So, my parents are taking my niece and nephews (long, boring)

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

And I don’t know how to feel about it. I’ve talked before about my I-think-he’s-a-sociopath half-brother here before, and in that Pit thread about BigT said that I felt I couldn’t really share my feelings about his current stunts without being branded as a monster who hates the mentally ill, and I was going to post about his latest doings and get some damned sympathy, and then this came out. Which I truly believe is best for the kids, but frankly I need some help in advising my parents.

So. My evil half brother, who is a Very Bad Person at the very least (do not get me started on the many scams he has pulled, as the Internet does not have capacity), has hit upon suicide attempts as, I don’t know, pleas for attention or an attempt to get out of his responsibilities or whatever. Twice he overdosed on various pain medications (which he seems to be addicted to) and the second time he out and out told my dad that he’d done it to get away from the kids (three of them, teenagers).

As backstory, his wife is helpless and useless because of, I kid you not, what we believe is a scam they pulled claiming a recurrence of her breast cancer which ended up in a botched anesthesia leaving her with serious short term memory problems, lots of tics, and various issues. In short, she is completely unable to care for the children, one of whom is special needs. Whether or not it was a scam (and believe me, if it wasn’t it was an aberration) this is definitely the case - she can’t keep the kids on her own.

So, this time (the day my parents sold their Florida house and should have been thrilled at their financial liberation) my half-brother “accidentally shot himself cleaning his gun”. At 2 AM. By the way, the bullet went through the wall and could have killed one of those children. Surgery, etc. However, he evidently picked the best place in the world to shoot yourself in the abdomen, because he’s supposed to be pretty much fine. When I heard this I didn’t even have the strength to be angry anymore, just fucking nauseated. It doesn’t make any fucking sense. All I can figure is that he wants to be permanently committed so he never has to deal with all that damned responsibility again or he wants more drugs after they’ve been denied to him. Either way… don’t even get me started, that’s the thread I DIDN’T start.

Anyway, he shouldn’t be going back home, like, ever. And he isn’t going back home for a while. And the mother is… well. Even if she were healthy she’s completely unfit. So my parents told me today that on the holiday they’re going to bring the kids to their house (less than a mile away) and tell them they’re staying there for the duration - temporary or permanent is yet to be seen.

Which is great for the kids - it’s what they should have done years ago, and some of you participated in my thread about should I take a kid? However, my parents are getting older (ARE older - my mom’s almost 70 and my dad’s almost 80) and I am very concerned that their parents are going to poison the kids against it. My parents aren’t telling the mother before they lay the news on all of them, which I thought was a bad idea until I thought, oh god, she’d totally tell this kids “Grandma and Grandpa are stealing you from us!” and poison the well that way. The fact is, the kids are going like it or not because my parents support the family almost completely financially (the mother does have disability).

So how do I make this work for the kids? I already told my folks that the pet thing is going to be a Problem - my mom’s allergic to cats, and the kids have cats as pets. They’re going to have to leave them with their mom. One kid has a hamster or some other furry pet - I suggested that they offer them all the chance to have something caged, but if it were me as a teenager I can’t even imagine what it would have been if I were dragged out of my home and forced to leave my pets. (My parents do have much more of a long-standing relationship with the kids than I do - they’re very much in their lives, so that’s something.) One thing I’ve always loathed about my brother’s parenting style is that pets are disposable - I can’t even count the dogs they’ve gotten that they’ve then gotten rid of because they never bothered to train them. But I can’t even imagine what it would be like to be unceremoniously lifted from a filthy house (seriously) and dumped in guest rooms at my grandparents’ without my beloved pets and and with two old people and expected to be cool with it.

So obviously I want to involve myself very much with this process, because I’m a lot closer to 15 than my parents are. The first thing I told them was that you can’t be iffy about the time period - it’s permament or it’s for a specific period or it isn’t. Kids need stability! Luckily they can stay at the same schools. I’m going over this weekend to clean everything out of the closets so they can feel like it’s “their” rooms. I suggested they make it clear they should decorate up there. Frankly, I don’t know what else to do - this is such a damned fucked-up situation, and I don’t know what to say to kids who have been living their whole lives with a sociopath and who are teenagers to boot (the girl is a Daddy’s Girl and will be Trouble) and, I mean, Jesus, their dad shot himself in the next room.

And I’m kind of drunk and I just don’t know how to feel about any of this and my boyfriend isn’t home and I would really like a hug, thanks.

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<<hug>>
I wish I could offer some useful advice. I think you are n the right track with the closet cleaning and allowing the kids to decorate as they see fit.
Is there anyway you can take the cats so the kids have visiting privileges?

3

Well cripes, that sounds like a mess. I don’t really have advice (don’t have kids or know much about custody, etc) but all my best to you and your family.

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I have three cats of my own, so no. Theyre welcome to visit their mom and the cats, of course.

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What I thought I could maybe do, little as it is, is sit these kids down and tell that that no matter what, I’m
the person who won’t lie to them. If I don’t want to answer a question or don’t feel I should I’ll tell them that, but I’ll neither lie in fact or by omission. Thing is, I think maybe I’m thinking like a 30 year old adult and not like a 14 year old boy - hell if I know what they need to hear.

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Just going from the gut here, so I may be wrong.

First off, given the status of the kids’ current home life, I believe it would be a mistake to assume that their going to be looking at things from what could be considered a normal teenager’s perspective. They’ve been up close and personal for some deeply unsettling shit for years, now. I have trouble believing that they could be exposed on a constant basis to this shit for years without one of two things happening: falling into sociopathy themselves, or trying to find ways to control their environment as much as possible to preserve some semblance of order and normality.

