Sopranos 4-15-07 'The Sacred and the Propane'

Cafe Society
21

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]
I hope it’s Paulie. I know that most of the main characters on this show are criminals and murderers and thugs, but Paulie is a whole brand of prick unto himself. He’s a prick in so many little ways as well as big ways. There were a couple of examples tonight, like his yammering on his cell phone during the movie and his comment when he heard that Johnny Sack was dead (“I beat cancer, Johnny didn’t”). He never misses a single opportunity be an asshole. He’s like a genius at it. You’d think he’d forget to be a prick once in a while but he never does.
[/QUOTE]

Speaking of Paulie. Before this season started, we were skimming through the DVDs of last season. During “Live Free or Die,” Carmella and Rosalie are talking about Vito being outed, and Rosalie says, “He’s the last person you’d expect!”

Now, assuming there’s any reason to “expect” anyone (which is another reason that phrase bugs – if you never thought about it, of course you never expected it), who would be the first person you’d expect? I was about to say no one, but then I thought, “Paulie is vain, finicky, never married, and until recently, very devoted to his mother. But he’s straight, while the closeted guy is overweight and married with two kids.”

But getting back to the vain and finicky part, that’s often been used to humiliate him, like in “Pine Barrens” and the ep where they went to Italy. And is he not the one who perpetuated the Ginny Sack mole joke? You’re right: of all the crew, he’s the only one (besides Ralphie, but he’s long gone) who would still be a jerk in or out of the Life.

Poor Johnny. Mr. Rilch took a phone call halfway through the episode, and came back when it was over. I refused to tell him anything.

I also noticed the bit in the bar scene with Timothy Daly’s character. “…so that’s probably why you’re confused.” “Why would I be confused? I never saw it.” Perhaps he is a bit condescending!

22

[QUOTE=Rubystreak]
I wonder if this is foreshadowing some open conflict between Tony and Christopher coming up.
[/QUOTE]

I think it absolutely is. I like Tony’s line to Phil about how Phil’s family is so dysfunctional, like they have slugfests during Monopoly or something…

23

Good gravy. I believe this will go down as one of the best episodes ever. Cleaver, Johnny Sack, Profaci’s kid assassinated, the interplay between Christopher and Tony (can’t wait for the scene where Paulie gets the order to take him out), and the friggin’ awesome scene with Phil.

I totally expected for Phil to finish that speech with his announcement that he was getting out. Instead he went the other way and is killing Tony and who knows how many others. Leotardo. Effin’ brilliant.

And then that song at the end - maybe the best musical choice so far, and that’s a tall order.

My favorite line, which made me laugh out loud it was so true (paraphrasing): “I always like an Arnold Palmer, but I never think to order one.” (Someone please correct me - I’d love to have that one verbatim).

24

I only caught the last 20 minutes, but I loved the malapropisms:

Little Carmine: “So my dad’s looking at this… this… mellifluous box…”

Carmela: “well, irregardless Christopha”

Chris: “you’re my cousin and I love you, but I don’t like what you’re inferring here…”

Gotta catch the first half tonight.

25

[QUOTE=Argent Towers]
Paulie is the type who would be loyal to the end. He’s like Tony’s pet bulldog.
[/QUOTE]

Except for that time he was willing to sell Tony and company out to New York, because he felt Tony was neglecting him while he was in jail.

26

There were lots of great lines in this episode, but my favorite may be, “Can we have cake now?” from an exasperated child.

On an emotional level, I agree with Diogenes. Paulie is a grade A premium prick. I like seeing him get hurt. But on a thematic level I want him to survive. I recall in an earlier season when Christopher was explaining the idea of a character arc to him, and Paulie said that he didn’t have one. He spent a few years in the army, a few years in the can, now here he is. One of the first things Janice ever said to (or at least about) him on the show was something like, “Jesus, Paulie is still alive?” He’s like a cockroach: unpleasant, common, and preternaturally tenacious. There’s just something compelling to me about the idea that he might possibly outlast them all and still not amount to a goddamned thing.

So, is anyone going to watch the “Making of Cleaver” featurette? Let me know if it’s any good. Looks like it could be hilarious. I hope it’s put on the eventual “Season 6 Part 2” DVD.

Where is the terrorism plot thread going? A tip to the feds about some suspicious activity could sooth Tony’s aching conscience and give him a morsel of moral redemption. However, I’d be perfectly happy if they didn’t go anywhere dramatic with this. It works well as context. Every mention of weak security at ports reinforces in our minds Tony’s fundamental problem - his job supports his family very well; it also endangers them. If port security was ramped up his job would be hurt, and he’d be less able to support them in their accustomed lifestyle. But they (and everyone else) would be safer.

