Well, that’s very stupid.
So, if the kid had come back with a big hog ring in his nose you would of been happy with that and not made an issue? I think the boy is being used by you and his dad to get at each other.
Besides making me laugh, this also made me want to ask, so which is the wrong ear?
Just so we know.
A child cannot make proper value judgements for themselves, especially when it comes to stupid stuff like appearance. They are thinking peer pressure, or trying to be like Menudo (or whoever is popular these days). It is a parents job to make those judgements for them. Kids are not ‘miniature adults’, and treating them as such is detrimental to their long-term progress, even though it may make parenting seem easier in the shortrun.
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Sure. Look at the great success trannys enjoy in mainstream society. You can A) Expect several billion people to magically change the way they view cross-dressing, or B) You can tell your kid, “Goddamnit, get out grandmas dress. At least get a kilt!”
Sometime in my 40s my wife bought me a diamond earring. I didn’t have a pierced ear so it was a kind of “don’t be a boring old fart” challenge. So I went and got my ear pierced. I thought it looked pretty cool. From the comments at work equal numbers of people thought I looked like a dickhead. Soon my teenage son thought he should be like dad and get his ear pierced. Keeping in mind the large negative reaction to earrings I tried to discourage him. See I’m 40 odd, in fact I’m the boss at work, if I want to look like a dickhead that’s my perogative. Things may have a different slant for a teenager about to go job hunting.
As to the OP I’d be getting the earring back from Dad. And discovering a cyst on son’s ear that stops him wearing it. Until he’s 40 odd.
Respecting a person’s individuality, no matter what the age is an important thing to me. This does not mean I would let the child wear shorts in the winter, or a winter coat in the heat of summer. There are limits to self expression, versus practicality/health.
I just don’t see wearing a dress to see what it’s like as something that would damage the child. Yeah, I’d likely ask the child if they were over say, age 3, to change out of it if we were going to the store or something, but just to play in, why not? ( could understand what kind of crap he’d get from ignorant people, even if he was innocent.) A kilt is definitely allowable, but those things are EXPENSIVE!
I think a child can make value judgements for themselves, within reason. You have to “cultivate” it. One way to do that, IMO is by respecting the child’s right to express themselves, and guide them in how to do it in a healthy manner. Yeah, you are the parent, and can “veto” some things. Just use the “veto power” sparingly. Consider carefully whether or not it’s just a matter of conflict of aesthetic tastes, or if it’s just not practical for whatever reason, then take action.
Example: “Yelling at the top of your lungs, throwing things, or hitting people are NOT acceptable ways to show you are angry! Go sit down until you are calm enough to talk to me about why you are so mad.” Or: “No, I know you love those shorts and that tank top, but it’s COLD out there, and you need nice warm clothes to wear for school. You can wear them when you come home from school if you want. Go get changed.”
Also a thing I did with 2 year olds: “You’re mad? Do the mad dance, stomp your foot down, and say I’m MAD!” After they had done this, and gotten some of their frustration out, I’d ask “Can you tell me about it? Show me what’s making you mad.” And: “Even though you are mad, this is not a good thing for you to do, and you are not going to get your way in this, so stop acting out.”
Yes, I really did speak to them “normallly”. They could understand me perfectly well, and the oldest one had a large vocabulary. He blew his kindergarten teacher’s mind because he used the word “comparable” correctly.
Teach them that expressing themselves is a good thing, and how to “balance” doing so, and co-exist in society. Let them experiement, and learn what works for them.
Surely you experimented in some ways with various hairstyles and ways of wearing clothing as a teenager? Some people are just more “bold” than others. Sounds to me like your objection is more due to “personal aesthetic taste” and a bit of dislike of males you percieve to be “feminine” than anything else. Ease up, it’s likely a stage, and even if it’s not, it’s the child’s life not yours. They will have to start “living and learning” some day.
My brother had an ear pierced when he was around that age, with full parental permission – they figured it wasn’t worth fighting about, and it was his ear. He only wore it for a couple of years at the most, I think. I don’t see anything wrong with earrings on guys.
I would hate for you guys to be using the fight over his earrings to get back at each other – but if it’s the kid’s idea, GOOD FOR HIM.
I must have a very odd family. If my brother came to us and said, “Oh, by the way, I’m gay,” our response would be, “Cool. Whatever. Watch out for the assholes out there.”
For all those taking the OP to task, allow to me say I find you utterly ridiculous.
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All earrings are vanity. That’s the point for Chrissake! No one will die/not get a job/be discriminated against for not wearing earrings regardless of that person’s gender. So why, then, is it wrong for a guy to get his ear(s) pierced but OK for a girl? Its equally vanity and hardly earthshattering these days.
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The whole dress thing seems to be coming off as “I don’t want my son wearing a dress because I don’t think he should wear a dress because… I don’t think he should wear a dress!” OK you’re the parent. This means you can tell your child what they can and cannot wear, but please, for all that’s holy, have a HALFWAY DECENT REASON FOR IT other than the fact that it eeks you out. I could see not letting them wear it in public for fear they’ll get hurt, but never? Get the fuck over it.
