I simply can’t answer all the questions put to me here by everybody. There are too many and I don’t have that much time to spend on the computer. I believe I did try to answer your question to the best of my ability. I don’t follow some because they aren’t valid anymore, but moral things are. About women having their head covered, a friend and I looked that up on her computer and farther down in the verse it says the woman’s hair is given as her covering. I doubt that any of my answers are going to satisfy you. As to mormonism, even without the book I quoted, I’ve heard what some of them on the board have said and I still disagree. You guys will probably get your wish someday soon and I will simple not come back here. I’m sure that will make everyone breathe a big sigh of relief.
I think that Great Debates allows for witnessing as well as debating. Witnessing does not require cites, backups, or responses to disagreement.
Oh, and His4ever… see how heavy those burdens are?
[shrug]
I’m outta here…
In which case, you’re being willfully dishonest, which makes the name of Jesus a blasphemy on your lips.
“Wah! Maybe I’ll just leave, and then you guys’ll be sorry!” :mad:
Pathetic.
[Cartman]
Screw you guys! I’m going home!
I don’t think you ever answered this when I asked it in the GD thread, so allow me to repeat the question: On what basis do you distinguish between “moral things” and those that “aren’t valid anymore”?
I keep thinking about this “cast-iron” defense:
Kids: Gotta Cite?
H4E: God’s will.
Consider, then, if this be your ultimate answer to all questions of a religious nature, where you have found yourself. You are in a place where open dialogue and a constant testing of knowledge and ideas is the stadard. If it is God’s will that you believe the things you do despite what any may say to you, it must also be his will that you have found yourself here among us.
Maybe he wants you to test your knowledge.
Maybe you have alot to learn about compassion and tolerance.
Maybe you can learn more about your own faith.
Carl Jung was a psychologist, I believe, who wrote of what he called “shadow projection”. This is a phenomenon where the thing that makes a person the most mad, those ideas that they fight the hardest against, are really what they most hate about themselves. It aint an exact science, and this shouldn’t be taken too literally here. I’m just saying that you may get so riled up because you’re really upset that you don’t quite understand your own faith or the reasons for it.
This place can be valuable to you as it is to me and many others. Why not go along with the general rules and test your faith? For the sake of simple thought exercises? Is this faith so weak it can bear no challenge? Find out where the edges of faith and truth meet. Come to know what parts of your faith deny logic or rigorous standards of proof. This doesn’t have to undermine your faith, but it may help you come to know it better. And there are many issues, it seems to me, where you could learn a thing or two about scriptures, context, translations, and the many many different interpretations of the scriptures of your own faith.
Maybe God brought you here cause you aint quite got his message right yet. Good place to learn. Suck it up and play by the rules. Ya just might learn somethin’. Not a human I’ve met on this planet that has been perfect and all knowing.
Just a thought. Feel free to ignore me: One love and all that jazz.
DaLovin’ Dj
No, His4Ever, that’s not the case. For me, at least.
I don’t wish you to leave. And I will not be thankful if you do.
I only ask that you wade through the insults (of which there are a few, though not by any means as many as you might think) and read, and understand.
I don’t buy that excuse of yours, H4E. For one thing, it’s lame–too convenient, if you will. For another, how much time should it take for you to answer a simple question about the Messiah? How much time should it take you to answer a simple question about who appointed you God’s mouthpiece?
The question I put to you about the Messiah requires a simple “Yes” or a simple “No.” Of course, this being the Straight Dope Message Board, it would behoove you to provide evidence for your conclusion.
The questioin I put to you about you being God’s mouthpiece should take you all of a nanosecond. Consider an analogy, kindly, between that “office” and a Commissioned Officer in the United States Armed Forces. I can walk up to any such Commissioned Officer and ask “Who granted your commission?” The answer will be, “The President of the United States.” Now, that’s a simple question with a simple factual answer. The question I put to you is the same.
HIS4EVER –
Yeah, I can see that. But then pick one line of questions and respond and see it through. So far you haven’t IMO done that in regards to any.
Who draws that distinction? And how? How did you decide what you would follow and what you would not?
I encourage you to re-read the passage in question. You don’t even have to do so “prayerfully,” just read it carefully. Because you will see that your interpretation of that passage doesn’t make any sense: If a woman’s hair is her covering, then Paul would not have to demand that women cover their heads – because every woman’s head is naturally covered, all the time, by her hair. Your explanation renders Paul’s exhortation absolutely nonsensical. It therefore is reasonable to reject it, because while I do not take the Bible literally, I do consider it a divinely inspired text and the words in it IMO are never nonsense.
