I have a problem and would love to tap on the collective wisdom of Dopers… I will try to keep it short.
Nine years ago I got married to a wonderful woman who is of a different nationality, race and religion from me. She is my closest friend and the best thing in my life. However, for whatever reason, my family never took to her, particularly my mother. My mother and I had some serious fights in the early days over my wife, which led to us not speaking for about 2 years. We eventually began speaking again, and the relationship approached normality. However, my mother has never made any real effort to open up to my wife, and has never reciprocated the attempts my wife has made to improve things from her side (and has also brushed off attempts my inlaws have made to get to know my mother). In a nutshell, my mother is happy to have a good relationship with me (her 'beloved firstborn"), and sees no need to make much effort with my wife. My wife’s culture, however, places a lot of emphasis on close relationships with my family, and this consistent cold shoulder really upsets her. I must admit that I haven’t helped matters very much in that I tend to take the easy way out and seldom challenge my mother on her treatment of my wife…
However, in the few times when I have brought up issues, my mother’s attitude was basically why should she bother being nice? She has made it clear on several occasions that she doesn’t approve of my marriage to someone so different from us, and that she doesn’t like my wife at a personal level. She accuses my wife of manipulating me and of driving a wedge between son and family. She has also implied that my brothers feel the same way and has even once gone so far to say that she wouldn’t be unhappy if the marriage should someday break up. (I am truly amazed that my mother can say these sort of things and in the same breath say how much I mean to her…)
Anyway, to get toward my question, I want to know whether it is acceptable for families to express their dislike of a member’s spouse. I told my mother that I don’t appreciate those sort of comments and her response was that she is entitled to her opinion and that I shouldn’t try to change her. I do believe that everyone in entitled to their opinion, but do they have a right to express it?
My own personal view is that a family has a duty to respect a member’s choice of spouse and to make a sincere attempt to include them as part of the family. The fact that the member chose the spouse and that the spouse makes them happy is justification enough for them to be included. And to actively express criticism of the spouse to the family member just seems to be treachery.
What do other dopers think? After 7 years of putting up with this, I am close to the point of cutting ties with my mother off once and for all. It is not a choice I will take lightly.
Your family shouldn’t have the right to treat you and your spouse like that. You have chosen your partner and whether or not they approve, it’s your choice and not theirs.
Neither my mother nor I gets on particularly well with my brother’s wife but whenever we see her we’re polite and at least make the effort to carry on a civil conversation. She’s very difficult to talk to, has no conversation of her own and is an all round wet blanket…but she’s his wife and even if we think he could have chosen better, we just accept that that’s how she is.
I personally do not think it’s okay at all, except in extreme cases (physical abuse comes to mind) to criticize someone’s spouse. I mean, I have a brother-in-law who I’m not all that fond of, but he loves my sister and my nieces and they love him. Beyond that it’s not my place to butt in where I don’t belong. Your mother shouldn’t either. My heart goes out to your wife. She doesn’t deserve to be treated this way.
I have a question for you, Endemic. How did your mother treat past girlfriends? I guess what I’m wondering is if this behavior is only directed for your wife or if she’s one of those “no woman is good enough for my son, the angel” types of moms. I think you might just have to lay down the law with her and tell her that if she doesn’t accept your wife, she loses her relationship with you.
If your family genuinely thought that you were making a mistake, it would have been appropriate to express whatever concerns they had before the wedding. After the marriage has taken place, though, they need to accept it. They don’t have to suddenly become best friends with her, but they need to respect that you’re an adult who can make his own choice. It’s incredibly disrespectful-- to her and to you-- for them to insult your wife like that.
I am a strong believer in the adage that “you don’t just marry a man/woman, you marry his/her family.” Not that familial objections should be enough to prevent a marriage-- but it needs to be one of the many factors you consider. You family is forcing a choice between them and your wife. But in reality, that’s not a choice you have to make next week or next year; it’s a choice you already made, by marrying her in the first place over their objections. They need to understand that if they make this a fight, it’s one they’ve already lost.
It would be interesting to find out what your brothers really think, my technique would be to get each one on his own, liquor him up and moan about your mother’s attitude to your lass - the pretext of asking for advice should do.
You did not mention whether you have children, if not you could find that your mother’s attitude changes radically. One of my brothers landed up as an inadvertant father, my parents were rather annoyed, but his lass cannily turned up on the doorstep and shoved a very young baby into my mother’s arms.
Probably your mother is a very nasty bit of work, also you might be wise avoiding her.
Here I speak from bitter experience, I must confess that refusing to speak with her for the last two years has been quite a relief.
Unless your wife was truly doing something really unforgivable (such as abuse of you or your children, if you have any), your mother should keep her fat trap shut. I also think that, if your mother can’t be persuaded to keep her opinions to herself, you should feel free to cut her out of your life. When you get married, you, your spouse and your children are all that matters.
Pretty much what everyone else said.
I have 3 older sisters, and my now-deceased mom pretty much treated all of the in-laws as 2d-class citizens. Really bugged me when she would be critical of my wife - nothing really direct, but more subtle. When my wife said white, mom said black - even if she had said white herself just a moment before.
I told my wife to “consider the source” and not let it bother her, but easier said than done. It was tough, because my mom clearly loved me, but in my mind the choice was clear. Once my wife and I chose each other and started a family, that was my nucleus. And anyone - friends or family - who did not respect that choice/primacy, was quickly delegated to a secondary (or lower) role.
IMO, it is up to your mom to figure out how to deal with you and your wife. If she chooses not to, than it is she who is choosing to sever relations with you. I do not believe it practical for you to continue having close relations with your mom if your mom disses your wife. My friends and family don’t have to love my wife - toleration or peaceful coexistence are fine. But I will not tolerate them disrespecting her in my presence or to my knowledge.
