The CanaDoper Café, 2013 edition.

Getting back to this issue: as I understand the argument, it’s not simply rule by the French; as you state, that ended over two centuries ago. The argument is that the social mind-set about government corruption was largely created during that time, and became part of the social mores in New France. As I said, I don’t know enough about it to say whether that’s a valid argument, but from what I’ve read about political corruption in other countries, one of the strongest indicators about why corruption exists is not the lack of anti-corruption laws, but the level of social acceptance.

As well, I’m not sure I agree with the assumption that we’re not someplace where baksheesh rules, but I also don’t want to make it sound like everyone in Quebec is in on it, and accepts it.

On the first point, and following up on Cat Whisperer’s comment, one of the points that came out at the Charbonneau Commission testimony a few months ago is that everyone in the construction industry knows that pouring concrete is more expensive in Montreal than anywhere else in Quebec. The price per cubic yard is higher for construction projects in Montreal. Why should that be? it just is…

But, and this is something I can’t emphasize enough, is that I don’t want my comments to be interpreted as suggesting everyone in Quebec is corrupt. That’s not the case. Much of the Quiet Revolution was about Quebecois pushing back hard against corruption.

We tend to think of the Quiet Revolution as mainly about social, linguistic and religious issues, but at the time, a big part of the driving force for the Quiet Revolution was outrage in Quebec about the level of corruption. That was one of the factors that brought people like Trudeau, Pelletier, Marchand, Levesque and Ryan into public affairs.

The Union Nationale was widely seen as corrupt; it was an unholy marriage of the elites in Quebec (both franco and anglo) running the province without a lot of democratic accountability. For instance, in its 20+ years in power under Duplessis, the U.N. never charged membership fees nor ran fund-raising drives. How can a political party afford to contest elections successfully for decades without money? Well it had money…just didn’t feel any need to tell anyone where it came from… It wasn’t until Duplessis died that the UN started moving towards more openness and accountability, but by then it was too late for its survival.

Think of the major civil liberties court cases that came from Quebec in the 50s - the padlock case, the oppression of the Jehovah’s Witnesses by the police, the Premier personally pulling Roncarelli’s liquor licence to put him out of business; all of those were indicators of a deep corruption issue.

And, I want to make it clear, I’m not saying it’s everyone in Quebec - the reformers of the Quiet Revolution pushed back hard against corruption, with considerable success. When Levesque came to power, he brought in some of the most stringent campaign finance laws in Canada. Trudeau at the federal level pushed hard for the Charter, because he saw the guarantee of basic rights as one of the best measures to prevent corruption.

Nonetheless, studies of corruption across the world indicate that once it is established within a body politic, it is very difficult to eradicate. Rigourous enforcement of anti-corruption laws are important, but the social mind-set is equally a factor. That too has to change for corruption to be eliminated.

You called it: dismissed with costs.

Who was funding this appeal? Mr. Magder?

I thought I read that Mr. Magder was relatively happy with the results of the original case and didn’t want to appeal. Am I just confused?

Gotta love that s.40. I wonder if there will be an up-tick in jump-the-line appeals to the SCC once the OPCA/Freemen-on-the-Land types suss onto it.

We had that yesterday evening, and on Monday as well. Plenty of rain, thunder and lightning, hail, and other unpleasantness from the sky.

Heck, I only had time for nine holes after work before the storm hit.

Good comment, Northern Piper, and thanks!

Welp, he’s gone the Glenn Beck “BUY GOLD BEFORE TEH OBAMA RUINS THE WORLD!!1!!” Route. He called Glenn Beck one of the great political minds of our time. I mean, I’m relatively conservative, especially by comparison to my left leaning classmates, but Jesus H, that was shocking to read.

Then there were the other things, like tweeting during the GOP Florida primaries that Romney “had the Spic vote locked up,” that really made you question his political savvy, and basic intelligence…

Wow. That’s a little disappointing to hear actually.

