The Supreme Court has kicked off Civil War 2.0

Some of that is a bit misleading since the cost of living in NYC is so high compared to other places. If those people moved out of the Bronx and into upstate new york, they would be middle class most likely. Just nobody wants to live out where there isnt many jobs and the weather is worse.

Race and class are intertwined since America’s hierarchy is based on race, but class is probably more important than race. If people are poor, it kind of doesnt matter what class they are. Being a poor white person might suck a little bit less than being a poor black person, but poverty sucks in general.

Yes, there are tons of wealth there. But mostly there is poverty. The millionaires in Tribeca are voting solid Republican. It is the impoverished who provide massive Dem majorities in those places.

I dont think you been in a major US city if you think that its mostly poverty. Are you binge watching Fox News lol? Seriously, get outside sometime. Its not some hellhole that you been programmed to believe. People are paying lots of money to live in those cities since they dont want to waste their whole life in a gas guzzler. Those cities have lots of wealth since lots of business is done there. They want to walk to work and go to nice restaurants. They dont want to be stuck on some crappy highway wondering what they are doing with their lives.

And I highly doubt millionaires in Tribeca waste their time voting in a solidly blue state. If you were a millionaire in Tribeca, why you waste your time going to vote? You would give your money to some PAC and go about your life. The upper class doesnt participate in the circuses that the common man deals with.


Knock of the personal attacks. Do this again and you’ll receive a formal warning. You can discuss these issues without making it personal.

Not really an insult since its the same rhetoric that republicans constantly repeat. They constantly talk about how cities are hell holes and look down upon them like they are all like mad max but that is further than the truth. I am not allowed to call out someone repeating the same one liners that have been repeated ad nauseam?


No, you’re not, if you’re going to make it personal. Which you did.

This is a formal warning for arguing moderation outside the About This Message Board (ATMB) forum.

If you’re going to post here, I suggest you acquaint yourself more closely with the rules before proceeding. Thanks.

…well, no it isn’t. Because the Democrats won the majority of those voting in 2016 and still lost the elections.

There isn’t some magical formula to follow that will win the Democrats the next few rounds of elections. The Republicans are actively perusing voter suppression, gerrymandering, they are stacking bodies that certify elections, they are going after every vote from school boards to city council.

And this strategy will win elections.

“Win the majority of those voting” isn’t a strategy.

It’s an outcome.

Going back to what AOC said in her thread: this is what she wants:

The progressives are not the enemy here. What they are doing right now is demanding that the leadership step up to the plate. People need to know what they should be doing now. It isn’t enough to just say “vote.” It isn’t enough to just put your faith in the centrists, and to just hope and pray that they win in November.

Biden, Harris, Pelosi, they need to step up right now.

Im not trying to argue but I dont see how Im making it personal. The person is making a common talking point from right wing media and Im calling them out on it. If they dont want me calling out, they need to come up with original thoughts and not just repeat what they heard on the news.

I will just leave it at that and take your suggestions into my further posts. Thank you.

Yeah, she’s being very much a proper politician saying things that make complete sense:

  1. Winning by a gazillion in coastal California and downstate New York and losing by a hair everywhere else is still losing: strategize where to invest effort.
  2. You can’t beat something with nothing. Even if the something is bullshit. So in those races where you are investing effort, have a platform that says “here’s how things would be better for you if we get a real functioning majority”

Actually, there is somewhat of a magical formula to win elections and as much as nobody wants to hear it, its by nominating centrists who cater to the lowest common detonator. People piss and moan about biden, but people nominated him for that exact reason. When your trying to win the electoral college, your not trying to win NY or Cali or the New England area or whatever other liberal areas there is. Your trying to win alot of flyover places and alot of very suburban boring areas, hence why they try to cater to those types of people.

The progressive strategy could be worked and become a viable political strategy if progressive strategist understood who they are trying to win. They are trying to win your average joe out in the midwest. They are trying to win out some suburban middle class black family out in the Atlanta suburbs. They arent trying to win over yuppies on the coasts since they already have those votes. People complain that the politicians arent exciting or that they dont do enough, but Americans in these battleground areas want politicians that are boring and dont change much.

The people got what they wanted, boring politicians. Its what they asked for and what they are getting. Until the electoral college goes away, its just always going to be that way. The liberal high income parts of the country just dont matter in national contests.


Implying that someone is binge watching Fox News and not getting outside enough is definitely a personal insult.

I’m going to give you a pass once – just once – for continuing to argue moderation in this thread and not give you a second warning for doing it.

I strongly suggest you step back, take a breath and acquaint yourself with forum rules, P&E forum rules in particular, before posting further.

…this is not, in fact, a magical formula. Catering to the lowest common detonator is just a way to blow everything up.

So in simpler words: you agree with AOC. She wants the Democrat leadership to tell people what’s the actual need? Which specific seats are we focused on? WHAT votes do we need & WHERE (what states + races?)

I wonder if what we are seeing is a more global phenomenon than just the US, something like the decline of the nation-state. It is, comparatively, a recent thing, and born from a particular moment in a particular form of economics. With that economy stumbling–it’s always done that, stumbling from depression to inflation and back–and changing, particularly changing into a economy that is not based primarily on production but on finance, does the nation-state have any real function anymore? It may end with a bang or a whimper, or both, but perhaps it has out-lived its usefulness for capital and lost its emotional appeal for the rest of us?

I mean, thats all going to be relevant based on where you live and the political culture there. I used to live in Florida to where nobody seems to care about whats going on. I now live in PA and people here are alot more politically engaged. Its going to be up to whatever states the people live in to determine if their votes mater or not.

…so in other words: you agree with AOC.

No lol? I just explained why I dont. Its up to the voters to figure out if their votes matter. Your either know that the state you live in your vote will make a difference or not just by what you deal with on a daily basis. The DNC doesnt need to make the obvious even more obvious.

…there is no surer way to guarantee losing the next election than this. Not even the current Democrat leadership are going into the next election with a plan this poor.

Since you know so much about political strategy, maybe you should get a job at the DNC. Clearly your lightyears ahead of the current administration and can give them some pointers since its obviously they are all wrong and you are 100% right.

…I wasn’t talking about the current DNC strategy. I was talking about your proposed strategy of “not needing to make the obvious even more obvious.”

Im not proposing anything. I am not a professional political strategist. This is just my opinion.

But clearly you know lots of about political strategy and instead of becoming a consultant that can make lots of money, for some reason you would rather donate your free time and energy and resources to arguing on a message board.

I just am not going to keep talking about this with you. Clearly your mind is made up and you do not want to have a discussion so I will leave you be.