Your mother is wrong. She doesn’t have to change her feelings (though she should…your wife sounds like she’s doing everything right) but she does have to change her behavior. If it were my sitch, I would tell her to FAKE IT if she can’t muster genuine affection toward her. I just don’t get it. My son has had a lot of girlfriends, and some of them were “not who I would have chosen” for him, but I treated them with warmth and respect, and guess what…I was able to find truly endearing things about each one of them.
I believe there is something good about nearly everyone. You have to make an effort to get to know people. You have to express a genuine interest in who they are. And most of all, you have to have faith in your ability to raise your children to embrace at least SOME of the things you do…after all, you are (hopefully) the strongest influence on the kind of person they grow up to be. If you did your job, your child should be attracted to many of the same qualities you look for in a person.
Well, for the most part she treated them OK, though I must say that we didn’t really have that much interaction (I was shy about bringing them home). There was one girlfried, also of a different race, who my mom did have a problem with (“Why can’t you find a nice white girl?”)
My mom also had a fairly antagonistic relationship with a former girlfriend of my youngest brother…
Yes, it could be a case of ‘no one is good enough’.
I should be forthcoming though and say that (for other reasons) I had already put some distance between myself and my family, and perhaps my mother transferred the blame for some of this to my wife (though really the distancing started long before I even met her)…
Wow, I don’t think I have ever seen the SDMB so unanimous about anything… Too bad it had to be about my mother! :rolleyes:
One of the arguments she has made in defense of criticizing my wife is that in a good family, people should be able to share everything. She then cites the example of my grandmother (her mom) criticising my dad when they were married and how she accepted it as her mother’s right to do so. I might add that my own parents divorced, as did my grandparents, so I am not sure how good a case that is…
Oh, and she also reminded me that her side of the family is Italian, and Italians are always dissing each other…
Not to be nosy, but I’m curious about what your wife’s race/religion is. Reading the OP I was honestly trying to guess you and your wife’s respective races, to try to get an idea on why there is friction. I assumed it was Asian family not liking their children with non-Asians. I totally imaginged you being Chinese-American and your wife being black, causing your family to have a huge meltdown about it.
Where is your father in this? Is he still alive and married to your mom? You mention distancing yourself from your family. Does this mean from your brothers, too? (No sisters I take it?) Your brothers are your most natural allies, but your father is the one who could best change your mother’s tune. (Of course, if you find out your brothers also dislike your wife, you check and be sure they aren’t correct. It doesn’t sound like it, but what if you “married your mom”?)
I agree with everyone above, on the whole. I think you are going to have to do what my dad did to his MIL. The first time she visited, she was so cruel to my mom (her own daughter ) that my mom was in tears. My dad looked my 5’ 11" grandmom in the eye and said, “If you don’t treat her with respect and show some kindness, I’m going to throw you out and you are never coming back.” I don’t think they ever actually liked each other, but grandma was tolerable after that.
Your mother is right in the fact that she is entitled to her opinion, doesn’t have to be nice, doesn’t have to change, can continue to be rude.
She is wrong though in thinking that there will be no consequences for her actions. Unless of course you just sit back and let her continue her behavior.
If you laid it on the line “Yes Mom, you have every right in the world to do as you please, but I also have the right to not visit or call anymore unless you change your actions” she’ll then have to make a decision whether her attitude is worth losing her son.
Unless your willing to give her consequences your just enabling her.
No, they divorced years ago. My wife and I are on fine terms with him and his new wife (whom by the way I accept completely).
Yeah, I don’t communicate well with my bros. I have lived out of the country for most of the time in question and haven’t done a good job of keeping up. I don’t think we have any problems per se, but I suspect they have heard a lot more negative about us from my mom than I have counteracted through direct experience with them.
Dude, that’s a big MIL. You got you some cojones!
Unfortunately my wife and I did take a similar stand against my mother at the very beginning, but we were in her house and it ended up in us having to leave abruptly. It was also unfortunate that we took the stand under her roof, because to this day my mother speaks about about how we crossed the line by disrespecting her in her own home.
Hell, no. It’s not acceptable. You need to start actively challenging your mother’s treatment of your wife. On the phone, if she says something mean about your wife, you need to end the call. In person, if she’s nasty to your wife, you need to leave or if she’s visiting you, ask her to leave your house. Spouse trumps parent.
If she had issues with your wife, the appropriate time to bring them up and discuss them is before the wedding. Now, she needs to deal with it.
“Dealing with it” in this context means that she and your wife do not need to be bosom buddies, but she does have to be at a bare minimum polite and courteous. This includes not bad-mouthing your wife to you. She doesn’t have to like it, but she does have to suck it up and deal with it.
If she doesn’t - which is, of course, her right as an adult - you have every right to refuse to associate with someone who won’t accord your wife basic politeness and courtesy. If you ask her how she feels about your wife, of course she can tell you - in the most tactful manner possible. If not, she needs to keep her trap shut.
You can be polite without approving.
I’m curious what her problem is. It may be “nobody’s good enough for my baby!”, but I’m wondering if it’s a racial thing?
I agree with this. As hard as it is to walk away from your mother, try to put yourself in your wife’s shoes. What a lonely feeling that must be to have to spend time with someone who’s openly hostile to you, and the person you love most in the world is allowing it to happen. It’s a bad situation, for sure, but your wife comes first.
) that my mom was in tears. My dad looked my 5’ 11" grandmom in the eye and said, “If you don’t treat her with respect and show some kindness, I’m going to throw you out and you are never coming back.” I don’t think they ever actually liked each other, but grandma was tolerable after that.