Should parents work at keeping their teen kids virgin?

Great Debates
21

When I first got my period, my mom had a sex talk with me. I already knew the mechanics, this was about love, and responsibility and the difference between love making and fucking. During this she asked me not to have sex until I was 18, I think i was 11 at the time. I did as she wished and waited until I was 18 to have sex wiht a guy. Not becuase god said so, just because she thought it was a good idea and would appreciate it. It was not too difficult because I was not waiting until I got married, just until I was an adult. It is a lot easier to abide by that request because she did not pretend to have all the answers or threaten me or tell me horrible stories about ruining my life.

Maybe if you want your kids to wait you should just ask them nicely.

22

Does telling kids that they shouldn’t have sex until they get married encourage them to marry younger or more readily in order to gain access to legitimate sex?

23

I don’t intend to try to keep my kids virgins until they’re married. It’s just not realistic. I can’t very well tell my kids to wait until they’re married when I didn’t wait until I was married. All I can do is tell them about what I went through and my own personal experiences, tell them all about safer sex and birth control, and what I’d like for them to do and hope that they listen to me and make the decision that is right for them.

I also agree with the “they’re gonna have sex anyway” statement. My mother talked to me about sex once and this is basically what she told me…

“Don’t do it until you’re married. I waited until your dad and I were married and it’s just better to do it with only one person.”

I asked her how she knew it was better when she’d never been with anybody else. She didn’t appreciate that too much and didn’t answer me. I think I got her flustered. :slight_smile: Obviously I didn’t listen to my parents and I’m glad I didn’t. If I only had sex with one person during my lifetime I would always wonder if it could be better with somebody else. At least I’ve been with enough people to know when the sex is great and when it sucks. If the sex isn’t great I’m not going to continue the relationship no matter how much I love the man. While I believe that being in love makes the sex even better, the sex has to be good to begin with in order for that to be true.

I just want my kids to be open with me about it. I’d rather give them condoms and birth control and know that they’re safe instead of them trying to hide it from me and maybe not taking precautions. I don’t want them to be embarassed or scared to talk to me. That’s the kind of relationship I had with my parents and I will not have that kind of relationship with my kids. [sub]if I can help it![/sub]

24

Absolutely I intend on keeping my kids, male and female, virgins until they’re married. Of course, this is mainly due to my religious beliefs, and I expect that raising them within my religion will make the task not all that difficult.

I mean, I’ve already got them not eating non-Kosher food…

25

People keep saying this, or things similair to it, but I really doubt you mean it 100%. There has to be a cut off age: if your eight year old comes up and says that Mr. Jerry next door will give her a play station game if they have sex, and she thinks that sounds like a pretty good deal, only she wants to talk it over wiht you first, are you just gonna be happy to be informed and make sure she knows about condems? What if she is 10, 12, 14, 16, 18, 21? I think that we all have an age in our heads when it is “ok” to start having sex. Before that age it is reaonable to take radical steps to make sure that intercourse dosen’t occur or that it ceases (putting Mr. Jerry in jail for instance, or moving away form the 12 year old that your twelve year old has been caught having sex with). After that age those same steps are dracoian. Problems arise when kids and parents have different ages in mind.

26

I really think that waiting until marriage to have sex screws up people’s conception of sex and what sex can be–think about it. You love this person, you want sex with them to be special, especially if it’s your first time with them. Now, if it’s your first time ever, how fuckin’ special is that gonna be??? It’s going to be so forced and awkward because now it’s been built up for so long, and it feels like a duty of some sort, and on top of that, no one knows what they’re doing! A guy’s first time is short, a girl’s first time is painful, now combine those two…ya think these people are ever gonna be having healthy, normal sex?? They’ll probably be so traumatized by the first time, they’ll never even want to try it again, unless they have to to make babies! I think The Onion says it all in this article: http://www.theonion.com/onion3510/awkward_sex_encounter. Case in point, pepperlandgirl’s parents

and I’d bet my life her mom waited till she was married to have sex.
Of course, I guess having “healthy sex” isn’t a goal for most people who feel they should save themselves until marriage, since most of them are religious and feel that sex for non-procreative purposes isn’t “wholesome” or something, anyway.

