My vote goes to the Order of the Phoniex and the Philosopher’s Stone. The first is too long, the plot drags and it does not do a good job of moving the story forward. We could loes everything that happens except learning about the prophecy and it would not affect the series at all.
I have always thought that the first, second and third books and the last three are in many ways completely different, the first three clearly children’s books, the last three are clearly not (and Goblet of Fire is a bit of a half way house), but Harry Potter 1 shows Rowling at her weakest, her writing style is immature the story is short (I think Philosopher’s stone concludes in the number of pages it takes Harry to get to Hogwarts in the later books) and the characters wooden and one dimensional. Perhaps it sufferes when compared with the later books.
IIRC there was an interview with JK Rowling where she said the length of Order of the Phoenix was mainly due to the number of locations she needed to introduce, or explore further, in order to facilitate the later books. In OotP we first see the Ministry, Saint Mungo’s, deep in the forbidden forest, the department of mysteries, Grimmauld Place, the isolated lands where giants live, the room of requirement, and more. It bore the brunt of a lot of exposition in breaking the series out from Harry and his little circle of friends, to the wider world. In the other books the world came to them, or the focus was on them as they passed through it. There’s just no way we could have had the whirlwind chase through the wizarding world that was The Deathly Hallows without it. In fact, the movie series NOT biting this bullet is probably why Deathly Hallows, the film, will have to be a two-parter.
I pretty much agree with you about Philosopher’s/Sorcerer’s Stone though.
St Mungos is not important, it adds nothing except shows Neville’s parents and his motivations, something that could have been done anyway. The Min of Magic could have had a cameo earlier perhaps. I agree about Grimmauld place though.
Not according to the books I have. PS is 309 pages. I checked GOF and OoP since they have the longest pre-Hogwarts sections–Harry gets to Hogwarts on page 171 in GOF and page 200 in OoP. (And I’m not counting the pages covering the Hogwarts Express journeys…I’m counting from the actual arrival.)
Of course, you have to allow for differences in format, American vs. British, hardback vs. paperback, adult vs. children’s, but as far as I can tell it’s not even really close.
As for my contribution to the thread, it’s hard to say. Like someone said upthread, you really can cut the series in half when talking about what kind of books they are–it doesn’t really seem fair to compare Philosopher’s Stone to say, Half-Blood Prince.
And even though I know Goblet of Fire has all kinds of plotting problems, it still manages to charm me.
So I’ll have to say Philosopher’s Stone, because it’s the one I’m least likely to re-read. Because it’s truly a children’s book, which just isn’t that interesting. Although I do love the section where Harry and Ron first become friends.
I wasn’t expecting a literary masterpiece so I’m more forgiving with writing style, However there seemed to be a lot of forced and unnecessary confrontation between the kids as the books progressed and it shows up in the movies.
I agree the OoTP really slogs along, and I thought that there were a few ideas that could have been dropped to shorten it up, or enliven the pace. Although when I will admit that I didn’t enjoy my sophomore year of high school for the same reasons that I didn’t enjoy Harry’s. I got a thick vibe of over-angst from the characters in that book, especially Harry. And despite the plot issues in Goblet, it’s my second favorite behind Half Blood Prince.
I agree that there are problems with OotP, but it’s my favourite. I love all the little details. Actually, I think I could read an entire book just describing people and places in the Potterverse. I think the St. Mungo’s chapter was one of my favourites in the series.
My least favourite is probably Chamber of Secrets, just because it was still a children’s book, like Philosopher’s Stone, and didn’t have the novelty factor. I also haven’t been able to bring myself to reread Deathly Hallows. But the weakest, in my opinion, was Goblet of Fire, just because the whole Triwizard Tournament made no sense. Still loved it, though.
I’d have to say that Deathly Hallows was my least favorite. There were too many loose ends still lying around, and instead of clearing them up, she introduces a whole new Macguffin to base the book on. I suppose you could also blame that on the earlier books for introducing those threads, or for not introducing the Hallows thread, too, though.
Order of the Phoenix is actually my favorite, followed by Prisoner of Azkaban. I think the primary reason is that I really appreciate good teachers, and both of them have good teachers in them: In the third one, we finally get a good Defense teacher in Lupin, after it was starting to look like that post would be held by one villain or failure after another. And then, in the fifth, we see Harry himself as a teacher, and can really suddenly appreciate just how far he’s come.
