So I got a job offer (negotiating salary)

In My Humble Opinion
1

I’m not happy working for my current employer so I started looking around. I put in a resume on a Friday and was called that Monday for an interview so seemingly I was a good fit. Fast forward a month and I have an offer. Terrific, but it’s lower than I had hoped and currently make.

I currently make a base salary of X. I may or may not get a yearly bonus of 0 - 0.1X. I also get/have to work a decent amount of overtime to augment my salary anywhere from 0.1 to 0.25X. So my salary ranges from X to 1.35X. But this work involves working about 50 or more hours a week. Benefits largely stink and I see little prospects for a future at this company.

So I interview at a new company and it seems like a great opportunity. Except they offer me 0.94X and the HR person admitted that it was low, but they have great benefits yada yada. Which is true - they certainly have better benefits than my current company. So taking away the OT and bonus from my current job, this new offer (including benefits) would probably be essentially 1.05X. It would also be nice not having to work so much overtime and having a better work life balance.

But during the interview they mentioned me finishing up my masters degree and taking a few courses at a local college (paid for by them). So this new job will require some additional training on my part along with the stress of starting a new job and reproving myself to another team. It just bothers me to take a 6% paycut in salary when I’ve been told by most everyone in my field that changing jobs is a surefire way to get your salary increased 7-10%. So their lowball offer really took me by surprise.

But I’m kind of to the point with my current job I would probably take it as is, but my pride doesn’t want me to without at least trying to negotiate.

[ol]
[li]Should I try to negotiate?[/li][li]If so, how would you approach it?[/li][li]If I choose to accept, at what point should I tell my current employer? For example I have an offer, but telling them now would be bad because this offer could potentially be rescinded if I negotiate the wrong way and go too high. Once I have a start date?[/li][li]I feel I am very valuable to my current company, so should I in any way before accepting this offer go and tell them and try to get a promotion or increased benefits? Part of the reasoning for this is that my company has been in a position of power with regards to employees for a few years now (eroding benefits having no plan or vision). Now that I have options, part of me would like to REALLY see how much they value me as an employee and at least give them the chance to keep me if they really want me.[/li][/ol]

What would you do? Keep in mind each of these are companies with at least a few thousand people so they aren’t huge but aren’t tiny either.

2

Absolutely negotiate. Companies are not in the business of making you rich, they’re in the business of getting the best people possible for as little money as they can manage.

Counter with 1.35x and you’ll probably end up with 1.15 - 1.2x.

good luck.

3

I’m crap at negotiating this stuff, so I have no advice on that part.

But I will say this: if you have to threaten to quit to be paid appropriately, you might as well just quit instead, because it’s never going to get any better.

Your old company is not going to add extra bennies just for you. They may throw you a bone with a title change or a small raise, but there’s a fair chance they’ll take it back in your bonus.

You’ve got a better job offer. Better hours, better benefits, paid degree and training, for essentially the same pay.

You want a better job with better pay - ain’t nothing wrong with that.

If you’re not happy with their offer, then negotiate on the salary. If you want to get a counter-offer from your current employer as a negotiation point, maybe. Although there you still run the risk of letting your employer know you’re looking before you have a job actually in hand.

But it sounds to me like you should just try for a higher starting rate at the new place, and take whatever you can get them to cough up.

4

You mentioned finishing up your degree and taking extra classes for this new job, you could negotiate a future increase in your salary for completing those.

5

You don’t think countering with 40% more than they offered would cause them to rescind? That’s my big fear at this point - I want options. Before this job I felt trapped in my current one. I had no idea if I was desirable in the marketplace. I just don’t want to screw this offer up and be back at my current job for the same pay. How common is it for a offer to be rescinded?

Sound advice. Honestly I’m not happy with my current job, employer, and coworkers, and it’s best I leave. That move primarily would have been done out of spite and to flip the tables so-to-speak. It’s best for me to not even go that route.

My concern is that my current employer even with terrific reviews would give 2, 3 or 5% raises every year or year and a half. So a 10% bump here is more than I would have seen at my old employer in years. So I feel like my best bet for the highest salary is up front rather than relying on evaluations after starting.

