Verbal Altercation at work...veiled threat?

In My Humble Opinion
1

This might be long, so bear with me.
Part I
Where I work we have quite a few new agency-type people that are new to the building. It is our job to train them and help them out in any way possible. The nature of my job is such that things need to be running smoothly at all times. It’s the kind of job that alot of people working together is the only way that anything gets done. So teamwork is key.

Well recently another employee and myself were asked to stay two hours over everyday to assist the new midnight shift technicians because the higher ups were not very happy with the performance of a work area that is coevered on midnights. They were hoping that the long timers (myself and “joe”) could continue training the new guys to improve efficiency. Joe and I both have close to 15 years of on the job training and no one can come in to where we work and expect to know everything lickety split. Everyone there is constantly learning everyday…and the learning curve is pretty steep.

Well about 2 weeks ago “joe” and I witnessed a agency employee had walked away from his area two days in a row for more than 20 minutes each time. Where I work that is a big NO-NO because the potential for something to happen in a split second is very great, and to limit loss of property/damage and keep overall a high level of safety one needs to follow the rules. Now I know for a fact that “joe” told the guy what he needs to do if he ever needs to leave his area and he said OK no problem.

A week after those incidents and the subsequent “training” I was getting ready to leave and I noticed that this agency guy was not in his area as he was walking by my area. Knowing that he had a bad habit of leaving his area unattended I went to check if he had followed the proper procedure that he was impressed upon him 2 weeks ago.

Well of course he had left his area in a very unsafe condition.

I tried to explain to him that he couldn’t do that anymore, and first thing he does is make an excuse that he was “only gone for 5 seconds”. Which was bullshit. Then he turns his back on me and shouts over his shoulder something like…“OK THANKS ALOT SEEYA LATER!!!”. His arrogance really irked me, so I asked him if there was a problem because I was just trying to do my job. At this point he tries to throw my long time co-worker"joe" under the bus by saying that he came back just as soon as he realized that “joe” had left the building. Which was BS because he was told by “joe” “GOODBYE” which from where I am from means…I am leaving now! He left his area as soon as “joe” was out the door! Did he even listen to “joe” when he was told the proper procedure? Apparently not.

Once again I tried to tell him that anything could happen at any given moment and before I could even finish my sentence he once again turns his back on me and interrupts my retraining spiel by exclaiming loudly “OK THANKS ALOT SEEYA LATER!!!”. I was irked to say the least…and my response was “OK PAL HAVE A GREAT NIGHT”…my tone dripping with sarcasm.

PART II
Now I didn’t say anything of this exchange to anyone other than to “joe” because its our asses if anything happens while we are there training these guys. I was just letting “joe” know so that he could keep an eye on this guy because he doesn’t seem to have caught on about are number one rule. I wasn’t even going to say a word to this agency guy because I thought he was having a bad day maybe…midnights can do that do you.

Anyways I am sitting with my relief agency guy, and out of nowwhere this other guy comes up and starts harassing me in a passive-aggressive manner. He first started addressing the agency guy that I was giving instructions to, but in a very loud and very obnoxious voice. Then quickly this “conversation” began slanting towards me with regard to our exchange which had happend the night before. He was obviously agitated that I had said something to him the night before, and was commenting on it in a most passive agrressive way. Saying things like I am just minding MY own business, and keeping to MY area…etc etc a s he was “talking” to my relief for the hight. I should mention we are all adults where I work…lol. It was like this guy is still in grade school!

I turned around and said "look…if you leave your area in a unsafe condition it is I who will say something about to you because it is MY obligation and my job to do so. He called me an owl of all things…lol?..I guess because owls have big eyes and watch everything? It escalated between us once again and I finally told him to just go back to his area and to do his job. He of course had more to say as he walked back continuing to be a smart mouth… :rolleyes:

I sat there with my agency guy for a bit…and I could hear some arguing going on down the hall. So I got up and as I got closer I could hear his loud obnoxious voice getting louder and louder and louder as “joe” was basically saying that this guy has screwed up and he didn’t like it at all. So I rounded the corner and I said “look I was doing my job you aren’t supposed to leave your area unless you follow the proper procedure”. Once again the exchange becomes very heated but to try and wrap this sordid story up I will cut to the chase!