(It’s the same as the duck food attracting the giant ursine metaphor last season. Ducks = his family; duck food = bringing home the bacon; bear = danger attracted by duck food, which endangers his family)

It’s amazing that I actually felt a twinge of sympathy for John Sacrimoni. Regardless of the fact that he was a terrible person, it’s awful to see someone die of lung cancer. And I especially felt sorry for his family. I just wanted to give Allegra a hug. (And maybe it’s just me, but I think she’s very cute.)

The ending of this episode was terrific. The music, the baptism, the unwarm hug between Chris and Tony, it just all fit and promised so much. I have no real idea how it will all end, but I hope the last scene of the last episode is Tony and Carmella sitting next to each other watching ducks.

27

[QUOTE=BlackKnight]
It’s amazing that I actually felt a twinge of sympathy for John Sacrimoni. Regardless of the fact that he was a terrible person, it’s awful to see someone die of lung cancer.
[/QUOTE]

That was hard to watch. I did like the character, but I’ve also spent too much time in hospitals this year.

28

There is a god…Johnny Sac gets to make love to a cig again prior to checking out.

I have a feeling Cleaver is not going to rake in the $$ expected for the investment and Chistopha will blame the producer, who will pay the price.

Carm is stirring up some sh*t over the scenes from the movie and applying them to real life.

From the previews, looks like we finally get to see Uncle Jun again next week.

29

I hope nobody minds my saying this, but can we avoid posting what happens in previews (or at least use spoiler boxes)? Speculating about what might happen is one thing,* but saying it spoils it for those who want to enjoy the show as it happens.

I love to watch The Sopranos in unadulterated format, to let each episode happen to me fresh. I don’t watch the scenes at the beginning because they show a couple of scenes that are coming up, and I turn it off as soon as the credits roll.

Does my request make sense to anyone else?

  • I also hope that, if this suggestion is acted upon, no one tries to be clever and interject preview material as their speculations.
30

[QUOTE=Diogenes the Cynic]

That was a very interesting look from Chrissie at the end. I don’t think he’s ever gotten over what happened to Adriana.
[/QUOTE]

Which is another example of Chris’s hypocrisy. He almost killed Ade himself but he had to run it by Tony first. “Will Tony get mad at me if I kill her? I’d better check. And hey! Maybe Tony will take care of it for me.” Weasel bastard son-of-a-bitch.

I’d like to think he feels something for Ade, but he seems to have moved on. I don’t like Paulie either, but Christopher’s the one who needs a comeuppance.

31

[QUOTE=AuntiePam]
I’d like to think he feels something for Ade, but he seems to have moved on. I don’t like Paulie either, but Christopher’s the one who needs a comeuppance.
[/QUOTE]

I used to like Paulie. Maybe I’m remembering wrong, but he used to be more of a comic character. He has turned ugly and sour and vicious, but as he said, he has no arc, so killing him might not have the impact of Christopher going down. Like you, I find Christopher pretty sickening. I’d like to see him get what he deserves.

I think Carmela may be picking on Christopher because she is still thinking about Ade. She hasn’t accepted the “she met another guy and disappeared” story, maybe she’s wondering if Tony had something to do with it. Though I don’t know if it’ll happen, I hope she does find out what happened to Ade; maybe it’ll come out if someone rats, or if her body was found. That would blow the family wide open.

Mehitabel, interesting idea that Blanca’s pregnant. That would be dramatically interesting.

32

[QUOTE=Rubystreak]
I used to like Paulie. Maybe I’m remembering wrong, but he used to be more of a comic character. He has turned ugly and sour and vicious, but as he said, he has no arc, so killing him might not have the impact of Christopher going down. Like you, I find Christopher pretty sickening. I’d like to see him get what he deserves.

I think Carmela may be picking on Christopher because she is still thinking about Ade. She hasn’t accepted the “she met another guy and disappeared” story, maybe she’s wondering if Tony had something to do with it. Though I don’t know if it’ll happen, I hope she does find out what happened to Ade; maybe it’ll come out if someone rats, or if her body was found. That would blow the family wide open.

Mehitabel, interesting idea that Blanca’s pregnant. That would be dramatically interesting.
[/QUOTE]

If Carmela had been convinced Ade was helping the FBI to get Tony put away, she might have taken out Ade herself. She would have at least tried to get her out of the country as fast as possible. Carmela only has enough conscience to extend as far as not impacting her accustomed style of living.