What I’m getting at is that I’d expect your niephlings to place a lot more value upon what I’d consider mature traits than I would most teens. The biggest thing, to my mind, is one you’ve already got set firmly in mind: Be honest with them. I’d also suggest letting them know that whatever may happen in the future, they can always come to you for straight talk. Give them some kind of stability to help counter the unavoidably unsettled aspects of this move.

If you can, talk with them and your parents at once to try to get some unambiguous ground rules set, too. Don’t let your parents assume they know how the kids will behave. Likewise, don’t let the kids assume that everything will be the same as it was with their parents. Ideally, I’d hope you and your parents and your niephlings could come to some compromises that make it clear you’re listening and considering their views, but that’s not always possible - depending on people’s positions. Still, make an effort to include them in the decisions being made about their lives.

Finally, while I don’t want to suggest you start glad talking either of their parents, or that you hide your opinions of them, try to be neutral when talking about them, as much as possible. Don’t rub their noses in your opinion of their father or mother. Accept that they will probably love both their parents, in spite of all the failings you see in them, and that they probably already recognize, too. Most especially do not try to make things into a them or us sort of choice for the kids. It is grossly unfair to them, and even if it weren’t, it’s likely to backfire against you and your parents. Badly.

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I remember the original OP about this very well. At the time I advised you to move in temporarily with your mom and dad to help them out with the kids. I don’t recall how capable your folks, are, though- are they going to be physically up to this? At the least, I would advise you to bring over cooked meals for all of them as much as possible, and spend as much time with the kids yourself as possible. If not actually move in, for a time, at least. Teenagers should be able to care for themselves for the most part, but the change and the suddenly living with old people could be very hard for them, so I’d try to make it as good a transition as possible for everyone.

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{{{Zsofia}}}

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I valued your move in advice a lot, Alice - you’d obviously put a lot of compassionate thought into the situation. The thing is, there isn’t room with all three of them! At the moment I think my parents are kind of excited about the idea, so we’ll see how it goes. I talked with my mom a bit at dinner about freezer cooking together.

Their pastor was really in favor of one of the local childrens’ homes, but my dad is dead set against it unless family doesn’t work out. So we’ll try it. I’m just worried sick about getting the wrong start with sensitive teenagers.

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Don’t worry about getting off on a wrong start. Teenagers are flexible and will soon figure out which side of the bread the butter’s on.

I had a thread last year about my niece leaving an abusive home to come live with us. You might find some of the advice in it helpful. Advice on parenting a formerly battered child - In My Humble Opinion - Straight Dope Message Board

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Are the kids getting therapy?

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What if, instead of ‘taking’ the kids, they ‘offer’ to let them stay. Sounds like the parents would be up for that. The teenagers too, from the sounds of it. But lay down some rules about the behaviour you expect.

Perhaps your role could be to point out to the teens that your parents are older, that it’s a kindness that is being offered and that you’re relying on them to be mature and help out. Maybe offer to run interference should problems arise, that they should come to you before making waves at Granny’s. These teens are probably pretty mature already, from dealing with this shite, you should point that out to them, and compliment them, express confidence in their ability to make it work, like that. Tell them the family is trying to make a better situation for them, and it won’t be perfect, prepare them a little, anyway.

Wouldn’t hurt to have your parents on board with running issues through you rather than disrupt the household (which could send things south, pretty fast), emphasizing that you’re all going to deal with this together as a family.

Good Luck to you all.

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Oh god, y’all. I’m standing in their house right now and it smells like a hamster cage. I’m going home and cleaning the living shit out of my house!!

14

My only advice is to try not to make too many assumptions about the kids. Some abused kids act out more than others. Some realize their situation is abnormal and would be grateful and cooperative to anyone who gives them an out. Some view their situation as normal and will resist tooth and nail learning a new normal. You just don’t know. One may act one way and the other another. They are, after all, individuals.

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I don’t have anything to say but my best wishes for all of you.

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That’s the thing with hamsters. Teensy poop, so it’s hard to know when to clean the cage. If the hamsters are moving, make sure the kids have a good supply of shavings or whatever is used for hamster litter. The ammonia smell will build up gradually, and might not be noticed by the people living in the house.

But hey, is this being done without any legal advice? What happens when one of the kids needs to see a doctor, or get a permission slip signed?

Good on your folks. I’m 65, and there’s no way I’d take full responsibility for kids again, not even grandkids.

Something you might do is offer to take the kids to your place occasionally, maybe one at a time. Or take them to the movies or McDonald’s, or the zoo, whatever. Give your folks a break.

The kids might also need to shop for their own supplies, toiletries and the like.

And it wouldn’t hurt to gently let them know how a good guest behaves. If they weren’t already doing it at home, they should pick up after themselves, turn the music down after 9 p.m., eat what’s in front of them, do their own laundry, etc.

17

Your parents are doing a really good thing for those children. Good for you as well for helping out.

If the mom is that unstable, there is no way I would leave the cats with her. Due to allergies, I don’t know what other avenues you have available, but I would find some way to get them out of the environment. When I left my mom for the last time and moved back in with my grandparents, I had a guinea pig that I had to leave behind. She promised me that she would take care of it. She did. She killed it. My mom was psycho.

That’s all the advice I have. Hugs to you and your family for doing this - those kids will never forget it!

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My dad has power of attorney for the whole family, by the way.

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And the mom is disabled and incompetent but not cat-killing psycho - at least one of the cats is hers.

20

You will also want to talk to the kids’ counselors at school to get an idea of their grades and any academic or behavioral problems they may be having. They can also give some advice about how to approach this with the kids’ teachers and classmates to minimize any problems.

I know this is difficult. {{{{{{{{{{{{Zsofia}}}}}}}}}}}}