This is circular reasoning - you’re saying he’s an expert on nice guys because he’s worked with a lot of nice guys, but who defined the people he worked with as nice guys? He did. He could say he worked with Charles Manson and he thought he was a nice guy, if a bit quirky. There’s no objective standard here.
And you are clearly confused about what “nice” means in common usage(pedophiles? really?), so the definition you’re using is suspect as well. You mostly seem to be saying a nice guy is whoever this guy says, regardless of their actual behavior.
I really hate that the term “nice” has been permanently corrupted by self-described nice guys. I think it’s entirely possible that sexually frustrated self-described nice guys (SDNGs) may harbor some dark sexual thoughts towards the women they feel unfairly reject them, but every single guy I’ve dated or been friends with has been genuinely nice and and also honest and open with regards to sex. Even kinkier confessions have come with an expressed desire to also please a partner. If a guy is polite and reserved 99% of the time and wild and uninhibited in the bedroom doesn’t make him a pervert. There may be a distinctive difference between his everyday persona and his bedroom antics,but I don’t believe for a minute that unassuming types are hiding a secret sadistic side.
If the author is lumping unassuming, conservative types in with the practiced, superficially charming groomers of in trusted positions, I think he is wrong to do so.
Teachers, cops, priests, judges, football coaches, etc who use a trusted position of authority to prey on victims. They seem nice and trustworthy, but are actually predators in disguise.
JohnClay, in general, emotional needyness and a big need for approval is a bad thing to have. It is a drain both on the one who feels that way and on the people around him who have to validate him (or her) all the time.
Also, if a guy confuses being nice with “lying about my sexual interest and pretending I don’t have sexual wants”, then he comes across as insincere, and that annoys and irritates people.
I can also imagine that such a guy becomes confused about his own sexual thougths and desires and starts to label them as “black” because he himself feels they shouln’t exist.
It is really as simple as that.
Much the same can be said about Nice Girls, but they usually are conflicted not about sex, but about feeling competetive emotions like agression, jealousy and ambition. Those emotions, in a Nice Girl, surface in the same shadowy, half subconscious passive agressive way and have the same grating effect on those around them.
But the Nice Guy syndrome has been debated ad nauseam on these boards.
A mre interesting question is: why do you ask? Do you think of yourself as a NIce Guy? Or do you get told too often that you are not a Nice Guy at all, and do you want to defend yourself by arguing that Nice Guys aren’t all that fantastic either, and Dr Glover thinks, so, too?
The archetypal hyper-masculine Hollywood hero is overrepresented in the media and doesn’t reflect the infinite range of good, trustworthy men in the world. There is nothing inherently sinister about being shy, unassuming, or acquiescent. I disagree completely that genuinely nice people harbor secret, impotent ugliness towards others.
Actually, about the only time I hear it used that way is from women on the internet complaining about men. Offline and from men on or offline I almost always hear it used to mean “men who are nice”. When I hear a man offline say that women don’t find nice guys attractive, they typically are talking about the common impression that women prefer abusive or criminal men to ones who treat them kindly, not to the “nice guys” of internet fame.
I’d have to see evidence that women prefer abusive or criminal men. I’ve never seen that anywhere but in television drama. I do see a lot of unattached men who observe others from the wings and jump to false conclusions about what they think they see. They mistake joking and teasing for meanness. They see a jock who spends time playing golf or watching football as someone who is “neglecting” his significant other in favor of stereotypically masculine hobbies. They take note of attached guys who are jovial with other women and label them as disloyal. In other words, if a rival likes sports, displays a sense of humor or fun, enjoys chatting with strangers, or otherwise conducts himself with confidence, the SDNG will assign nefarious motives and damning behavior in an attempt to paint himself in a more flattering light.
Most of them wouldn’t fit Dr Glover’s description:
“He is the guy who frustrates his wife because he is so afraid of conflict that nothing ever gets resolved.”
“He is the man who lets people walk all over him because he doesn’t want to rock the boat.”
“Nice guys tend to be disconnected from other men and from their own masculine energy.”
By dark sexual secrets he means compulsive pornography use, etc, or perhaps having child porn… (BTW I knew a guy who liked child porn and he was a “gentle giant” [what the mental health people called him]
I disagree that meek = perverted. There is an infinite range of testosterone levels, cultural values, family dynamics, and inherent personality traits that can lead to submissive behavior in men and there is zero evidence that deviation from the archetypal masculine male model leads to or indicates sexual deviance. The author has drawn a conclusion from his own personal opinion, which is the polar opposite of evidence.
“Overcoming the Nice Guy Syndrome: How to Stop Being Shy Without Becoming A Jerk”
I agreed with the part of the tapes that said that nice/shy guys talk quietly with no passion - like they’re bored or almost dead.
In my life I sometimes talked to girls while expressing interest but it ended in failure far too many times. In some situations where I could have touched the girl (e.g. we were being set up) I didn’t know what to do and so avoided the situation. I was used to understanding and controlling things - I was extremely good at school. I was afraid of certain types of failure so I started to avoid situations I might fail at. Every now and then I’d get out of my comfort zone with women but I’d fail miserably.
I identify with having the nice guy syndrome for much of my life but at university I changed.
It’s hard to know… apparently “Nice guys try to hide their perceived flaws and mistakes” so it would seem that they wouldn’t want to tell their friends all about their porn habits (e.g. 2 girls 1 cup or whatever)
Me, too. Unlike your author, I’ve had long term relationships, friendships, and sexual relationships with nice guys, and my experience has been exactly the opposite.
Also he identified with being a “nice guy” (his definition) - surely he’d have more insight than someone who doesn’t identify with having that syndrome.
If you feel there is some personal benefit hidden in this faux research, then my words probably won’t dissuade you. But I’d take his unscientific, unvetted claims at face value: the opinion of one man based on his own prejudiced and slanted view of his subjects.