyone object to any of that?
I don’t suspect the safety thing will make much difference, it was more of a philosophical thing to do for me.
I agree with you in wanting stronger defenses, but int/fum to 3 is a pretty substantial change to defenses - for a change like that I’d like to see a stronger consensus and less ardent opposition, which I don’t feel like we have. Defenses in our league are already substantially stronger than standard.
The other thing I forgot - and since it’s probably too late to debate it, and it’s also a pretty small issue - is that I’d like to move blocked kicks to 3 points. I’m sure that’d make an average of like .3 points per year more for DSTs though so it’s not like it’s a big issue.