As a male, I find that the current reporting of “Sexual Assault” to be somewhat confusing. It is not the reporting itself, instead I find the discussions and dialog and accusations and admissions suffer from the limited vocabulary of the single term “Sexual Assault”. It appears to me that the term is being used as a catch-all for any occurrence in a spectrum from full on violent rape to someone placing ones hand on someone’s back.
This is unhelpful.
I believe the new openness in reporting these occurrences and calling out the perpetrators is a positive, and will result in a new environment with less unwelcome behavior in the future. But I also believe we need to expand our vocabulary in talking about the behaviors so that we can better adjust our day to day interactions and separate out the truly horrendous acts and actors.
I see the reaction of some men currently that they are afraid to be in a room alone with a female, or offer a hug, etc. (threads aplenty on SDMB) for fear of being accused of “Sexual Assault”. I would suggest that part of the fear is that by being labeled, they would be lumped in with the real monsters.
It appears that the terminology is a stumbling block for some to admit their behavior. They might say, “Oh, yes, I did what you said I did. But don’t use that term!” (Sorta like those guys who say “Oh, yes, I have sex with men, but don’t call me gay.”)
I’m not asking that we attempt to come up with a vocabulary, only to discuss the usefulness of an expanded vocabulary.
I don’t want to come off as if the world has to comport itself to my standards of behaviour in the workplace, but could you explain to me what possible combination of events (short of some kind of tragedy) would lead a man to hug his fellow female co-worker.
Also, it seems naive to suggest that events perceived by women who report workplace harassment are solely based on unwanted physical contact and are entirely void of any kind of suggestive comments or related behaviour leading up to the contact.
Why do we need to expand the vocabulary beyond, ‘Treat people with respect and keep your fucking hands to yourself’?
Sexual assault has a weight to it. Calling it anything suggests that maybe it “wasn’t that bad”, and potentially minimizes that victim-survivors pain - “At least you weren’t raped.” is something I heard at least a million times about one incident. That is ridiculous.
Woman comes back from maternity after being out for months. Congratulations! It’s great to have you back! She opens her arms, you open your arms, and a hug happens.
People are still humans in the workplace and become friends and are happy to see each other. Humans are a social species, we greet each other by touching (shaking hands) and may express stronger emotions by touching as well.
You had just asked how would it come to pass that someone would hug someone else at work. Your point about her initiating strikes me as sexist, though. I think your second point is better - people know, or should know, when it’s ok and not ok. As you and I discussed in the other thread, practically no one is surprised when someone gets in trouble for harassment.
I suspect the issue the OP is talking about is that presently grabbing someones ass (bad) falls into the same category as violently raping someone (very, very bad).
For example, the Wiki on sexual assault says:
Note, one of these things is not like the others.
I think Quicksilver got it, in that groping generally ought to fall under harassment.
However, I don’t think suggesting that we should leave it to the woman to initiate as a rule is sexist. Given the history and overwhelming evidence for men being the aggressors, it’s for the best that men err on the side of chivalry. Especially so in the professional settings where there hasn’t exactly been a long standing tradition of equality.
Now you come to mention it, I do wonder what I’m supposed to call the various occasions when women at work touch me without permission.
What is it called when one of them squeezes my knee under the table in a meeting?
What is it called when one of them strokes my back, and runs her hands down to touch my arse?
What is it called when one of them punches me in the arm (or kicks me in the leg) every time I say something she disagrees with?
Other people’s reactions - and the attitudes of society at large - have told me that I have no grounds for complaint, because women being physical with men is socially acceptable, but I can’t help that these things make me feel very uncomfortable. I haven’t invited, let alone initiated any of these actions, and I have tried to make it clear that I’m not comfortable with them, but people just laugh in a manner that suggests I’m being ridiculous when I ask them not to touch me. I get the distinct impression that making any more of a fuss would result in my becoming a total pariah.
Edit: Probably worth mentioning that, despite my online name implying otherwise, I am generally regarded as male in RL.
I think in common parlance people use sexual assault to differentiate it from rape. Rape is a type of sexual assault, but when someone is accused of rape, we use the term “rape”.
Are you comfortable putting grabbing someone’s breasts in the same category as leaving pornography on their desk or telling them “Hey, do you like to suck dick? You look like a girl who loves cock?”. Because I think physical assault is a whole different thing.
ETA: and any term we come up with that includes physical touching will include rape: it’s the nature of a broader term.
Please be specific. All the media accounts of sexual assault I’ve seen have been of unwanted physical contact of a sexual nature. Most have not been of rape, and when the accusation was of rape, the media use the word “rape”.
There is clearly specific behavior that most people are calling sexual assault that you do not think rises to the level of sexual assault. Please identify that behavior.
I think that for far too long we’ve minimized sexual assault with terms like “handsy” or “wandered” or “groped”. So I’m wary of the idea that we need to go back in that direction.
Saying goodnight after a night of drinking. Seeing a co-worker that you used to work with at another office when you move to a different office or when they move to your office. Lots of situations where you hug people AFAICT.
Still there are a few lines in the sand, right? Touching someone on the hand or arm is probably not the same as grabbing them by ass or boobs.
And you would impose the same consequences on someone who places their hand on your shoulder and someone who grabs you by the pussy?
Social situations have more flexible rules but I’d still err on the side of keeping your mitts off co-workers. If your professional relationship blossoms into a friendship, adjust behavior accordingly. Most reasonable people understand these things in due course of living in society.
Not the same, but I still don’t see why you need to touch.
Not the same consequences, but the same rules apply.
What does any of that have to do with things we are calling sexual assault?
It’s like the OP is saying “We need a different name for “drunk driving”. There’s a level of driving while drinking that’s non-criminal and it shouldn’t be lumped in with driving sloshed, and certainly not with vehicular homicide”.
And y’all are all over here “What about driving when you are really really tired? That can be bad too. But how tired is too tired? How could someone know?”.