Maybe I am jaded, but the business world is a constant power struggle. Once a company shows interest and makes an offer, that’s when the employee has the most leverage. Once I’m in the company they can give me 0% raises for all they want then I am back in the job search again because that’s my only option. So I really want the best deal for me while I have the most leverage. Is this the right line of thinking?

6

Also, does anyone know where the best place to get salary for a given area by degree AND experience level? Average salaries, etc are meaningless when comparing 2 years of experience versus 20. Thanks!

7

It’s virtually unheard of for someone to respond to a reasonable salary negotiation with “screw you, job offer rescinded.”

I’m assuming you have done everything “right” up to this point, by “right” I mean:

  1. You haven’t told this new employer you hate your current job and are desperate to get out (if you have, it has severely hurt your ability to negotiate.)

  2. You haven’t accepted the current offer but instead told them you needed a day or so to think about the offer; if you have accepted it right away, it can be dicey to go to them and put after-the-fact conditions on it, the time to negotiate is before you formally accept. You should have responded to the offer with a “I’m very interested but will need some time to consider this offer.”

So when you go back to them I would basically say something like this to the HR person on the phone (I’m assuming you will be talking with HR.)

“I really want to accept your offer, and I think xxxx is the place I want to work. However, at my current job where I have been very successful and am comfortable, I am making X. I would really like to be making X+Z to take a new job with different responsibilities.”

You don’t have to over think it or worry about selling it, all you’re trying to do is convey, “Hey I want this job, but I want more money.” They know the game, just avoid being rude or confrontational. If you’ll be talking to an HR person they may be in charge of negotiating pay so be ready to get into a full negotiation with that person on the spot. Also be prepared that they aren’t empowered to negotiate and may tell you that they will need to speak with the hiring manager or someone similar to see what can be done.

In the above negotiation, “Z” should essentially be 5-15% more than you are making now, in my opinion. So you should essentially tell them up front you want that level of bump. I’d lean towards asking for a 15% bump over what you make now.

If you are pulled into an on the spot negotiation just be very polite but have a backbone. If the first thing she says is that the offer is 100% non-negotiable just repeat your request in a different way, while remaining polite. Essentially say, “Well I really feel for a position like this the pay should be around X+Z, is there really no way you could talk to someone about this and see if we could get the amount increased somewhat?” A lot of times in a company where the HR person is required to do the negotiating they are required to play a little bit of hard ball, so keep pressing but be polite.

You have to use your best judgment, chances are you can get more money. But if you hit a total brick wall in an on the spot negotiation this company may genuinely be giving you their highest offer. You have to use your best judgment, but if you think they are playing hard ball you can always pull out the, “is there any way you could at least ask a supervisor or someone higher up if there is a way to get my pay increased and get back to me?” That way you show you’re still interested, but you are serious about getting a pay boost.

8

Between me and my wife, the success rate of simply saying “Could you increase that offer?” is about 75%, so I’d say go for it.

9

Yeah, all you really need to do is say you want more in a way that is polite and to the point. Don’t obsess about phrasing or etc, they know what “I want more” means, and as long as you aren’t an ass it won’t cost you the job.

10

I basicaly agree with this, except I think Moonlitherial is a bit optimistic. In this economy, companies aren’t giving out many 20% raises, even to external candidates, unless they really, really want them.

I would probably counter with 1.2X or so. Maybe a little higher depending on whether their offer was a low ball, how much you think they want you, etc. I would expect to come out of it with anywhere from 1.0x to 1.15x.

I have negotiated quite a few times in my career, and I can’t think of a time when I didn’t get at least a little bit out of it, even if it was only a couple of thousand dollars a year. I did have one company that seemed offended by it, which shocked me. They didn’t rescind the offer, but basically said “Our offer remains the same and the fact that you are negotiating rather than accepting it makes us think you don’t really want the job.” I did not accept the job, thinking that this was a warning sign about the manager.

One caveat: If this is a fairly low-level job (restaurant, retail, clerical), your negotiating leverage may be very small.

11

Very good young Padawan. You are learning.

