First, this has never happened to me. I’ve seen it, in Austin Texas, and I’m curious. A valet parking guy saw a motorist started to pull into one “his” spots, and he ran over and stood in front of her car. She eventually, after about 15 minutes, told him that she was going to go forward. She put the car in gear and very slowly pushed up against him, forcing him to move. It’s interesting that he threatened to call the cops, but didn’t.
Now, I’m pretty sure that if he was trying to prevent her from leaving, it would have been a “slam dunk” in her favor. But she did have the choice here to leave, allowing the asshole to have his way.
What, in the wise old eye of the law, would happen should this go to court in either scenario?
mangeorge
Maybe I’m missing somethting. What makes him an asshole? I presume that he needs those spots to do his job and that her taking one of them hurts him, hurts the legitimate customers and hurts the owners. I’ll side with the valet. If he could get her towed, I’d support him for doing that too. Kind of like someone walks into your office or home and takes a chair that isn’t being used and just moves in for the day.
Well, she drove the car forwards, until it contacted him. I would think it wouldn’t be too hard to make vehicular assault charges stick, in such a case. I could only wish that a police officer had witnessed the scene, I’m betting she’d have been arrested.
Sounds like this is a valet parking service that does not have its own parking lot, but rather parks the cars on city streets or other public byways. This is very common where I live. Restaurants, theaters, and clubs offer this as a convenience to their customers, who often don’t want to waste 10-20 minutes looking for a parking spot which is likely to be several blocks away from the establishment.
So, it’s not at all like someone helping himself to your home or furniture. The woman in the OP has just as much right to the parking space as the valet parking company - it’s public parking, not private property. While the parking attendant may find it convenient to rely on a particular space or spaces, he doesn’t have any actual claim on them. It is, in fact, his *job * to do the dirty work of finding parking spaces, however far away they may be, and doing the legwork back and forth.
Using her car to push the attendant out of the way is inappropriate and probably illegal. However, “saving” a public parking space is also illegal (at least where I live), and that may be why the attendant didn’t make good on his threat to call a cop.
Not even close, but:
Those are public parking spots, on the street. With meters, but this was on a Sunday.
Those valet guys do the same thing in San Francisco. They have people stand in open public spaces till one of their employees comes with a customer’s car.
I realize I didn’t mention that, but it seems kinda obvious to me. I wouldn’t say anything if it were a private lot. And I doubt a normal citizen, looking to park, would even try such a move.
Sorry, didn’t mean to confuse you.
No, he’d have been offered the chance to get out of her way.
I think for assault there has to be an attempt to harm. I also think he has an obligation to try to remove himself from that harm. I also think that he doesn’t have any business in that parking spot. It would be like her parking on the sidewalk.
I think.
The California standard is intent to cause harmful or offensive contact.
Pedestrians generally have right of way (check your local traffic laws). For example, you can’t just run someone over if they choose not to get out of the crosswalk.
I don’t know the actual law, but I’m pretty sure it’s Vehicular Assault or Reckless Endangerment or something to push someone out of the way with your car. You’re also risking having your car keyed or a window smashed by a pissed off valet while you leave it unattended.
No, no. Not in a crosswalk. This guy was standing in a parking space. One with those painted “T” lines and at a curb. Other cars were parked before and after the space.
What I meant was, Zabali’s cop/witness would have surely told the idiot to move.
He was a big man, she a small woman. The car was what’s called an “equalizer”, and didn’t pose any real threat to him.
No, no. Not in a crosswalk. This guy was standing in a parking space. One with those painted “T” lines and at a curb. Other cars were parked before and after the space.
What I meant was, Zabali’s cop/witness would have surely told the idiot to move.
He was a big man, she a small woman. The car was what’s called an “equalizer”, and didn’t pose any real threat to him.
sigh I expect you are being facetious, but still; the car is not an “equalizer” in any lawful sense, certainly not in the general principle that a smaller and weaker person may employ a weapon for defense against battery against a larger and aggressive person. In this scenario, the valet was not committing any kind of assault on the driver; at worst, he was technically in violation of traffic statutes and was at most guilty of impeding the progress of traffic and/or entering the street in an area unmarked for pedestrian crossing, both being either finable infractions or very low grade misdomeners in the penal code of all municipalities. On the other hand, her actions (threatening and proceeding to use the vehicle to physically move him out of the street) can be interpreted in no way other than to do physical (and aggravated) assault, even if doesn’t “mean” to do injury. Consider a comperable situation: you want to see the Rose Bowl Parade, but a tall and impolite bloke is standing right in front of you and intentionally blocking any attempt to see around him onto Colorado Blvd. His behavior obnoxious and potentially even illegal, but you are in no way justified in physically contacting and moving him. If a fight results from this, you are going to be legally at fault, regardless of how righteous you are.
In this scenario, the valet is being a jerk, but the driver is downright and unquestionably committing assault. If I were a cop, I’d walk over and tell them to both knock it off and go someplace else, and if I got any backtalk from either I’d cite them both just for wasting my time and theirs. In fifteen minutes, the woman could have found another parking spot and been working on her second martini, while the valet would just be doing his shitty-paying job. When people let their egos get in the way of good sense, really ****ing stupid things tend to happen.
And if you pulled this kind of thing in Chicago, the driver would have been pulled from her car and beaten to a pulp, and the evening news would have featured it after the second commercial as an unsympathetic example of what happens when an idiot driver attempts to take a previously claimed space. [Malone]“That’s the Chicago way.”[/Malone]
Stranger
Wow, this effectively killed any desire I had to go to Chicago.
I’m curious. Were they in stand-off mode for fifteen minutes, which would be incredibly obstinately stupid on both parts, or was she parked there for fifteen minutes and then decided to leave?
If she pushed her car forward to get into the spot, it’s vehicular assault. If she pushed forward to get out of the spot because he wouldn’t allow her to leave, then she has a potential case for unlawful detention on his part and it is doubtful that any cop or judge is going to punish her for doing it.
Had a cop been there, I’m sure she/he would’ve told the guy to move long before she threatened him with dismemberment. He was, after all, the initiator of the confrontation.
But yeah, they were both bull-headed. But it’s a lot easier to talk cool head than to actually use yours. Finding another space is extremely difficult, which is why the valet was there in the first place.
I’d have probably called for a cop right away.
She was nosing into the spot, as most experienced city drivers do, when he ran over and jumped (from the curb) in front of her car.
slight hijack
This reminded me of an incident when I used to work armored and drive a 20,000 pound truck. A car got in front of me and the driver was busy yelling at me, waving his finger around and acting angry for little or no reason.
I got on my PA system and informed him that, should my truck hit his small car, the only thing that would happen to me is that I would feel a slightly slippery scrunch as I drove over him. While he however, would BE that slippery scrunch.
He got out of my way.
Where downtown was it? A lot of the valet companies lease metered spots although it’s usually well-marked with a bag over the meter.
If it’d been me parking and the spot wasn’t leased, I’d have called the cops. And I’d take down the valet’s name and the name of the valet company and work my way through the channels at the city with complaints, starting with the city traffic engineers.
Under Spanish laws, pedestrians have the right of way on the sidewalk and on crosswalks. Not on the rest of the tarmac.
Oh…that changes everything…yeah the guy sounds a little too aggressive