Time for a change, Dems.

The BBQ Pit
1

Memo to the Democratic party: Your strategy is a total failure. Your wishy-washy centrist views and bland, lack-luster candidates have not won the hearts and minds of the American people, only driven them further right, as evidenced by Bush’s more decisive victory in this election. We need a change in vision and we need it now, or your core constituency will leave the Democratic Party for good in favor of a party that values us and does not disregard us in order to pander to flighty moderates and undecideds. The Republicans are not so cavalier about their base of power. Emulate success for a change, will ya?

My dear spineless Democrats, you must reclaim the word “liberal” and stop allowing it to be relegated to a pejorative term. Forcibly re-move the center back TO THE CENTER, and do not allow it to be pulled way over to the right as it is now. STOP allowing the Republicans to set the agenda and define where the center is. Grow a set and stand your ground-- create a qualitative, meaningful distinction between your party and the Republicans. If you don’t want a war, don’t vote for one. If you don’t want bills like the Patriot Act, don’t vote for them. Duh.

I hear the American people suddenly care so much about “moral values.” Why not remind them where the moral high ground really is-- with love your neighbor (even if he’s gay-- yes, just fucking SAY it!), with the Constitution, which guarantees separation of church and state and seeks to “secure the blessings of liberty for ourselves and our posterity.” What about beating swords into plowshares? What about “a camel shall pass through the eye of a needle before a rich man will enter the kingdom of Heaven”? Turn the Republican’s own rhetoric on them; cite chapter and verse when necessary. It’d be easy as sin if only the Democrats found someone with passion and vision and… actually gave him the nomination! No more bloodless old-money prigs. Give me a person full of piss and vinegar, damn it!

Finally, you, the Democratic party, need to openly return the love of your long-suffering, oft-neglected faithful: African Americans, gays, environmentalists, the urban poor, the old school lefties, the young people. Inspire them, show them the Democrats care about THEIR values and THEIR agendas, after taking them for granted for so long in order to court demographics that have proven their lack of interest. It’s time to remember that liberalism means caring about the little guy, caring about the planet, caring about the oppressed. This is our America too, dammit. Ignore us and eventually we’ll go away. In fact, many of us already have.

Until you do these things, the Democratic Party will hang its head in defeat as it did this Tuesday. And you know what? The Dems deserve it. Learn the lesson of 2004 and move back to your roots on the left. Hey, it works for the Republicans…

Signed,
A disgusted lifelong liberal and reluctant Kerry voter with no more illusions

2

I want to add a few things.
Next time “they” dredge up Rush, Hannity, Swifties etc to lie, take those lies, utterly disprove them, and then gleefully proceed to force those lies down their gullets until they strangle on it. Don’t be afraid to stand up and holler “Bullshit”.
Then, bring out your own goons to dredge up every vile thing you can find on them. Make accusations and start investigations. Fight fire with fire.

3

Great! That’s worked so well for you over the last decade. Keep it up. Middle America will keep choosing your leaders.

4

51%, dearie. Matter of fact, they’ve lost three out of four straight presidential elections. Spare me your hysteria.

5

Here’s the thing, SteveG1 and flickster: you’re both sort of right. I think Steve is right that the Democrats are afraid to call bullshit on Republican lies and fuck-ups. Why did Kerry never mention Abu Ghraib and Bush’s failture to fire Rumsfeld for that? Why did he never bring up the budget surplus that’s been squandered?

OTOH, becoming vicious, negative, and evil is not what I want to see either. I want the Democrats to tell the truth (I know I’m a dreamer, this thread is proof of that), take a meaningful, assertive stance on qualitative issues, and that is what will distinguish them from the Republicans. I think fighting fire with fire just makes more fire. How 'bout we fight fire with a good old-fashioned bucket of water? To murder that metaphor completely.

6

Um, no. The Democrats have completely failed to holler “Bullshit!” at any point, nor to convincingly sling any back. We do here, of course, as do media pundits from Andrew Sullivan to Michael Moore and Al Franken, but the Democratic Party itself just quietly sits there and eats the shit. I can only assume that the GOP has pictures of the entire leadership of the Democratic Party sodomizing Boy Scouts or something, because their sheepitude is otherwise inexplicable.

7

It guarantees no such thing. That is a judicial doctrine only.

What happened to the separation of church and state?

Someone like Thomas Jefferson?

Some of those groups can’t stand one another. But go ahead. Build a coalition of that group, if you can. The first “bump in the road,” and it’ll fly apart.

Stop, please. I’m getting all misty-eyed.

Really?

Unfortunatly, not true.

We moved left? :confused:

Obviously, not true. :rolleyes:

8

Huh? Bush won the last two elections, in case you’re still in denial about that. The Dems lost seats in the House and Senate this time around, and lost the popular vote as well as the electoral vote. The gap has widened, not narrowed. How many states passed anti-gay legislation this time around? Oh, every single one that had a measure on the ballot. If you think I’m hysterical, well, I’d call it outraged instead, and with good cause, minty my dear, with good fucking cause. The fact that you’re not shows that you’re not paying close enough attention.

9

Yes yes bloody hell yes. While we’re at it, let’s do the same for “intellectual” and “academic”.

And “Massachusetts”.

And let’s please put a stake in the heart of the idea that somehow the Republican party is the sole party of “moral values”. “Moral values” should mean more than “school prayer” or “ban gay marriage” or “repeal Roe vs. Wade”. “Moral values” should not equal “the Bible”; the Bible is only part of it. “Moral values” should include accountability, honesty, forthrightness, thoughtfulness, respect, tolerance, compassion, charity, decency, and humilty, to name a few.

