The Boston Red Sox

nice bump, Jackmannii.

I missed this thread the first time around, and I only have one thing to say.

the Sox really do have a shot at it this year. pitching this well, with these no-names (send Cone back down, please), and hitting this well, with no Nomar, and continuing to win games despite Jimy Williams’ best efforts, this could be the year.

another team, over in the NL, who is looking astonishingly good? gasp! The Cubbies! 12 games in a row!

hmm… Red Sox… Cubs… Red Sox… Cubs…

Just call me NostraWhite Lightningus. I can now predict the day of Armageddon… the Second Coming of Jesus Christ… the Final Reckoning. In short, the End of the World will occur during the late innings of Game 7 of the 2001 World Series between the BoSox and the Cubs. Obviously neither team could actually win.

This isn’t a reply to RickJ’s unworthy trolling in the OP, just a question to him. I too had the pleasure of watching the Red Sox he despises sweep the Jays in SkyDome, including Manny’s record-distance HR into the top deck yesterday, but the most noticeable (and scary) thing was all the empty seats. There couldn’t have been more than 15,000 or so people there to watch a good, competitive team play a weekend series against a division rival; both teams have some of the best players in the game, and fer crissakes Toronto is one of the continent’s largest cities! As for the noise level, it might as well have been a tennis match - apparently Canadian “fans” now think it’s impolite to distract the players. Games were like that at the bizarre Exhibition Stadium, but they seemed to have gotten the idea in the '80’s.

It wasn’t that long ago that the Jays sold out every game, the joint was rocking, the ticket sales and cable subscriptions made them one of the highest-budget teams in the game, and they could embarrass the Expos with all of that. But it’s gotten to the point where the Sox announcers commented each game on how far back into the Toronto papers’ sports sections they had to go to find any mention of the hometown team - the worst case was Page 9, after all the hockey news.

So the question is: What the hell happened there? Why are Toronto, and apparently the rest of anglophone Canada, now sour on their team? Is there still some resentment over the '94 strike or what?

The team has sucked for years. It’s hardly any surprise fan interest is down. I don’t think it has much to do with the strike, since the real dropoff in attendance has been over the last three years. (Actually, attendance was 25,000 yesterday.)

It’s offtopic, but Blue Jays attendance started to dwindle in the mid-90s when the team was purchased by Interbrew, a Belgian brewery. The team has since gone to hell organizationally, not only running the on-field product poorly but doing a horrible job off the field as well; at one point in 1998 they were actually threatening to move back to Exhibition Stadium if their taxpayer-funded Skydome didn’t charge them less rent. They changed the uniforms and logo and at one point actually took down the championship banners because they didn’t want fans thinking about the great Jay teams of the past (I am not making any of this up) and even got rid of the old mascot, BJ Birdy, to sever ties with the years of glory. Last year they actually decided to have cheerleaders, dancing hos who came out between innings and danced on the dugout roofs; these young ladies were greeted with encouraging comments like “Down in front!” and “Get the hell out of the way!” so that experiment didn’t last long. Between 1995 and 2000 they barely marketed themselves. In other words, we have here a baseball team that was run by people who knew nothing about baseball or the team they owned and frankly didn’t care anyway.

They’ve essentially looked and sounded like a second-class organization for years and they have gotten the fan support they deserve. I don’t mind at all. Teams that get big support even when they lose usually never win anything. Ask a Cubs fan. Or, to get local, a Maple Leafs fan. The Maple Leafs get great attendance even when they stink. And they lose, and lose, and lose some more. Why try to win if you’re filled to capacity when you lose?

So you have a team that has looked like a bunch of classless jerks and hasn’t won a single thing in years and in recent weeks has been the worst team in major league baseball, which did nothing to improve itself in the offseason out of sheer stupidity - look at the Mike Sirotka fiasco - and which in the eys of every Jays fan is flailing hopelessly because the first level of management (e.g. Buck Martinez and Gord Ash) is comically incompetent. I would compare them to the New York Yankees of the late 80’s and early 90’s when they were just terrible, George Steinbrenner had pissed everyone off, and their attendance was way down.

No surprise to me they’re not drawing; it’s damned hard to support a crappy team led by jerks, and that sort of PR disaster can affect you for years.