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The OP is using him to get back at the father? She let him get his ear pierced for the sake of some vague, on-going war? I seriously doubt it, given the facts. First, the father was informed and consented to the earring beforehand. Second, the son requested the earring as a birthday present. Third, the OP seemed genuinely confused about the right ear = gay thing, as did her son so its not like they deliberately did it to squick out the father. The two earrings thing maybe, and I’m not sure how cool that action is at the moment when emotions are still running high, but the son doesn’t seem to be an unwilling accomplice in this act.
In short, it was an earring. It was not a tattoo or anything which will never go away should the child decide he doesn’t like it. Think its ugly? Well he can do what many people (including my brother) decided to do: let it scab up and heal up. No muss, no fuss, end of story. If it were a tattoo then I could see the whole “too young/not enough responsibility” argument cropping up, but this is nowhere near. The kid seems to be well-balanced and healthy which is ultimately all that matters.
The Great Unwashed said,
Not that I abide by this, mind you, but the old standard is, “Left is right and Right is Wrong.”
I’ll weigh in with **Priam ** on this one.
Good Hell! Its an EARRING! A one the boy wanted apparently.
If he changes his mind it can go away! And he never has to let that ugly little scandal out of the bag.(heavy sarcasmhere)
Let Marli parent her child and (almost) everyone go back to armchair quarterbacking the football game.
Hasn’t anyone noticed that Daddy Dearest seems to be pushing his homophobia onto the kid? That’s what really struck me.
What’s wrong with being gay, Dad? What’s wrong with people thinking I’m gay because of the earring? Huh?
Yeah, what Priam said, basically. I’m a child of the 80s; everybody who was anybody had a pierced ear. To me, it’s not that big a deal, and honestly I’m surprised at the number of people in this thread who seem to disapprove.
I’m not now nor have I ever been “at war” with his father. While we don’t see eye to eye on many issues (I swear once he turned 25 he became more uptight than my dead grandmother ever was), he’s a conscientious guy who’s quite dedicated to teaching the boy all the manly arts of huntin’, fishin’, and campin’, which I’m more than happy to let him do because I don’t hunt, I refuse to camp unless there’s air conditioning and room service involved, and my idea of fishing includes a good book and a cooler full of beer. Sometimes I don’t even bother to bait the hook before I throw it out. I still catch fish, though. We got stupid fish in Missouri. Anyway, my main bitches with the man right now are:
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He nullified my birthday present, after assuring me he would leave it alone. That would be like me declaring the sweater he gave the boy for Christmas too ugly to share my living space and poking it into the fire with a sharp stick.
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The homophobic crap. I had heard the garbage about “Left is right and Right is wrong” back when I was in junior high; even then nobody believed it. Kind of like sex bracelets today. (The boy came in wearing one of those jelly bracelets the other day, incidentally. I asked him where he got it and he said from one of his girl-friends, adding that he was going to wear it to Grandma’s house just to see if she’d freak out. Bless her heart, she believes her spam.) I mean, they were actually worried the gay guy at dinner was going to hit on my son if his earring was in the “wrong” ear. If he ever answers the phone I’ll have to be sure to ask him if his grandmother is in the habit of asking pedophiles over for the holidays.
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He won’t answer his phone so I can discuss this with him. Okay, I’m going to give him the benefit of the doubt and assume he’s not been at home every night for the past week, but that idea is stretching kind of thin, considering the man has no social life whatsoever.
So there you have it, in a big rambling disjointed nutshell (I haven’t slept). I found his initial actions disrespectful towards me, his reasoning for said actions reprehensible, and his subsequent avoidance of me cowardly.
But he can’t avoid me forever…MWAHAHAHAHAHA!
I’m somewhat shocked that the old “left is right and right is wrong” earring on right ear = gay crap still survives in the dawn of 2004.
If the kid wants an earring, he’s old enough to have one. Mind, they have long since become the province of people trying way to hard to be “cool” (which pretty much describes your average 13-year-old–as well as many 48-year-olds).
Brutus, I agree that maybe the kid should have been older, but earrings on guys are so common that nobody really notices anymore.
I should know. I had one. And I’m anything but a wannabe punk.
Traditionally MEN wore the unbifurcated garments. I wear a utilikilt about all the time, and I’m completely straight. That’s a bit different from a dress of course. I wear it for comfort reasons. I’m thin with a 33’ waist and a 28’ length of leg. Nearly all pants and jeans in that size are made for fat kids and don’t have anywhere near enough room in the crotch for me. Add to that the fact that I despise underwear, and a kilt is a nice comfortable choice for me. I also wear japanese style hakama pants and wrap pants that my SO was kind enough to make for me. Grow up, drop the homophobia, grow your your beard, and be what nature intended you to be.
Cheers!