Jim

33

[QUOTE=What Exit?]
If Carmela had been convinced Ade was helping the FBI to get Tony put away, she might have taken out Ade herself. She would have at least tried to get her out of the country as fast as possible. Carmela only has enough conscience to extend as far as not impacting her accustomed style of living.
[/QUOTE]

I agree to a certain extent… she’s very selfish. But I do think she might quail at the idea that Ade was murdered by Sil and buried in a shallow grave somewhere. It might take something like that to get Carm finally to contemplate the kind of evil she’s living with. Or maybe not, who knows where David Chase will go with it, if Carm ever does find out?

34

[QUOTE=What Exit?]
If Carmela had been convinced Ade was helping the FBI to get Tony put away, she might have taken out Ade herself. She would have at least tried to get her out of the country as fast as possible. Carmela only has enough conscience to extend as far as not impacting her accustomed style of living.

Jim
[/QUOTE]

Carm has always been able to push the bounds of self-delusion about Tony to justify her lifestyle, but it’s always just been self-delusion. She readily allows herself to be lied to, and let’s that wall stay up, but she would never have allowed Tony to touch Ade.

Has she ever done or seen something that she can’t “delude away”?

She’s trying with Ade. She totally bought the original story, but when she ran into Ade’s mom at the festival last year, it started putting cracks in that wall she built up. This season, they’ve brought it up in both episodes, really shoving it in her face in this episode.

You think?

I see this as being one of the major story lines this season. . .Carmela finally having to deal with where her lifestyle comes from. If they find Ade’s body (which wouldn’t surprise me), the question is going to be which way Carm will finally go with it.

35

Don’t get me wrong, I like the show but they’re all a bunch of sociopaths. I wouldn’t be unhappy to see any of them “swim with the fishes”. They all pretty much deserve it.

36

[QUOTE=Joey P]
Anyone else notice the backhanded slam against Verizon.
[/QUOTE]

Not to hijack, but I LOVED it, for reasons of my own. I wonder if Verizon can sue.

37

She’s not an idiot, she’s known all along. Remember when she went to the psychiatrist and he told her and it shut her up pretty quick? That’s why I said before I’d like to see her end up penniless at the end and working at Walmart.

38

[QUOTE=Caridwen]
She’s not an idiot, she’s known all along.
[/quote]

Sure, she KNOWS on some intellectual level. But, she still won’t admit it to herself. That’s the primary conflict of her character, wouldn’t you say?

It’s still a step removed from admitting. She wanted someone to play into her fantasy world, and when he wouldn’t. . .that was the end of that relationship.

“I’m living on blood money,” is not part of her daily reality. She denies that Tony is vindictive. She denies that they might have whacked Adriana. We, the viewers, are subject to the same conflict. . .we “like” these guys; they’re funny and colorful. We’re intrigued, and we watch, but they are rotten guys.

39

[QUOTE=Trunk]
Sure, she KNOWS on some intellectual level. But, she still won’t admit it to herself. That’s the primary conflict of her character, wouldn’t you say?

It’s still a step removed from admitting. She wanted someone to play into her fantasy world, and when he wouldn’t. . .that was the end of that relationship.

“I’m living on blood money,” is not part of her daily reality. She denies that Tony is vindictive. She denies that they might have whacked Adriana. We, the viewers, are subject to the same conflict. . .we “like” these guys; they’re funny and colorful. We’re intrigued, and we watch, but they are rotten guys.
[/QUOTE]

Maybe that’s why it’s a good thing the show is ending, at least for me. I really don’t “like” any of the main characters anymore. I did in the beginning, but I don’t anymore.

40

[QUOTE=Trunk]
“I’m living on blood money,” is not part of her daily reality. She denies that Tony is vindictive. She denies that they might have whacked Adriana. We, the viewers, are subject to the same conflict. . .we “like” these guys; they’re funny and colorful. We’re intrigued, and we watch, but they are rotten guys.
[/QUOTE]

For what it is worth, the only one of them I like is Silvio and he was the one that whacked Ade. The rest of them are nasty, vicious, dumb or at least very selfish. The characters are mostly unlikable. This is the biggest difference in character development from the Godfather, where many of the main characters were likable.

Tony is thoroughly despicable with very few good points. Christopher is a waste of Carbon as is AJ. Carmela is complete snot. Meadow is very stuck up, whiny and self-deceiving but at she is pretty and smart and has a chance to break away. Paulie actually has not a single redeeming quality, quite remarkable. Phil is a nasty SOB, through and through. I guess Bobby B. is not too bad but his wife might be the worst of the bunch. etc.

Jim