I for one would not be “relieved” by your absence. I frankly don’t think you’re a good enough witness for the things you believe to do any damage by persuading others to believe them too. To the extent your witness as a Christian has been successful, IMO, it has been through your refusal to respond in kind when confronted with extraordinary rudeness and abuse. That’s a good thing, and it reflects well on you. So leave if you want, or stay if you want. But surely you must realize by now that at least some of the people you are dealing with here consider your beliefs to be not only ignorant or misguided, but outright harmful and, yes, hateful. That is why they will not or cannot deal with you with perfect civility, and frankly I don’t know that they ever will. No one here expects you to lie about your beliefs, but if others consider them to be disgraceful, they in turn will not lie about that.
Oh, and I used “homophobic” in the generic sense of being hostile to gay people in a social context, not in the sense of being afraid of them. You may in fact ascribe to the maxim that you must “love the sinner, but hate the sin,” but it is very difficult for most people to see a statement that they are going to burn in hell as anything other than an act of hostility.
I don’t know if this will work, but several of us have questions about Christianity as practised by His4Ever, possibly Jersey Diamond, and others. Do you think we could start a sort of “Ask the Fundamentalist Christian” thread? Is there a chance we’d get answers? I’m about as un-Fundamentalist as they come, but I’d be willing to start the thread in Great Debates and see what happens.
CJ
I’m still giggling from her assertation that Buddhism is a cult.
How can you take her serioiusly? She obviously has no clue what she’s talking about. She’s spouting “Christian views” by rote.
She will probably never figure it out or change her mind. Let her live off there in her little Jack Chick bubble. Just keep her away from my Fritos and everything will be fine.
You see? There’s really no talking to her. Nothing will be solved except maybe her cross will get taller.
No one made me God’s special mouthpiece. As one of His , I simple read His word and share in my opinion what I believe it says. Notice I said in my opinion, that should keep us from the “my interpretation, your interpretation” argument. I don’t wish to get into that again. As I read someone else say, “instead of saying you’re wrong, just say I don’t agree with your interpretation”.
JACK BATTY –
That’s a good point, Jack, and I – Quick! Look behind you!
:: steals a Frito ::
This made me think of something. Course you’re gonna laugh your head off. Did you ever consider just the opposite? Perhaps God brought me here to share some truth that you aren’t getting?
Of course, I don’t think I’m infallable or anything like that but there are certain things that I just can’t see any differently, I’m sorry. That’s why I don’t know how long I’ll stick around. I take God’s word as the final authority and I know that there are those that don’t, of course. And then you get into the ever present “my interpretation, your interpretation” and “who made you God’s personal mouthpice” argument over and over. So that’s why I say why can’t we just say I respect your view but I disagree with it? There’s no way any of us can really “prove” something 100% to another person. It’s a matter of faith. Although you can’t understand me and other Chrisitan fundamentalists, thanks for your encouragement.
Sigh, I tried this once before. Moral things have to do with killing, stealing, murder, lusting, coveting, etc. The other has to do with the ceremonial washings of pots and pans and not wearing certain fabrics together, and preparing food a certain way, etc. Don’t know how else to explain it. Sorry, but I don’t feel like continueing to go round and round and round on this. Tell us your interpretation, if you have one. And how do you determine which parts to beleive, etc. If you’re thinking of homosexuality, I don’t want to get all bogged down in that again either. It’s condemned, in my opinion (is that better?) in both OT and NT the way I interpret it. You don’t have to agree with my interpretation, nor I with yours. I’ve don’t the best I can here, if that’s not satisfactory, I don’t know what to tell you. Am I the only person here on this board that believes as I do or if there are others, are they not saying much so as not to get everyone riled up? If I’m the only one, don’t know as there’s much sense in me staying around tho I’d like to.
Buddhism, to go by strict definitions, isn’t even really a religion, right?
Wow. That’s some pretty stunning arrogance there.
Seems to me that if God wanted to send someone to spread His word to the SD community, he’d have done better to send someone at least marginally acquainted with logic and debating techniques.
His4Ever-then, simply, if you don’t want to have to explain and defend your views, perhaps you would be better off staying out of certain threads?
Maybe stick to ones that are less provocative, for starters. Or look and lurk.
But you found out the hard way that, here at the SDMB, you cannot just drop in, say, “Well, I believe XYZ,” and expect people to just say, “oh, well, I disagree, but hey-she’s allowed her own opinion.” You ARE allowed your own opinion-but if you state that opinion here, you BETTER be prepared to back it up.
OP By grienspace
Or, I have you mixed up with some other poster. Anything is possible.
In hindsight, I think I did mix you up with december, for which my abundant and humble apologies.