Everyone always spouts future increases in salary and future advancement potential. It’s easy…and they don’t have to give it. SOP for many companies to get talent they cannot afford and/or are unwilling to pay for at a lower price…for a few years at least and then when the employee wises up and leaves then they can rinse and repeat*

The salary/bennies that they are currently offering is the only thing you should be considering. If it is low, there is a reason it is low and that reason, no matter what it is, is not good.

If you like the job and are willing to take a lateral move, go for it.

However, my 2 cents is that you JUST starting looking and almost immediately got an offer. Look some more. There is much crap out there and you have to sift to find the better stuff. Likely you will find a company you feel good about AND will increase your pay some.

  • You want to have fun with them? Here is what you do - I have do this and the results have been HYSTERICAL! When they are talking about the large advancement potential and future salary increases that this position has to compensate for the low salary…ask to meet the last 3 people to hold that position. Sit back and watch the acrobatics and backpedalling and smoke and mirrors that follows.

Whenever I have done this, I have never been able to meet the last 3 people because they no longer worked there. SO much for future salary increases and promotions. The only time I have been able to meet the last person and they were actually promoted…the position paid well, not below market.

This asking to meet the last 3 people is actually good interviewing. It allows you to see how valued the position REALLY is according to the company. Talk is cheap. Action shows what is real.

12

BlinkingDuck has great advice. I don’t have any real world experience with this stuff, just intuition… but I would definitely try to negotiate, asking for about a 15% increase of your current salary, and keep looking for other jobs elsewhere. While you’re at it, talk to your current company about a possible raise, or something, just for shits and giggles. If you end up getting a raise while looking for another job then great, doesn’t mean you have to stay. If you still have to work at this crappy place for a little longer, you might as well do it while making a little more money if you can get it.

Asking to talk to past employees who held the position is an hillariously brilliant idea. I would totally go for it.

13

absolutely agreed. Just say it - it won’t hurt a bit, chances are they’ll agree, and it will be a whole lot easier the next time around.

14

What’s the most appropriate method of communication for this? My offer letter was sent via email.

15

You had those expectations in this economy? Maybe 5 years ago, not now. I would expect that you would have no negotiation leverage…they can probably go offer to the next guy on their list and he’ll take it. You admittadly said that after weighing everything, that you are 5% better off with the new job. Your choice.

16

Definitely over the phone. I don’t think this kind of thing should be via email. Too much room for people to read a “tone of voice” into your message.

17

While I don’t like my current job, and this one would seem more interesting to me, I will need more than 5% in aggregate benefits to switch. There’s tons of stress and hassle in changing jobs especially when they have training and classes they want you to take outside of work, new org charts to learn, processes, and all that other crap. If they want someone to put up with that for lower salary and maybe 5% increase in benefits, then they can pound sand. It would be one thing if I had no job so X > 0, but as bad as I dislike my current job I have a family to support and I’m not stupid enough to deal when I can sit tight for ~40% more money (0.94X vs 1.35X this year). Not to mention they aren’t having to pay any signing bonus or relocation package for me since I’m in the same town.

18

Then by all means tell them that their current offer is not enough to incent you to change jobs.

19

hhaha, I will :slight_smile: Just have never done this so I didn’t know what the appropriate method was. I just want to sound professional and tell them:

  1. I’m very interested in the opportunity to work their and my skills are a great match
  2. But I will need to make more money than I do in my current job in order to switch jobs.

I will counter with 1.15X (about 20%) higher than they started with. I just am not sure exactly how it should be phrased. Should I mention that when they asked my current salary I only listed my base salary and not bonuses and OT? That’s 20% or more of my pay so that makes their offer extraordinarily low by comparison.

The part that makes me nervous is that I really feel like I would be a great fit for them, and the direction the company is going in looks positive and where I want to be in the future in my career so I don’t want to mess it up. But we just need to get on the same page with salary.

20

I got the idea from employers. They want your employment history. Ok, so I want the history of the position. If you SAY that this position is great to move up from…well…then people should have moved up from it. If people haven’t moved up from it I might still be interested…but you are going to have to pay me more to get me to come. It also has the advantage of smoking out interviewers that lie. If they lie about this they will probably lie about other things.