I said “I was just doing my job and I will continue to do my job until the day I die”. He replies “oh you can die real soon”. I was dumbstruck. I totally took it as a velied-threat. Because basically I don’t know who this person is because he is so new to our building. I don’t know anything about this guy…the kinds of ‘friends’ he has or anything else. All I know is that he has a hair trigger temper, a HUGE chip on his shoulder and a level of arrogance that until all this happened has eclipsed everything I have ever encountered in my entire life.

Now I kept my language free of any foul language…I didn’t cus or anything. Didn’t invade his personal bubble…nothing. What do you guys all think of this? I don’t know what to do really…if I should make his veiled-threat an issue or not. We are going to make his failure to obey the most basic and fundamental rule an issue of course with our boss, but this other issue I am kind of torn.

Thanks for reading and stuff…

2

That wasn’t even veiled. Do you, or you and joe together, have the power to fire this guy? He clearly has no interest in learning to do his work responsibly.

3

This is an AGENCY guy? Where I have worked, contract personnel have routinely been terminated just because they “didn’t work out” on numerous occasions–no explanations or documentation has been needed and careful hints to the body shop were sufficient to stifle complaints from that direction. He should have been gone the night you found him away from his position when you knew he had already been admonished by “joe.”

You’ll never get an accepted police complaint over his comment, but you should definitely go to management with his behavior and HR to document his words to you (thus putting the company in the loop in case this escalates).

4

It is kind of weird where I work because it seems that the agency guys are protected in some way. Like we had one guy that consistently late on a daily basis. Strolling in talking on his cellphone with a bag of Taco Bell in his one hand. Not to mention that he would spend half the night on the damn phone. It took 2 years before that clown could get the boot. I don’t know why exactly but I assume there is some kind of “special” circumstances going on.

So I don’t have any authority at all to get someone like this booted. All I can do is relay my concerns to management. I am worried that it could escalate too. I mean he would have to sneak up behind me with a big hammer or something, but still it is troubling that I feel like I can’t even go near the guy now because he is such a hot head and has such a bad attitude…but I worry about going to HR. Its not something I like to do…in fact I have never done something like that at all.

Thanks for the input.

5

By agency guy you mean placed by a temp agency, yes?
And I’m not sure how to ask this, but does management share your level of concern as you do that stations must be monitored every second?
Cause from what you’ve described - new folks unsupervised and wandering about the floor or chatting all night on the phone - it does not sound like they do.
Either way your course of action is to bring this to management.

6

It sounds like you’ve worked there for awhile and are in good standing with your bosses, etc. If a trusted, long-term employee comes to them with a complaint like this, they’d be crazy not to listen to you. I can’t think of any way you’d get in trouble for talking to them about it. In fact, they’ll probably thank you when you do. And your ass will be covered if something happens with this lunatic.

7

First off, him talking back to a supervisor like that is insubordination (I assume you are his supervisor, since you were supervising him), and that is usually enough to get someone fired. The “you can die real soon” is something you might want to consider reporting to your boss, his boss at the agency, and the police - death threats are taken very seriously. I’m trying to think of any way someone saying that isn’t a death threat, and I’m failing.

8

Sounds like you should quit and go to work for the agency. Full pay with limited responsibility, and immunity from firing.

9

I am always appalled by the behavior people on this board will tolerate from the people around them.

I mean why would this be a question in some one’s life?

10

You should tell management about this. If something goes wrong in a big way, it’s their butts on the line at least as much as it is yours. And they have the disadvantage, now, of not being aware of the warning signs.

I wouldn’t generalize from the tardiness situation. While tardiness is not a good thing, there are reasons that can justify it. Also, presumably the company didn’t pay for the time the tardy guy wasn’t there, so management may not get as worked up about it.

But intentional safety violations and hostile behavior are zero tolerance type of things.

My perspective is that management wants experienced people like you and Joe to keep an eye out for this type of problem and let them know.

If management doesn’t get rid of the guy, then you might need to take it up the ladder or to HR, because management shouldn’t be blowing off a worker making threats.

Good luck getting this worked out.

11

Death Threats should be documented in writing (e-mail, visibly cc’d to your home address for safe keeping) to management as soon as they are made. You should note clearly that you consider it a death threat, ask that management please deal with the matter appropriately (state that, not specifics - you don’t want them getting on you for “telling them how to do their jobs”).

