The story that emerged in the press says that the person pictured wearing the prosthesis and wig is a man. Is that part of what you’re confirming?
Precisely which limited set of facts did you confirm? The only description you’ve given of the set of facts you’re confirming is that they’re “the story”.
Chronos, I have really, really clearly stated this several times; the pictures and video are authentically of a teacher at Oakville Trafalgar High School, who identifies as a woman. (Her name is apparently Kayla Lemieux, in case anyone cares, but that I didn’t personally look into, so I cannot vouch for it.) This has to be the fifth time I’ve typed this. Please read the thread.
That may be the case, I don’t know, but even so, that would not be REPORTING. That would be “guessing.”
I have seen many, many people online claim Michelle Obama is secretly a man and that her daughters are… adopted, or stolen, or something. I have seen many more people make that claim than I can count; I have also seen people claim Queen Elizabeth II was a reptile person. That doesn’t mean those things were “reported.” It means people make shit up online.
So in other words, the story isn’t verified, because “the story” said things that you’re contradicting. Or at least, part of the story isn’t verified.
Precisely which parts of the story are verified, and what is the verification of them?
Not sure what I contradicted, but ok.
I typed what I confirmed in the post you replied to.
OK, and what is the verification of them? If it’s an official statement by someone, can you link to that statement? If it’s word of mouth from someone who knows, how does that person know, and what exactly did they say?
As I have typed in many posts in this thread - I am honestly perplexed how you missed this - I know people who work in that school board, at least one of whom has been a colleague of the teacher in question for a number of years. I reached out to those people. They confirmed that the pictures and video are authentically of a teacher at Oakville Trafalgar High School, who identifies as a woman. That’s all I know.
Honestly, though, what I confirmed has been so extensively repeated by highly trustworthy news sources (and, one notices, not refuted by any real news source… which it very likely would have been by now if the story was bullshit) that at this point my local inquiries are redundant. It was also confirmed by a trustee of the school board (here, a “Trustee” is a member of an elected body that specifically runs the school board; they are elected in geographic districts, like a city council) who even went so far as to praise the teacher’s skills and reputation as a shop teacher. Again, just read the thread, it’s all here.
False.
You are not honestly perplexed. You are disingenuously perplexed at best.
No, really. I’ve just been saying the same thing, over and over. Can you explain what you find disingenuous?
Yes, you have been saying the same thing, over and over.
And people have repeatedly explained to you that what you are saying is unclear, and asking for clarification.
When you say something, and someone asks for more detail, and you say the exact same thing, you are not advancing the conversation.
When you do it, “Over and over,” in response to several posters including two moderators, you’re just being a dick.
How about you clarify what you verified and how you verified it without just repeating the exact same shit that has been insufficient for days on end?
I gave you an example of what a clarifying post might look like in post 532.
If you find yourself, “Saying the same thing, over and over,” try saying something different. Or, you could do what you did, and repeatedly pretend that giving the exact same information in response to requests for more information is an honest way to discuss anything.
And I think some of them are disingenuous, and some just not attentive. I’ve been unambiguously clear as to what I know and what I don’t. I have offered no more information because I have no more information to share.
I have been extremely clear as to what I verified. As to whether I send my acquaintances the link, who cares? I did, but does it matter if I copied a link in an email or called them on the phone? I don’t understand how that would enlighten you. The end result of the same; I confirmed the pictures and video are authentically of a teacher at Oakville Trafalgar High School, who identifies as a woman.
It was a weird story of the sort that is sometimes made up or misreported, and the first media source was a very right wing source, so I figured I’d get some local confirmation. As my confirmation has been effectively backed up by legitimate, trustworthy media sources, as well as a trustee of the HDSB, what exactly is the problem?
People really really wanted the story to be fake, or the person in question to be a right-wing troll. You have presented evidence that the pictures are of a real shop teacher. This angers them.
It’s not that anyone wants the story to be fake. It’s that the story is missing context. So it’s just a bizarre thing that didn’t make sense, and could mean lots of different things.
When you see a headline, “man bites dog”, you similarly want to know what the hell happened there.
It’s extremely weird that this story has no context. Since @RickJay is local, he might have heard some. Barring that, if he’s going to bother to confirm the story at all, he could have been explicit about what he was confirming. Not just, “the story is true”, when there are lots of slightly differing stories all fluttering around.
Exactly.
We’ve been taken in before with stories that turned out to be bullshit. When I made my first reply in this thread, I still had in mind the story about Trump being led off a plane in handcuffs (in reality he was off to a golfing trip). When you get a story with a lot of blanks, there’s a risk that you fill them in all wrong then waste a lot of energy discussing something that didn’t even happen.
I don’t see people who “want” it to be fake. They just don’t want to comment with unproven assumptions. At least, that’s the case with me.
