Batman Returns? Are you kidding? I thought that was one of the most brilliant superhero movie ever. I don’t think the Nolan brothers can top that one.
Are you kidding? Until Schumacher killed the Bat-franchise with Batman and Robin (even though I don’t think such a movie exists), Returns was by far the worst one.
Wow. Can you elaborate? I don’t agree, obviously; I think Returns was weaker than the first Batman but light years better than Batman Forever (and obviously better than B&R). I’m curious as to the reasons behind this opinion.
It does seem the “villain” of the next film will be Batman himself.
What was bad about it? Everything about it was pretty brilliant, IMHO. It wasn’t cartoonish or campy…rather, pretty much everyone was fleshed out, very real. It just felt way more like a real movie than any other superhero movie I’ve seen.
It could have been an awesome Batman movie… if they’d made it in 1968, with Adam West in the title role. Which does, at least, put it ahead of Batman Forever and Batman and Robin, in that there are no conceivable circumstances in which those two movies could possibly have been good.
:dubious: The Penguin’s master plan involved an army of penguins with rocket launchers.
Well, yeah, but I meant the characterizations, the personality. The whole aura of darkness. This is brooding I can deal with, not Peter Parker jerking off and crying about great responsibility.
I hate to tell you, but a lot of 7th Graders watch the Saw and Hostel movies as well. I’m shocked, but I think parents think those movies are about on par with mild horror movies of the 80’s.
You realize that contrary to your statement, you do agree with Justin here, right? You both say the same thing: Batman > Batman Returns > the other two.
It seems to me that Justin is saying Batman > Batman Forever > Batman Returns > Batman and Robin.
I’d reverse the middle two in that list, and it wouldn’t be a minor distinction, either. I thought Batman Returns was a great movie; Batman Forever belongs in the same pit of forgetting into which Batman and Robin should rightly be placed.
CHECKMATE! 
Hold on a minute, here. In Batman Begins, Ra’s Al Ghul’s master plan involved a device that could vaporize water in the pipes of Gotham city, but not anywhere else. At all.
I honestly believe that an army of trained penguins with rocket launchers strains credulity less than the existence of such a device.
Heck, the entire fabric of the Batman universe relies upon the assumption that folks could interact with both Bruce Wayne and Batman and never ever notice that they look exactly the same from the nose down.
I grant you that the McGuffin in Begins was not spectuacular, but it was in the “comic book science” exception.
Forever has trained penguins…with ROCKET LAUNCHERS! :smack: 
That traveled from comic bookish to cartoonish.
You’re missing the point. I wasn’t talking about realism, but about camp and cartoonishness. The water vaporizer may be scientifically ludicrous, but it wasn’t aesthetically ludicrous. On the other hand, while it is indeed possible to strap a radio controlled rocket launcher onto a penguin, the idea itself is silly. It’s straight out of the '60’s era high-camp Batman. He might as well have defeated the Penguin by throwing a mass-produced fruit pie at him.
Put another way, the water vaporizing device is merely impossible. But the penguin army was improbable in the extreme.
In all fairness, who really notices what people look like just from the nose down?
That’s correct. I just thought Returns was too dark. As I got older, I realized this was in line with Tim Burton’s “I’m more dark and brooding than you!” filmmaking style.
The Penguin was ridiculous.
The Penguin’s schemes were ridiculous.
And the whole thing seemed less “special” than the first Batman.
I enjoy Batman Forever because it’s just so completely over-the-top. Plus, I love Tommy Lee Jones and he seems to be the only one that got “Batman” right as a character. The others were fine Bruce Waynes, but he was “Batman.”
Of course, Begins and The Dark Knight blow all three away.
That was actually a funny bit in DK, where Bruce Wayne holds the menu over Dent’s eyes to see if he looks like Batman.
Realistically though, this isn’t like Superman where people get a good look at Batman. When he appears, it is either dark or he is moving fast.
He’s an amazing guy. His Val Kilmer impression was beyond reproach.
Dammit, that “he” in my post was supposed to be “Val Kilmer”, obviously.
"The Dark Night 2 (Batman Begins 3)(Batman 7):Electric Bugaloo!"