I’m surprised for the lack of hate of Goblet of Fire. The entire storyline in that book makes no sense at all - I mean setting up an entire tournament (which Harry enters - against his will - due to a loophole which Dumbledore should have seen through from the very beginning) just to make sure Harry grabs the vase portkey? Meanwhile they have an undercover teacher at the school who could have just handed Harry a book which was charmed as the portkey at any time instead?
My least favorite by far is The Deathly Hallows- especially the first half. Too much wandering through the woods, not enough Hogwarts. I don’t mind how it ends but I really did not like the “where they ended up” prologue-thingy. The first book and the last I would not re-read, but for different reasons. I liked the first book quite a bit (how bad could it be, considering it sparked a remarkable series?) but it was simple and not much could be gained from re-reading it. But the last book was more “at least I know how it ends” but it was not very satisfying to me at all.
The Deathly Hallows is by far the weakest book. Between the hurry-up-and-wait for most of the book and the bad fanfiction epilogue… I can’t believe the movie producers think there’s enough plot to stretch into two movies. Oh, I’ll see them, but geez.
that’s true but nothing about any of it is properly explained. The entire plot hinges on a complete lack of public awareness of magic despite all the muggles married into the fold. The Chamber of secrets has a snake the size of bus runnning through drain lines of Hogwarts. You could go on and on about the flaws in the books.
Goblet of Fire definitely wasn’t my favorite (although I loved the part with the dragon, and the betrayal at the end made my blood run cold), but as I recall, the point there is that no portkey could be active within the boundaries of Hogwarts, because of the protective enchantments Dumbledore had laid down. The trophy was a specific exception allowed by Dumbledore, so only the location to which one would be pulled was changed.
OoP was my least favorite - until Deathly Hallows, anyway, because the Hogwarts bits in the other books were great, and there the unending negativity was just boring. The movie was a big improvement by cutting the hell out of that part.
I agree about the excessive wandering in the woods in the last book, and I was not thrilled about who Harry ended up with - though it was probably inevitable.
I like Philosophers Stone because of its introduction of the world. Sure it is more of a kids book, but Harry is too young to be expect to handle the stuff he has to handle later. I thought it a nice way of getting into the series.
Deathly Hallows was weaker than the Half Blood Prince no doubt, but it was still as good a book as could be expected, considering it was completely different from the others (no Hogwarts until the end) and being exceptionally violent, but I think it did a good job.
Now I, on the other hand, think HBP was really weak, and nothing but a setup for DH. I put DH on top. Even though the ending was weak and the body count was obscene, Rowling finally learned how to tell a story without a large section of exposition.
In retrospect, the Sorcerer’s/Philosopher’s Stone has to be looked at as the worst of the bunch. While the “hero’s quest” is a time-honored literary tradition, it’s kind of nuts that the stone is hidden behind puzzles that can actually be solved rather than hidden and locked away in a manner that ensures its security (e.g., a swarm of keys that DOESN’T include the correct one, just let Dumbledore keep the right key on his belt? Or an actual animated knight to guard the door instead of a chess board that a skilled player, magical or not, could beat?). Knowing what we do about the magical world, why didn’t Dumbledore just use a Fidelis Secret-Keeper charm over the Stone? Also, knowing what we do about how many classes and teachers there are at Hogwarts, how is it at all logical that the “protections” around the stone were only set up by professors whose classes the freshman Harry has?
Of course, the first book was no doubt written with much of the details of the series not yet planned in Rowling’s mind. But on re-read, the plot holes are incredibly gaping.
If evaluated in place (i.e., allowing for the first book being written without much of the details we now know about the magical world being true), I’d say the Half-Blood Prince is the weakest. The revealation of the Prince’s identity was just kind of thrown in at the end, in a very anti-climatic manner. If the book had been titled something else, maybe that wouldn’t have mattered so much.
Best book? I liked Goblet of Fire best, I think. I loved how all the sub-plots were neatly resolved (Rita Skeeter, Fred & George vs Bagman), how every little detail mattered (Bertha Jorkins, the disturbance at Mad-Eye’s house in the early chapters, Snape complaining about the Polyjuice ingredients missing from his stores to “Mad-Eye” who was near Snape for no apparent reason, all clues that the readers might have used to solve the big mystery of the book), the creepiness of Voldemort’s re-incarnation…the most tightly-written of the bunch, with the possible exception of Chamber of Secrets, and the plot was more complex.