27

nevermore:

You know, if you take the Onion that seriously, I have to wonder why you’re not perpetually curled up in a little fetal ball, whimpering “Mommy!”

Take it from one who did wait until marriage, and whose wife did too: it’s just fine. Yes, it might take a few tries to get it just right, but it’s not traumatic, for crying out loud.

When you refrain from sex until after marriage, it means that you and your spouse found in each other qualities other than great sex that make you want to stay together forever. It’s compatibility in aspects like that that keeps a couple growing in love even when, for whatever reason, the sex is a little “off” for a while. And it’s compatibility in aspects like that that make two people want to please one another and turn themselves into great lovers over time rather than merely trying to get themselves off for their own pleasure.

Chaim Mattis Keller

28

cmkeller, if you really want your kids to stay virgins, I would point out that single-sex high schools are the only way to go. Believe me, I know . . .

[Insert frowning smiliey]

29

But I would point out that, of course, you have no frame of reference on which to base the above comment.

30

For my boys, I would advocate education. Boys will be boys, so sooner or later they are going to be in a situation without my guidance. I hope they are not too young when they get started, but I have no real expectation that they are going to stay virgins until they are married. If they decided to wait until marriage, that would be fine with me, but I would never be dissapointed in them for not waiting. My problems would come if they got someone pregnant and didn’t handle it honorably.
For the exact same reasons I have decided that I’m not having girls.

31

VarlosZ:

By amazing coincidence, every Orthodox Jewish Yeshiva I know of falls into this category, so I think that we’re in agreement on that point. :slight_smile:

That’s not true. Outside of personal, anecdotal experience, here are well-published studies that have shown that marriages in which the couple did not live together prior to marriage survive in greater percentages than those in whiich the couple did. Now, granted, those addressed the issue of cohabitation rather than pure virginity, but it’s a safe bet that a greater percentage of those who lived together were having sex than of those who did. Also, while I don’t know what the statistics say for other religions, but I know that Orthodox Jewish marriages (in which it’s safe to assume that the couple were virgins until marriage) also survive in greater percentages than non-religious ones.

Now, I’ll grant you that the "why"s that I’ve posted are more my own speculation than hard-and-fast fact, but the statistical facts must have some logic behind them, and my guesses are probably as good as any.

Chaim Mattis Keller

32

OK. Let’s be a little more realistic here. What parent is going to allow their 8 year old to have sex with a neighbor in exchange for a game? Sure as hell not me. 10, 12 and 14 year olds are still children as far as I’m concerned and aren’t old enough to consent to having sex. And I’m talking about consensual sex… not sexual abuse/molestation/rape as in the 8 year old example above. I do have an age set in my mind when my kids will be old enough to consent to sex and that age is 16… same as me when I lost my virginity. But at the same time, on their 16th birthday I’m not going to tell them, “OK, you can have sex now. Go do it and have fun.” I just think that 16 or older is the appropriate age… not before.

If my 16 year old son/daughter comes to me and tells me that they’re thinking about having sex with their boyfriend/girlfriend I’ll talk to them about it. I’m not necessarily going to give my permission but I’m not going to forbid it either. I want them to make the choice that’s best for them. If they think they’re ready to have sex they’re gonna do it no matter what I think of it. I’d much rather have my daughter on the pill with a purse full of condoms and my son with a box of condoms to help prevent pregnancy/disease instead of them not using anything at all.

33

That’s probably not the best strategy. It’s like keeping a loaded firearm around the house and not trining you kids in the proper handling of it because you are afraid they may shoot themselves.