If this is all true as portrayed by the initial story, that a trans woman shop teacher is going into class like this regularly, that’s an interesting discussion to have. And we’ve tentatively done so. But this isn’t a thread about a hypothetical. The OP and following comments want to discuss what it means as a real story, and you can’t do that without more facts.
This is preposterous. He can’t post anything more because he doesn’t know any more and you know it. All he has said is that the person in question is a shop teacher in the school who identifies as a woman. That’s it. That’s all he knows. He’s verified it with personal contacts (which I guess you don’t have to believe, but Rick’s been on the board for a while and he never struck me as a liar) and some stories in a local paper. Whatever else you want he is not going to be able to supply.
If all I know is that a man bit a dog, that’s all I can tell you. I can’t tell you why he bit the dog or anything else. Sometimes people only know limited details. I don’t know why this is a problem.
I stand by my original assessment.
Yet the motherfucker is playing a passive aggressive game saying that the story is verified.
And there’s a lot of potential nuance that’s lost here, too. Like, suppose that he heard from one person “Yes, there’s a transwoman teaching shop at that school”, and from another person “Yes, the person in that picture teaches shop at that school”. That could mean that “the story is verified”, i.e., that the person in the picture is trans. Or it could mean that there are two shop teachers in the school, and the cismale one is mocking the trans one by wearing this exaggerated get-up. Is that exactly what @RickJay was told? We don’t know, because he’s not telling us. Details matter.
No I am not confusing you with anyone else. I really don’t need to go any further than your entrenched belief that a mentally and neurologically healthy trans woman coming to work presenting in that manner as part of their preferred gender expression would not be an extraordinary claim, requiring extraordinary evidence.
Reality for trans gender individuals who are teachers is that a majority of them experience significant discrimination and harassment from their administrations and their co-workers, as do trans gender individuals in other work environments.
A mentally/neurologically healthy trans gender individual coming to work presenting as a grotesque caricature of their preferred gender as their means of gender expression, inviting even more abuse, is an extraordinary claim to anyone whose head is not filled with images of transgender people as scary deviants, to everyone who recognizes that just like cis people, trans people are mostly coming to work to get their jobs done as their authentic selves.
The article I cited explicitly states that few were of the community and named various alt-right group “personalities” that were in attendance, and a candidate for office in a different ward.
I did not read about the claim on Redddit but about it on a news source. At this point the claim has as much confirmation of its accuracy as the claim that the individual is someone who has been transitioning for several months or more. Which is to say that neither has been definitively confirmed as being the truth.
The first part has been confirmed. The second part is less verified (or if the degree of identification is as of that day and not the day before or the day after).
You are an anonymous source who by this point in the thread has proven themself to posses transphobic stereotypes, relaying alleged secondhand reports from alleged HDSB members that you happen to know. Why should anyone take that at face level more than a Reddit post? Having been part of large group organizations I don’t necessarily believe a district board member I was talking to directly was a reliable source, as often they are repeating what they’ve heard from someone who told them … and it is just bullshit misinformation all the way down. In contexts where the person should be in possession of information much more reliably than a member of a School Board I’ve heard stated as fact information that I had the first hand knowledge of, and knew was false. They had been misinformed but were very sure it was accurate. Information that was being presented as justification for major decisions.
I did not think it was impossible for Trump to have been arrested, but it was a story that I held as untrue unless extraordinary evidence was presented to the contrary. There have been physics reports like that too. Once in a long while when the dust settles the extraordinary evidence shows up and extraordinary claims are true. One of my kids once complained that one of his middle school teachers was crazy. I rolled my eyes at his blaming his teacher for his not understanding what assignments were. Then we had our parent teacher conference and she was in fact actively delusional, yet somehow was being allowed to work each day (she was soon on a leave of absence). Extraordinary claims can sometimes be true, and the nature of educational systems sometimes creates weirdness in managing teachers.
Again the reality here -
Whatever elements of this story are true and whatever elements are not, it is a story that got out of its local community only in service of the war on transgender people. There is no way @chela is honestly concerned about shop safety of a large breasted woman, or would be sharing this even in the case of a cis-woman augmenting herself surgically and presenting like that. (Although I wonder how a school board would or could deal with that circumstance.)
It is not possible to fail to see this as an extraordinary claim without holding existing transphobic stereotypes.
I give up. I knew I’d regret posting in this stupid thread and will withdraw. The Mystery of the Canadian Shop Teacher will remain forever unsolved. Humanity’s loss, I suppose.
@RickJay I’d advise you to bow out as well and let this thread die a much deserved death.
But you couldn’t resist sharing your deplorable pearls of wisdom, could you?
Jesus fuck! RickJay clarified what they had personally verified five-fucking-hundred posts ago.