The point, doorhinge, is that you said, ''I don’t buy tickets for plays, or attend plays, to hear actors/make-believe specialists spout their own words during, or after, the play. They should just recite the words the writers wrote and let me leave the theater deeply enmeshed in the play I paid to see."
Ravenman’s point was that the actor was reciting the words the writers wrote. The statement was written by Lin-Manuel Miranda (creator and writer of the show), Thomas Kail (the director) and Jeffrey Seller (lead producer).
Also, Mike Pence was on Fox News Sunday today, and this event was discussed. The transcript is here if you want to read his response. I thought his response was better than Trump’s. Among other things, Pence said, “And – but at the end, you know, I did hear what was said from the stage, and I can tell you, I wasn’t offended by what was said. I’ll leave to others whether that was the appropriate venue to say it.”
The crux of your argument seems to be that Hamilton has nothing to do with modern politics, and I’m not sure if you are aware how obsessed young progressives are with this show, or how innately political it is. Part of the whole point of it is to give ownership of history to people of color, who have long been excluded from the conversation. It would be like attending the musical American Idiot, which is based on an album excoriating the Bush administration, and being surprised if the writer had something to say to Dick Cheney.
To me, that is worlds different than someone using a random event to air their political grievances. If every celebrity did it all the time, yeah, it would get annoying. But I don’t think this particular instance is a very good hill to die on.
So, all he had to do was say “Healthcare” and “Jobs,” and that was enough to get him elected?
He hasn’t yet proposed a single workable idea for fixing either of those issues. And, saying that you are going to scrap everything that is currently in operation, without proposing a plan to replace it isn’t itself a plan.
LOL yeah go try that. I would LOVE to see the look on the house manager’s face if someone tried to get a refund after the show had ended because they didn’t like something the cast said. That would be comedy gold.
And you know they were also giving a speech to the audience asking them to donate money for AIDS charities right? Is that also gonna “degrade your personal play-viewing experience”?
Pretty much agreed but more when its done at the request of one side or the other more than a simple statement like that made by the Hamilton cast. Both Parties tend to honk me off when they start pulling the celebrity card.
Also, I’m not sure how Hamilton’s statement can in any way be construed as ‘‘being the expert.’’ There was no claim of superior knowledge, certainly no arrogance. It was more of a personal appeal based on anxiety about being left out of the national dialog.
But if your issue is not the fact that celebrities have the ability to reach a lot of people (owing to their popularity), then you are really just complaining that people you don’t know (I assume that you don’t know George and Amal) are expressing opinions you don’t agree with.
Do you feel similar fatigue whenever you see somebody driving a car with a bumper sticker touting some viewpoint you don’t support? If not, why do you care what a stranger who shows up on your TV or movie screen believes?
Well apparently what Hillary had to say wasn’t enough to get her elected. I’m also sorry if you misinterpreted my post to think all he had to do was say a few words. At some point he either said the right words or she said enough of the wrong ones. He’s not going to walk in and completely scrap Obamacare his first day and people really need to realize that. He knows too many people would be affected, but based on election results a lot of people want some kind of change.
Let me use an example and maybe you will get the point I was trying to make. I do not know the first thing about cars. So, you probably would not want me telling you how to repair yours. I was trying to make a general statement that celebs that are spouting off about their political positions are often not speaking from a vantage point of being very knowledgeable about the topics they support or are opposed to. It was a generalization, so as with any generalization there are exceptions to the rule and I’m sure some celebs are well read and understand the issues they speak about. General statement, no complaining here, but I seem to have touched a nerve with you. Is George a friend of yours?
Have you read the statement read at the curtain call after the performance of Hamilton? It says, “We, sir, we are the diverse America who are alarmed and anxious that your new administration will not protect us, our planet, our children, our parents or defend us and uphold our inalienable rights, sir. But we truly hope this show has inspired you to uphold our American values and work on behalf of all of us. All of us.”
Nothing about that statement requires the speaker to have any familiarity with the issues or politics.
Edited to add that if I met Donald Trump or Mike Pence now, I’d probably tell them something like, “The whole world is counting on you. I hope that you’re able to govern well.” The subtext, of course, is, “Please don’t fuck things up too badly.”
“I seem to have touched a nerve” is a tiresome and over-used internet trope, seeking to infer from the level of push-back that the speaker’s deep insight must have revealed some deep truth that the interlocutor is desperately seeking to suppress. That inference is simply ridiculous. People also push back to debunk nonsense and when they simply disagree with you.
Oh, ok, you come across as a psychologist that analyzes the generalizations and common phrases people use on line trying to find some dark sinister meaning. So, let me put it in simpler terms, obviously, I’ve pissed you off. I was trying to say it in polite terms the first time. Analyze that.
No, but good job jumping on a throwaway joke in order to completely miss my point, which was to say that you shouldn’t give two shits what somebody like George Clooney says, since it has as much importance in your life as the opinion of the guy driving down the street in the hoopty with the faded ACLU sticker.
To use your car repair analogy: if someone came up to me and started telling me how to repair my car, I wouldn’t pay attention unless I valued their opinion. If I disagreed with them, or thought they didn’t know what they were talking about, I’d walk away. I wouldn’t stand there and become irritated that I’m hearing their opinion.
When similarly confronted with the political opinion of a celebrity, why don’t you do the same thing? Don’t tune in when they show up on Charlie Rose’s show. Don’t follow their twitter feed. Don’t read articles where they admonish you how to feel.
In short, stop letting people you don’t know, and don’t agree with, “touch a nerve with you”.
What I don’t understand is why people think if you are a celebrity, you shouldn’t tell your opinion, as if being famous suddenly stops you from being a citizen. Political decisions affect them as well. I know this thread was started in response to Hamilton, and in that specific case, the actors involved aren’t even known beyond the NYC theatre scene. The actors in the show now are not the ones who were on all the talk shows and magazines. These people are nowhere near being famous among the general public, they are not millionaires living in a bubble away from regular people, so why shouldn’t gay/black/Latino/HIV+ people speak out against policies that directly affect their own lives?
This thread is not your conversation with just one person. Please do try to keep track of who said what.[/QUOTE In that quote you have from me I was responding to Riemann which I think is how it posted, I’d have to look again. I realize there are many people in the conversation. Did I not respond to the correct poster?
This thread is not your conversation with just one person. Please do try to keep track of who said what.
[/QUOTE In that quote you have from me I was responding to Riemann which I think is how it posted, I’d have to look again. I realize there are many people in the conversation. Did I not respond to the correct poster?[/QUOTE]
I thought you thought that his comment (in reply to your comment to me about touching a nerve) was directed at me. I’m willing to accept that I was mistaken. Such is life!