I don’t see why people make such a big deal about sex in
this country. Is there some advantage in waiting until mariage to have sex? As for consequences, there are only two negative ones I can think of: STDs and unwanted pregnancy. Both of these risks can be mitigated through proper birth control and contraceptive tecniques.

That’s not true. You can’t simply apply your reasoning to a set of statistics to draw whatever conclusion agrees with your point of view. There are other factors that may contribute more or less to mariages failing that aren’t immediately apparent in your stats. For example:

  1. Why are couples who live together before marriage less inclined to stay married? Is it because they are less likely to be involved in long commitments (in which case, they would be more likely to have more sex partners before mariage).

  2. Do a high percentage of people who wait until mariage to have sex find it difficult to meet memebers of the opposite sex (shy, ugly, weird, whatever)? Such a person may be more inclined to stay in a marriage because they’re afraid they won’t find someone else.

  3. Do Orthodox Jews stay married because of religeous reasons, not because they don’t have sex before mariage?

Before you assume viginity has a causal relationship with the length a mariage lasts, you really should consider all of the factors involved. According to statistics, most married couples own a car. By that statistic, it would seem that owning a car leads to mariage. You get the idea.

34

My concern is that my 14 year old stepdaughter (who last month had her first kiss!) be educated and informed… not that she abstain.

My wife gave birth to her when she was 17. Rather hard to do one thing and say another to a teen, but easier to show by example the missed opportunites and lifetime of responsibility that followed her actions.

Giving her the power to make her own decisions, and to abide by the complications and consequences of those decisions is by far the best (and IMO the only) advice I can give her.

She knows “right from wrong,” FWIW, and understands what her mom experienced, and understands the responsible way to act. Whether or not she chooses the wisest path, or makes wise choices along a given path, is up to her.

I couldn’t live with myself if I prohibited sex for her until marriage (which is impossible for me to do and would only cause a rift), nor let her run off, uninformed and not knowing that I care about her and was concerned that her well being and future were at stake.

For the record: I’d prefer she wait until she was older. How old? I don’t know. Will she wait? Probably not. Am I concerned? Yes. Will I support her no matter what she decides to do? 'Till the day I die.

35

msmith537:

I’ll grant that this is a possibility. I don’t have the study in front of me, and it would take me a while to dig it up. Nonetheless, since the study was published in a professional journal, I’ve taken the liberty of assuming that they isolated all factors before drawing their conclusions that couples who have lived together before marriage have more marital problems than couples who don’t. I admitted in my earlier post that this doesn’t directly address the issue of virginity, and that this is my own extrapolation/speculation.

However, while I realize you mean them as examples, none of the things you mention would invalidate my theory. To wit…

Well, first of all, it should be remembered that they also don’t have sex before marriage for religious reasons. And second of all, there is no bar to divorce in Jewish law. Orthodox Judaism is not Catholicism that does not acknowledge the possibility that an arrangement might not continue to work out after a while.

Well, of course, a major issue is whether the car was owned before the marriage. If so (and, of course, basic statistical standards are properly followed), then it’s not an entirely illogical conclusion to arrive at. After all, having a car could make dating a lot easier…I know it did for me…

Chaim Mattis Keller

36

Huh?

I’ve read a few posts here concerning Jewish Virgins and separate schools for the sexes. You really think separating the sexes keeps horny guys and gals from having sex together? A good buddy of mine went to a separate school and he and friends became experts at sneaking out. They were Virgins when they went in, but not when they came out.

Besides, have I not read somewhere about Jewish houses of, uh ‘ill repute?’ Aside from their religion, it seems to me that most Jews I have encountered have the same urges as everyone else. Isn’t there also something about the desire for a ‘shick-sa’? (Please, pardon my spelling! I know I spelled it wrong.) Meaning, the desire to have sex with someone not of the Jewish faith?

I’ve known some Catholics who work hard to convince their juveniles that having premarital sex is a sin, a bad, bad thing, and, at confession, the Priests met out heavy punishments for ‘fooling around,’ but the kids find that it is more fun than silly string and do it anyhow. So did their folks.

