Turkish flagged vessel attack [What if?--becomes What now?]

Gosh, this stuff is so much simpler if one is not hindered by any attempt at citation. Regrettably, this also leads to minor errors, such as identifying Iran as being “Arab”.

None of the other ships had members of “terrorist organizations” aboard? Perhaps if you were more specific, which passengers were members of which organizations, and by who’s lights they are defined as “terrorist”.

There is a marvelous inclusivity in what Israel regards as “material that can be used against her.” Surely you’ve noticed? Weapons grade chamomile and coriander, of course, must be denied. The problem may stem from a lack of trust of Israeli intentions. Have you read the published list of proscribed stuff? All of that seems directly military to you? Seriously?

That calls out for citation. Actually, it screams itself hoarse for citation. Or is that another example of your droll wit?

See above.

If she is forbidden to import those basic needs, what difference does it make how she spends the money? And, of course, another citation seems to be in order.

And, of course, why should we deny basic needs to people because their government is incompetent? Tough love, or tough shit?

But other than the minor flaws of being innocent of fact and/or citation, a very insightful post!

You may enjoy this article, but you probably won’t enjoy it.

OK, if we grant that Ms Corrie was no better than she should be, that would prove…what, exactly?

Just because a country’s current government is critical of Israel’s policies does not mean it is your enemy and does not mean that it has abandoned Israel for all things anti-Israel. Maybe if the Israeli government and people like you did not exaggerate things so much then there wouldn’t be so much paranoia.

The best way to handle all those people out to get you is to put them in prison. Do you think this is rational? And with so many out to get you: Turkey, the UN, Arab States, Palestinians, Iranians, Anti-Semites on this board and breeding like rabbits in several countries?

They are coming to get you!

Are the resorts all made of concrete?

I want to thank you for the contrast between your user name and what you post about.

[

Hebe de Bonafini, is the current president of the “Mothers of May Square”. Several times, she has expressed her support for the FARC, the ETA, Fidel Castro and the terrorists involved in 9/11.
That makes her a silly old fool, not a terrorist.
Elucidator has asked for a cite that any passanger of that ship was a member of a terrorist organization. You have provided a link with a declaration by a protestor that, to my knowledge, wasn’t even in the ship.
This is called Great Debates for a reason.

Actually, I’d probably want a bit more than that. Simply identifying a single person won’t cut it. First, because its just one and second, “terrorist organization” has become a term of art that entails a wonderful flexibility. If it can be shown that half the passengers were members of Al Queda, I would be very impressed. But simply a contact or association with say, Hamas, is less than fulfilling.

This is not to say that there aren’t people who think than anyone who has ever had any contact with such groups as Hamas, however tenuous or fleeting, is a bomb-throwing maniac. Only that we may safely dismiss such persons from serious consideration.

Iran’s Revolutionary Guard offers to escort future Gaza aid vessels

This is poke em with a stick diplomacy at its finest.
Perhaps Turkey can tell them to STFU.

But Michael Oren, Israel’s ambassador to Washington, told Fox News: "We are rejecting an international commission. We are discussing with the Obama administration a way in which our inquiry will take place."

It’s a bit like Hilter demanding the SS be allowed to investigate themselves after WW2.

Anyway Al Jazeera late last night received a press statement form the Knesset. Anybody read it yet?
Everyone seems to favour Al Jazeera when they release statements?
:smiley: wonder why.
Seriously though.
After reading that press release.
Isn’t it time that psychiatrists were sent into the Knesset.

Isn’t it time for the men in white coats to be sent in.:confused:

Barbitu8

Five ships were towed to port without casualty.

Yes according to the IDF but not according to the crew.

