Sigh.
I guess if the plant had been demolished and the entire area sprayed with nuclear waste, then maybe you’d give up, huh?
Obama is President of the US, so wherever a plant gets re-opened or re-tooled is a win for him. His responsibility is to the whole country. He doesn't have a lot of ability to force the management of any company to do it in a particular locations (that's usually done by local politicians and state government offering tax incentives, or, in the case of Wisconsin, busting unions). But there's another guy whose responsibility is directly to the people in that city and that district. The plant closed on his watch. And when GM was making decisions about what plants to retool and where, he was apparently nowhere to be found. Yet in his speech at the RNC, he explicitly states that it's his belief that there's something that government could have done to keep that plant open. What's Ryan's excuse? And how does he reconcile "the President should have done something!" with the whole "We built it!" motif? Do you believe in government intervention in business or not?
What the fuck are you going on about? The plant was locked up, it was not demolished. This administration has owned a stake in GM since 2009, and even got its CEO fired. NOTHING prevented them from exerting their influence to have the plant re-opened and re-tooled.
I’m not even saying he should have. I’m saying the point being made about when the plant was closed, how that absolves Obama by virtue of making the issue closed, is a non sequitur. It’s irrelevant.
You’ll have to ask him, but I suppose he’d say he didn’t make that promise, Obama did. And to re-iterate, the Treasury had and has LARGE influence over GM. It’s kind of a unique situation.
Obama doesn’t know how to make cars. More importantly, perhaps, Obama doesn’t know how to sell cars. To people who have no money to buy cars.
Sure, I want a President who keeps his promises. Unless he finds out he shouldn’t. If his personal promises are more important than the common good, fuck that shit!
So if he re-opens the plant by executive fiat, he’s a dictator sticking government’s grubby fingers where they don’t belong, and if he doesn’t re-open the plant by executive fiat, he’s an incompetent promise-breaker.
Gee, thanks for giving us such attractive arguments! It’s such fun arguing with fair-minded nuanced interlocuters.
Why is a humorist so necessary?
http://www.hulu.com/watch/396928#i0,p9,s8,d0
You can probably skip to the 8 minute mark.
I don’t think I’d take exception with this. I’d categorize this as “shit politicians say on the stump to get elected,” and it occurs in both parties. If it were a Venn diagram, the overlap with the category “stuff that will happen” won’t necessarily be significant. But smart politicians–and Obama typically is–don’t set specific expectations unless they plan to meet them, or they have to deal with the consequences.
That’s the point of this thread, though. This was fair game for Ryan, IMO. If Obama wants to shrug his shoulders and say, “hey, things changed on the ground,” so be it, and let the public decide how to process that. But the sentiment in this thread, people getting the vapors over Ryan’s comments, is a bit silly (also IMO).
prr, your post is a straw man, by the way. That was quite a zinger at…somebody, I guess.
I must have you confused with someone else Stratocaster. From some reason i don’t recall you as one to engage in this sort of thing.
The entire Republican Party is a strawman? Good to know. I don’t think much of them, either.
To elaborate: they don’t know what they want, or what the fuck they’re complaining about. When he tries to do anything to affect private business (as if that’s not part of his job description) he’s an interfering socialist. When he abstains from policies that affect private business, as in not forcing GM to re-open that plant in Janesville, he’s ineffectual. Which part of that does the Republican party not believe to be true?
Yes.
False. You keep sayin’ it, but it ain’t gettin’ any truer.
Try reading one of the many cites that show your position is FALSE.
Numerous cites have shown that the plant did NOT close prior to Obama taking office. Perhaps you should read them.
Completely false. Again!
I’ve given you the local newspaper story from December 2008 detailing the last day. Yeah, mop ups on an existing contract were to continue to spring, but the plant was closed. Repeating your falsehood over and over and over will not make it true. The closure of the plant was planned and occurred prior to Obama even taking office.
Read the cites I provided. Or not. I’ve got better things to do than have you digest reality by having to hold you by the scruff of your neck and sticking your face it it repeatedly. :rolleyes:
We may need a separate Lyin Ryan thread, but I’ll plop this here for now. Ryan was recent caught lying about having run a sub three hour marathon:
http://news.runnersworld.com/2012/08/31/paul-ryan-says-hes-run-sub-300-marathon/
Jesus, why not be content to say you’ve run one marathon? That should be impressive enough. No reason to massively embellish your time.
One photograph for those who don’t like to read:
OK, so those workers got the date wrong! Probably in a hurry to get to the unemployment office, start sucking down those big fat checks, the lucky duckies!