Some of the other Christian Branches had kids in early high school sign pacts or pledges, vowing Never To Have Sex before marriage and I don’t think all that many kept them. Sign it at 13, hormones cut in at 14, by 15 the kid is angst ridden because he or she wants to do the deed but the Pledge holds them back and by 16, they’ve broken the pledge and are experiencing heaven whenever they can. I wonder if the ministers happened to think about all of the really sweet mental problems that can come from that Pledge when the urges hit and if a kid breaks it then gets all worried that he or she is going to hell because they Broke Their Pledge To The Church and probably to God and it starts eating and eating and eating at him or her?

Kids, according to what I believe, are not responsible for their actions until they reach that special point of ‘self’ where they start thinking and comprehending like an adult. That can come at many ages. So a kid, according to the law, under 18 is not liable for holding to any legally binding contract, for good reason. So, such pledges are not binding either, but mix religion in with them and you can royally screw up a kid.

In sex, nothing can screw people up more than misapplied religion.

Again, I stress, educate them, give them the facts, all sides of the picture, and don’t scare the crap out of them. Plus, no, I don’t think a 12 year old needs to be screwing around.

37

Cheezedoff, I am gonna cut you a little slack because I don’t tihnk you have any idea how offensive you are being. Several people here have posted that they waited until marrige to have sex and that they found it to be a rewarding experience. By claiming that delaying intercourse, esp. for religious reasons, warps people and ruins sex you have effectivly called them liars or you are claiming to know their psyche better than they know themselves. Either way, you are being rude. For some people, waiting until marrige before having sex is a good thing to do, and it is possible to pass these values down to your children. (I mean, cmkeller’s parents managed to do it. Sure, our kids don’t always learn what we want them to learn. Dosen’t mean we shouldn’t try).

Second, you agree with me that 12 is too young to be screwing around. Why? Twelve year olds have “thier pricks wake up” Girls are hitting puberty as young as ten these days. I agree that kids this age shouldn’t be having sex, but there has to be a reason for it beyond “it just ain’t right.” To me, a child that age is to young to understand the life-altering effects of a sexual relationship. But I also think a 16 year old is too young to make this decision as well, and any child of mine would know I felt that way long before it became an issue. My point is that this isn’t a debate between prudes and non-prudes. We are all looking at the same continuim and drawing the line different places.

38

And people wonder why we complain about how every day is “straight pride day”.

39

nevermore wrote:

Bwa ha ha! What cmkeller said.

I have to say that waiting until marriage was one of the best decisions I’ve ever made, for tons of reasons that I’ll be happy to list if anyone wants to hear them. And our romantic life is quite, quite happy, thankyouverymuch. I treasure the memories of our honeymoon as both happy ones and ones I wouldn’t want to have with anyone else. I hope that my kids will be able to have such happy experiences as well, and I’ll do my best to make sure they can.

In today’s world of STDs both icky and fatal and unwanted pregnancies that often end in either abortions or difficult circumstances for mom and baby, I personally think that anything less than completely committed monogamy is absolutely insane. It simply doesn’t make sense to me. Oh sure, there’s birth control and condoms, but they have been known to fail. I know plenty of people, and I bet you do too, who have children or diseases that they didn’t quite plan on, but the precautions failed.

(And, just to defend poor Pepperlandgirlmom, she may have meant that it’s not worth it to sleep around, not that her own sex life was dead. Geez, the poor woman isn’t even here to defend herself!)

40

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by msmith537 *
**

You apparently fail to understand the fundamental difference between leaving a loaded firearm on the kitchen table and failing to acknowlede it to children while allowing them to experiment with it and pointing out the firearm to the children and explaining to them why they should not use it. My belief is that the proper handling of sexuality is to abstain until marriage and as I stated in my earlier post I would consider training them, in the sense of explaining to them why they should wait until marriage, to be one of my most important abilities as a parent.