The second time it happens with the same individual, follow the same procedure. Then, without warning your company (because management might consider it a threat on your end), contact your local police (“this guy has threatened my life twice, here’s the documentation of what happened”) and possibly the state regarding a hostile work environment.

If you are a Union member, file a grievance with the Union.

One death threat should provoke an immediate response from management. Unfortunately, all too often it does not. Two death threats from the same person requires immediate action.

12

If I read this right, he made the threat in front of joe, right? So you do have some independent verification, if things get to the point of firing.

13

I don’t get the waffling. He’s a temp with a shitty attitude, and has made not so veiled physical threats, and yet you’re quaking in your boots about taking this to management. The situation seem absolutely straightforward, and you’re making it complicated because you don’t want to make waves.

Let me assure that if you let someone continue to intimidate you, and who’s not doing his job besides, when he finally does go nuts on you or someone else or screws up royally, they’re going to look directly at you as his nominal supervisor, and if all you have is “I didn’t want to make a fuss” your rear end is the one that’s likely to get canned just for sheer stupidity. He may be an incompetent worker, but you are being an incompetent supervisor, and putting others in danger besides by not taking charge here.

14

I don’t get this at all.
The first three times he left a critical station, you didn’t report it to the boss?
You are hesitating to report a threat of physical violence?

Look, I don’t know what industry you are, but I would fire your ass, and Joe’s, just for not reporting it. I would not hesitate to get rid of some one I did not even need to fire.

(In my industry, you would have been required to report, in writing, the first verbal warning; and the agency co-ordinator would have been told to not send the guy back.)

15

I have a philosophy about these things, which has been proven true in virtually every circumstance;

You bring a problem to Management,
YOU become the problem.

If they haven’t backed him up in the past, to the point of taking years to fire a grossly incompetent employee, then they probably aren’t going to back him up now.

Which leads back to my suggestions. If he makes a second threat and you go to the Police, the company has no choice but to do something about it. If they get mad at you for doing so, you have a very simple explanation for why:

“If he’s threatening my life and he’s willing to hurt me, there’s a reasonable chance that he’s not going to do it on company property. I have to worry about my wife and kids in this situation. (assuming you have them) I also have to worry about my house, my car, and whether or not I’m safe just going to the store. I’m sorry, but this isn’t just a company matter anymore, it’s a police matter.”

16

That’s a point, but we can all end up in situations that are over our heads.

I have never had supervisory experience, I don’t particularly want it, and have never been trained for it. Yet I have ended up supervising in jobs from bartending to blood collection to IT.

Probably I’ve made incompetent decisions in all these circumstances, although I tried my best to apply common sense. But if management wants competent supervisors, they should train and pay competent supervisors.

17

Just a question, not saying you should do it, but CAN you kick his ass?

What, exactly, is the reason for him thinking he can pull this shit with you?
And, if as you say, someone can’t just walk onto your site and do what you do, you have a great deal of power that you should exercise.

18

You led with your chin the whole way, and now, you’re whining because you got it punched. What is this “I am going to do MY job” stuff? You are supposed to be getting on this idiot’s case for endangering everything that you are working for, and you start cackling about “I’m doing…My job…I die…”??? You’re just begging to have it turned around on you.
What you should have done:
1st time: Listen, stupid, you know that everything can go wrong if you leave, and to do so in the manner you did is a violation of company policy. IF you quit being a jerk, and straighten up, I will only note it in my report.
2nd time: (Getting on phone): Mr supervisor? Yes, jerk face can’t stay in his cubicle…he’s wandering around doing who knows what…is there anyway to make sure that his area is safe without me having to stop doing my job? He gets abusive when I bring it up to him.
etc…
BTW, since you were the one to volunteer dying, I don’t think that any police officer will look at it as a threat. He merely gave his assent to you martyrdom.
IMHO
good luck,
Greatshakes

19

Yes as a matter of fact I am confident that if the situation was to get to the point that I had to defend myself I would be able to handle myself. And I think the overall reason for him to act this way is because he has some anger management problems. The term “loose-cannon” can be easily attached to this individual.

20

Umm…

Your post makes no sense whatsoever…