Fortunately, the team was recently bought by local interests and over time things will improve. You will see a remarkable uptick in attendance once they WIN something. Even a wild card. And don’t tell me they can’t do it, because Seattle is 43-12 after losing A-Rod, Griffey, and The Big Unit. Someday, eventually, the Jays will win the World Series again. The Red Sox, of course, will not.

You’ve all forgotten one thing.

It’s tremendous fun to be the fan of a team that seems to struggle so terrifically to regain their long-lost greatness, and several times… almost… make it… but never quite.

It runs like an epic, and I don’t think I’d be as much of a baseball fan had I grown up in any state other than Massachusetts.

I don’t care if the Red Sox ever win! I love just being a fan. I love Fenway Park. I love watching the team play, even when they flub the game in the ninth. I love the story, and the legend of the Curse (even if there really is no Curse, but who knows?) I loved when everybody got rude and threw things when umpires made bad calls during the Red Sox/Yankees pennant race awhile back.

Seriously, who wants to be the fan of a team that does nothing but win, win, win? How boring to be a Yankees fan. Of course, you shouldn’t take that remark seriously because as a proper Sox fan, I HATE THE YANKEES. No, it’s not rational, so don’t bother to rebut :slight_smile: :slight_smile:

Yankees suck! Go Pedro!

You gotta give the Sox credit–they’re doing all they can to screw things up this year.

They’ve got a perfectly beautiful 5 man rotation, when they decide to demote Okha and toss Crawford into the pen. Now, Wakefield was pitching great, so swapping him with Crawford in the rotation probably makes sense. But demoting Okha–who was 12th in the league in ERA–for washed up, over the hill, sucked last year and will probably never be good again David Cone? Sure enough, Cone is living down to expectations.

Now, I hear they’re interested in trading for David Wells, whose had an ERA of over 5 and a losing record since last year’s All-Star break. Wells is the last guy they need, especially with Okha still toiling in the minors. He’s just a big 38 year old money pit.

Add in Shea Hillenbrand and Mike Lansing, and it’s a miracle the Sox are where they are.

Curse? We don’t need no stinking curse! We can sink ourselves, thank you very much.

(Note: I’m not a Sox fan in any way, shape, or form–I live in California. This is just an honest assessment of the situation.)

Well, of course Cone is living down to expectations. but they made that bad decision before the season even started. as far as demoting Ohka to bring him up, it’s what i would have done, too. clearly Pedro and Nomo are staying. You’re left with Castillo, Ohka and Crawford-- 2 rookies with no contract issues and plenty of ballgames in their future, and a journeyman pitcher on his 5th team who’s got below average stuff and a short-term contract. You really think Jimy needs more guys in the clubhouse mad at him? (Well, my answer to that question is actually “yes,” because I hunger for Jimy Williams to get fired the way I dream of sitting down and taking a 20-minute crap after I’ve been at work all day drinking smoothies and eating $1 chinese food as my only solid foods in several days. that was lame. but it’s the best i’ve got at the moment. anyway i hate the bastard.)

anyway, we’re committed to Cone now, at least for a while. you think one ailing veteran is bad, wait till Sabes finally finishes his rehab. That’ll have to be the WORST 3-Cy-Young-winner rotation ever fielded.

Hey Renman, have you ever noticed that not only do the yankees suck, they’re also all fantastically ugly?? Think about it! It’s frightening! When I read about Clemens getting booed at the BoSox’ 100-year celebration the other day, I wept with joy. What I wouldn’t give to have been there for that moment…

I will now use my pschic powers and predict the end of this baseball season:

Cubs vs Red Sox in the World Series. The Series will go all 7 games. Then, with the score tied heading into the 9th inning, the Earth will actually open up and swallow both teams, ensuring neither gets the World Series win.

6 posts previous:

think we both stole that from the same source?

You’re so right. Another ring? Yawn. Another regular season sweep of some poor schmoe team? Ho hum.

It really is boring winning year after year. There’s nothing more sleep inducing then being the fan of the greatest team of the 20th century and, give or take another 94 years or so, the 21st century too.

We Yankee fans are just sooooo tired of all the pennants and stuff. Really.

Yankees suck. The rest of the league swallows.

I just did that as an example of how stupid a person can look when one doesn’t read the entire thread. I hope you all have learned from this example.

I’m going to crawl back into my hole now. It’s not my night.

Well, at any rate I’m sure someone does, somewhere.

But at least you can rest assured that you have a great sense of humor-- you tell the same jokes as I do.

Betcha that just made you feel all better, eh?