MV Sfendoni

Retired diplomat Edward Peck, who was on board the Sfendoni, said that the commandos were well-trained, and behaved reasonably well. The soldiers scuffled with a few activists trying to bar their access to the wheelhouse, but there were no major injuries, Peck said. Paul Larudee, a 64-year-old former linguistics professor from El Cerrito, California onboard the Sfendoni, was beaten and tased according to his family who said that Israeli consular officials informed them that Larudee, a pacifist, was beaten after refusing to follow the orders of troops.
MS Sofia

Swedish author Henning Mankell reports that Israeli troops rappelled onto the MS Sofia (also known as the Free Mediterranean) about an hour after the raid on the Mavi Marmara. Michalis Grigoropoulos, who was at the wheel of the ship according to the Guardian Newspaper, said that the Israeli commandos used electric shocks on those who tried to form a human ring on the bridge. In an eyewitness account, a reporter for the German newspaper Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung wrote that Israeli soldiers approached unarmed civilians with guns drawn and shot a 65 year old person with an electroshock weapon from a distance of ten centimeters. Mankell said soldiers shot “an older man in the crew, he was perhaps a little slow” with an electric gun, and another man with rubber bullets.
Challenger One

The Challenger One accelerated its course in an attempt to allow journalists onboard to broadcast their photos of the ongoing raid. Huwaida Arraf, an American activist who was on the Challenger One reported that Israeli soldiers attacked those who tried to block them from taking over the vessel with kicks, tasers, and concussion grenades. First mate Shane Dillon reported that Israeli troops used stun guns and paintball guns to subdue activists on board, broke the nose of a Belgian woman among them, and beat another passenger. Australian photojournalist Kate Geraghty was attacked and tasered by Israeli troops aboard the Challenger One, while attempting to photograph the raid.

Turkish Hurriyet Media has released some stills from a smart card hidden by one of the activists on board the Marmara.

Oh goody, now Iran’s Red Crescent is going to try to run the blockade…for purely humanitarian reasons, of course…

Whoopeee!! WWIII, here we come!

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/06/07/iran-red-crescent-to-send-aid-to-gaza/?hpt=T2

they are wrong then

the Mavi Marmara was the first to be attacked

some of the other boats which were smaller and faster escaped being attacked till almost an hour after the Mavi attack took place

All those photos show is bloody Israeli soldiers. They don’t look like they are being “protected” or “aided” (as the article claims) to me. The last picture clearly shows what looks like an Israeli soldier being dragged up a flight of stairs…

Not only Turkey, but Greece has also called of military drills etc with Israel.

I just want to clear something up about martyrs.

A Palestinian child who has been killed by an IDF snipers bullet is also a martyr according to the Islamic faith.

Martyrs bodies are NOT washed after death as per usual ritual. All martyrs blood is left on the body and they are not put in shrouds but buried in the clothes they died in.

That is why you see so many carried through the streets to the grave still wearing their blood soaked clothings. A baby who has been killed is buried in it’s romper suit it was wearing at the time of death.

http://fourthreichisrael.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/gaza_babies_stacked_dead.jpg

martyrs being buried unwashed

and the first photo?
what does that show?

is he being protected or not?

what does the one where the doctor is treating the wounds of the commando show? the lynch mob lynching him ?

Just announced.

Turkish IHH with UK/US Free Gaza Movement, Viva Palestina Global, and other activist groups are planning Freedom Flotilla/Convoy 2.

12th Sept 2010 the International convoys will leave London.

One with 500 vehicles carrying aid and picking up in Europe on the way to Rafah crossing through Syria, Turkey, Jordan etc, ending in Rafah where they will cross overland into Gaza from Egypt.

Simultaneously the Freedom Flotilla 2 will set sail from London stopping at various European sea ports to pick up boats and volunteers with so far 60 ships already signed up to reach Gaza beach at the same time as the land convoy enters Rafah.

The aim to render the seige null and void.

Erdogan has asked Turkish Parliament to support his intention to be on one of the Turkish vessels. He is awaiting the Turkish Military approval. He has informed Washington of his intention.
NATO member in International waters possibly with Turkish Naval assistance.

Israel, non signatory to NATO treaty.

What will happen now?

JoeBiden in Sharm el Sheikh today.
Should be interesting.
Off to trim my banana trees.