RCMP Senate expenses probe code-named Project Amble

Ha ha ha ha ha

How are things in Calgary for Cat and Jimbo?

Are you evacuated?

Holy shit!! I hope you Albertans are doing okay! Between the floods and the sour gas, it looks pretty rough right now.

I was just coming in here to post - “It’s official - Alberta’s under water!” :eek:

We live on quite high ground (the top of a hill from two directions and well up from any rivers), so we don’t anticipate flooding where we live. There are definitely parts of Calgary that are flooding, though - anywhere close to a river, basically.

A couple of small towns close to Calgary (High River to the south and Canmore to the west) are badly flooded, from what I hear. Some major highways are impassable at this point, including the #1 in the mountains and the #22 in the south.

Holy shit, the Alberta Emergency Alert just came on the tv! Mandatory evacuations in low-lying areas, including six neighbourhoods in Calgary!

Another couple of neighbourhoods have just been added for evacuation orders - including the neighbourhood Jim and I used to live in! :eek:

This story came out of the blue for me, although we’ve had a shit-load of rain in June here in Eastern Ontario.

Is the flooding primarily due to the same storms moving from west to east, or is there some other underlying event that took place, like a late snow melt or something?

Leaffan, I’m no meteorologist, but from what I can glean from the news, the storms are circling around a low-pressure area centered in southern Alberta. So it’s not moving anywhere; it’s just dumping everything it’s got, over and over and over.

In Lethbridge, we got hammered on Wednesday evening. Total rainfall was just shy of three inches in a few hours, together with hailstones that in some cases, were the size of golf balls. We’re not in nearly as much danger here as they are in Canmore, High River, the Calgary neighbourhoods, and other places, but our city was still under a state of emergency today. The problem was the local river; there was a concern that when the dam was opened (had to be opened, otherwise floods would occur upstream), the bridges connecting one side of town from the other would be inundated. I don’t think that happened, but if I cannot get downtown tomorrow, I’ll know why. But we also saw the storm sewer system unable to keep up: streets flooded, water was lifting manhole covers, underpasses flooded, schools closed, and so on. Even this afternoon, the city basically shut down at 3:00 p.m. so people could just get their kids from the closed schools and daycares, and just get home.

I think (but I’m not sure) that the snow melt is still playing a role, too - the rivers are higher than they would be later in the summer, with not much room to grow from all the dump of rain we’ve been having.

Knowing that it is absolutely the wrong thing to do, we still want to go see all the flooding areas tonight! Human nature, eh?

I am very concerned about you guys and my eyes have been glued to either my TV or to news sites on my computer for the past few hours, but it is only Southern Alberta that is [del]fucked[/del]flooded at the moment (notice I did say “at the moment”).

Edmonton has just has somewhat gloomy weather the past few days, although we did have tornado warnings on the 12th (I think). That was rather exciting.

ETA Oops - Forgot about poor Fort McMurray (north of us). I think they are still flooded too, but due to rain a few days ago.

Hope you folks are on high ground. Scary stuff.

It is interesting how different areas deal with the weather. There has been talk that when a storm signal 8 is raised to keep on working rather than sending people home. The reason? Lots of people just go to the bar, restaurants or movies rather than go home. These are the same levels of hurricanes that wipe out huge swaths of the US. Here, Hong Kong, it results in a mud slide or two.

Just popping in from Calgary to say hi and best wishes for anyone else in the area! They’re evacuating parts of downtown now and some of the bridges are closed down. My husband and I are on Canada Task Force and my husband is out on one of the water rescue crews right now while I’m on standby (I’m rear party and actually on leave, so I probably won’t be called on). I went down to Edworthy at around 6:30 (a park down on the Bow) and the river had almost crested it’s banks. It looks like it’ll crest and flood Memorial if we keep getting rain and more surges tonight.

It’s another plot by Harper to get rid of the CBC.