Eh. I’m certainly in the “it’s just an earring” camp, but sort of on the other side.
It’s just an earring. Why on earth would you go so postal (your word) that you’re screaming and punching the phone?
A lot of people don’t like earrings on men. A lot of people don’t like earrings on boys. Whether their reasons are acceptable (taste) or not (homophobia), the bottom line is – a lot of people don’t like them on men or boys. Your ex-husband is one of those people. I fail to see why he should have to respect your opinion on matters of his son’s appearance while his son is in his own home, when he doesn’t like them. IMO, even if your son had an existing piercing that was not at risk of closing up, your ex would be fully within his rights to tell him to take the earring out during the visit. Because your ex doesn’t like it, and your ex sets the rules for his own home. If your son decides to make an issue of it – “accept me as I am and let me dress as I want, or I’m not coming to see you” – that’s up to him. But if he chooses not to make an issue of it – which, wisely, he appears to have chosen exactly that – then he must follow his dad’s rules.
And I don’t think your reasons for being so excessively angry are very persuasive:
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He nullified your birthday gift. Sure did, but only “nullified” it because the hole closed up because the piercing was new, which isn’t his fault. Why is he required to respect your judgment in matters of taste regarding your son, when he disagrees with you?
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The whole “I don’t want you to look gay” thing – massively stupid, and it certainly should be explained as such to your son: There’s nothing wrong with being gay; wearing an earring can’t make you “look” gay; unfortunately your dad’s apparently a bit of a homophobe, which is sad for him, but we know better, don’t we? Irritation, sure; but rage? No.
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He won’t answer the phone. First, that’s his perogative. Second, if he suspected you might react as you admit you initially did, he has good reason not to answer the phone. Third, if you are right in suspecting he’s doing it to avoid you and bug you, then you shouldn’t give him the satisfaction of suceeding.
So the boy comes home, and the hole is closed up. So you take him in and get it re-pierced, BFD. Why all the drama? I’d probably be a little pissed myself but seriously – this is the far too piddly for a full-on freak-out.
And I agree that the whole “He doesn’t like one hole?? We’ll get you two!” things sounds immature and like you’re using your son to get back at your ex. He pissed you off, so now you’ll piss him off worse!!! You sound like a very good mom, but if I were you I’d consider whether getting back at the ex really motivated my actions, in whole or in part, and if the honest answer to that is “yes,” then it’s a tendency I’d try to watch and avoid.
In my yoof I got my left ear pierced, and then everyone was doing it, so I got my right one pierced too, then everyone was doing this, and then I very sensible gave in. For 10 years I’ve been ultra-cool and not worn any (though the holes are still “open” – I’m amazed that i can thread a ring or stud without a mirror still).
Anyway, I wanted to mention that I was offered a cereal bar today – it was a Geobar (I’ve never heard of them either), and instantly I thought of you. Weird!
Also, in Manchester in the 70s I swear that it was de rigeur amongst hard men to have their right ear pierced, maybe they wanted any excuse for a fight, or just that no one had the nerve to tell them not to.
Of course, you are right, it is crap, everyone knows sexuality is indicated by the colour of your socks.
Jodi: I think one reason she’s pissed off that you’ve either glazed over or missed is that she told the ex it was happening and he agreed the kid could wear the earring down there. Whether or not he was particularly enthused about the idea doesn’t enter into it. The man flat-out lied about what would happen.
Also, while he may be the boy’s father, it doesn’t sound like he has done much to support the kid day-to-day and thus I’m not exactly sure his opinion counts for very much. If he’s hocking up serious cash and time to support his boy then maybe they’d be relevant, but he ain’t. Yeah, he takes the kid fishing, camping, blah blah blah, but how much of the serious stuff is he handling?
I’m surprised no one has mentioned this yet - the way I always heard it, the right ear was “gay”, and the left ear was “drug dealer”! When you look at it that way, the right ear is far more desirable…
Yes, very.
I did read the OP’s later post where she said the husband has not paid support and has only ever been consulted about “major” matters with the son. However, a lot of parents would consider this a somewhat “major” matter (not saying whether they’re right or wrong). When I got my ears pierced at 11, my mom consulted my dad about whether it was an OK thing to do at age 11. My dad was pretty hands-off in deciding most things, but Mom thought it was important enough to discuss it with him…because a lot of parents have strong opinions about piercings and tattoos, etc., on their kids.
It seems like you and your ex have stumbled into a confusing situation here. He’s never paid support, so you feel entitled to discount his opinion and help unless it suits you. On the other hand, you’ve asked for his help re: the kid’s schoolwork, and he’s provided it. He might be thinking that he now has more say about what happens to his kid.
Maybe you two should try to have a mature discussion about what the boundaries of the dad’s role are and should be, instead of filling your kid’s ear full of holes in what honestly looks like a juvenile “tit for tat” attempt to get back at him. That is, if your ex stops his equally juvenile attempts to avoid talking to you.