This is something that liberals can get behind in a positive way, and it’s something liberals need to get behind before the social conservatives of the religious right can frame “moral values” entirely to their own advantage.

10

Remember, Clinton never got over 50% of the poular vote in either of his elections. Just in case it’s slipped your memory.

11

Remind me. How large a percentage did the Republican candidates get? It seems to have slipped my memory.

12

Well said.

13

Oh really? How so?

You can talk about God all you want, just don’t try to legislate your beliefs. That’s another way the Dems can meaningfully distinguish themselves from the Republicans.

Someone like Bill Clinton, actually, in manner if not in substance. I don’t think TJ would be elected today, what with all that owning of slaves, and the American voters (yes, I’m looking at you) penchant for labeling anyone who betrays the slightest sign of high intellect as an out-of-touch egghead. Nice try, though.

Oh, you’d like to think so, wouldn’t you? But guess what, champ? The ones that vote, vote Democrat already. If the Dems want to get out the vote, it’s non-voters in those demographics they want to court. Seems rather self-evident.

You’re hilarious. Truly. I mean that.

:rolleyes: back atcha. Going away from the Dems, not the country. The forced deportations of dissidents haven’t started yet, but hey, you have four more years. Yeah, :rolleyes: .

14

First amendment merely says:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

Some separation of “Church and State” can be inferred, but the radical extent to which liberals have run with it is an unfortunate judicial fiction.

Fucking Ex-Cuuuuse Me?!

I wasn’t the one spouting the Declaration of Independence and Scripture in the same sentence, Ruby.

Your blatant hypocrisy?

Whos’ teaching whom here about the Declaration of Independence and the Bill of Rights?

Well I tried, but some ignorance refuses to go unenlightened.

No, you’re hi-larious. Really.

To borrow a colloquialism from our neighbors across the pond: you’ve gone completely nutter.

15

It is really remarkable how narrow Bush’s win was. He had 9/11 going for him, we’re in the midst of a major war, and still Bush has to play up the ‘evil buttfuckers’ card to raise his percentages by a single point!!!
That’s pathetic. The GOP as it now stands is headed for the dustbin of history.

16

Actually, Squink, I think that you’re onto something. Party discipline has held this dysfunctional family known as the GOP together so far, but I don’t know if the duct tape and super-glue will suffice for too much longer.

17

It is amazing how detached from reality you must if you saw the same election I did, yet came to that conclusion. We won seats in both the Senate and House, we won the White House, and yet our party is on the verge of utter defeat? Does not compute.

18

I can agree with this, and I’d also apply it to some extent to the Democratic Party, though some of the shakeout there has already happened. I think we’re long overdue for a realignment. I had hopes that the Reform Party would do the trick, but it turned out to be just a vehicle for Ross Perot’s ego.

19

It means no prayer in public schools, no governmment funding of religious private schools, no banning abortion because it goes against your religion (if you don’t like abortion, don’t have one, and if you’re so interested in preserving life, then I guess you’re against the death penalty, but let’s not go there, shall we?), no Ten Commandments posted in courthouses. I don’t think those are radical. Neither does the Supreme Court, but your president will probably change that. Doesn’t make it right or radical, though.

It’s the [url=http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html#Preamble]preamble to the Constitution
[/quote]
, you moron. What a typical ignorant Republican, eh? You walked right into that one. Since you obviously need a brush-up, re-read it. While you’re at it, get your president to read it, possibly for the first time.

I’m rubber, you’re glue–if Bush can say he talks to God, a Dem can quote Scripture too, when it’s apropos. What you fail to realize is that a person can be a devoted churchgoer and religious person and NOT legislate those beliefs. I don’t know why this is so hard for you 'Pubs to understand.

I think it’s me teaching you about the Constitution and the difference between a theocracy and a secular state.

Give me one example of my ignorance. The Supreme Court agrees with my interpretation of the separation of church and state. I obviously know the Founding Fathers’ documents better than you do. I think you need to look in the mirror to see an ignorant man. You and a lot of other people, some of them sadly holding higher office.

I really don’t see how. I want the Dems to appeal to their core constitutiency, to show by example how a person can be both spiritual/moral and uphold the Constitution and individual civil liberties, and to take back our right to be proud to be liberal. I don’t know what the hell about that is nuts to you. I think you’re just being vicious for the sake of viciousness. Go read the Constitution and stop being such a hostile, shrill jerk.

20

One election. One of two. That he became president after the first was a result of many things, but “the will of the people” was not one of them. Similarly, had Kerry squeeked out Ohio, he still would have lost the election, even though he would have been president.

But how’s this for an explanation, if you prefer: For three out of the last four elections, the voters have rejected the Republican agenda.

The lost Senate seats were in hard-core red states, and the three seats they picked up in the House were entirely the result of Tom DeLay’s gerrymandered redistricting in Texas. Not to mention that the Senate pickups for the Pubbies were, more often than not, by awfully thin margins.

No fucking shit? You mean like gaps narrow and widen pretty much every two years? Definitely time to panic, I see.

Eleven, I believe. No surprise, either, if you’ve been paying attention to the pretty obvious fact that Americans oppose gay marriage by hefty margins in every state in the country. Even Massachusetts. The question is what to do about it, not how best to whine about it.

Oh, I pay plenty close attention, sweetie. I mourn for what’s about to happen to my country. But goddammit, I am not going to wallow in whiny self-pity, I am not going to blame it all on the people who were doing their damnedest to prevent this shit from happening, and I am not going to take my ball and go home because 51% of the country won’t play with me.

Grow a spine. Then use it to stand up to the bastards.