Let me tell a little story, however. It is a minor hijack, since it doesn’t involve kids, but is does involve family assumptions.
When I was 31, my fiance, and I broke up and I moved in with my mother temporarily. Shortly after that, my cousin got married. I did not receive an invitation, but my mother did. She invited me to come along with her, but I declined. I quite sensibly figured that with no invitation, and no mention on my mother’s about her bringing a date/guest, that meant that I was not invited. I wasn’t miffed–I just figured that they had limited the size of their guest list. My cousin and I weren’t particularly close, (he is much older) but my mother has always been his favorite aunt.
So my mother came back from the wedding and reception, and told everyone, including the bride and groom, where asking her “Where’s Kay?”
Well I wasn’t miffed before, but I sure was then. If you want a 31-year old adult at your wedding, you send her an invitation. You don’t assume that her mother will bring her along like a purse, just because she is living in the same household.
I have a co-worker who has four children under the age of seven, real little hellions, by his own admission. I gave him a wedding invitation for him and his wife. When he asked if he could bring the kids, I blurted, “No, hell no!” I honestly thought he was joking.
Some time later he asked if I was serious, and I explained more gently that we had already invited all the guests we were able to handle, and told him I hoped he could get a babysitter.
I thought this guy was unusually clueless, but after reading this thread, I’m just thankful that he asked.
Expense is definitely a HUGE consideration when kids are invited. Moreover, yes, most kids are joys to be around. I love children, in general. But inevitably, you’re going to either choose to invite or be obligated to invite people who have absolutel hellions for children. HELLIONS. So, what do you do? Inviet the hellions anyway, or decide not to include children at all? Because let me tell you, inviting some children and not others is a sure-fire way to ruffle a lot of feathers.
So what is needed for you to figure it out? You get a wedding invitation. It’s addressed to “Mr. and Mrs. JustAnotherGeek” on the outer envelope. On the inner envelope it says “John and Mary,” the names of just you and your lovely spouse.
No mention of Timmy and Jimmy and Kimmy, your sweet little Geek-lettes. Do you assume they’re invited? Or do you realize that the invitation is addressed to just the grownups and that the grownups are the only ones invited?
I’m not picking on you, but I would swear these threads come up constantly, with people just assuming that their kids are automatically invited everywhere, even if their names aren’t on the invitations.
Yes, of course people should respect your wishes and not bring their children if that’s the way you’d like it. However, some people are altogether clueless while others will deliberately ignore your wishes. In the grand scheme of things, it won’t be the end of the world if there are a few uninvited kids (or infants) in attendance at your wedding. Really. So relax and enjoy your big day.
Among the peopel I grew up with, it was generally assumed that if a couple was invited then their children are automatically invited, regardless of whose names were noted in the invitation, especially to a family/social event like a wedding. And many of them would feel insulted if their children were disinvited. Different people and different cultures or subcultures just have different expectations. If there was a number limit because of expense, the fact that inviting Mr. and Mrs. automatically meant inviting four or five people, whatever the case may have been, would have to be taken into account.
And I would like to emphasize the “especially for a family/social event like a wedding.” Among many people, a wedding’s main purpose is not to accomplish a perfect performance with a perfect video. The purpose is for friends and family to celebrate the union of the couple, all together, and while good behaviour is desired, the normal activities of babies and children are not considered bad behaviour. The idea that an occasional baby’s cry or a rambunctious toddler’s sprint up the aisle or that the presence of children would inhibit adults from getting shitfaced or telling off-colour jokes would ruin your night would mark you as anti-social and anti-family and well, kind of a stuck up jerk. Now, if you were talking, say, a fancy-dress-and-drinks party that didn’t have any explicit connections with a family/social event like a wedding, many of those people wouldn’t mind.
But my point is not to call anyone here a stuck up jerk, because I don’t believe that’s the case. My point is that different people have different expectations when it comes to things like a wedding invitation. It behooves one not to get exasperated or huffy about it when this fact is revealed. As I said, it’s fine if you want a child-free wedding, but I think it’s important to realise and understand that some people are going to be surprised and maybe unhappy about it and that realisation and understanding should give you some patience and forebearance and willingness to enforce the rule in a gentle fashion, more than once, and not expect people to get the message just from the language on the invitation.
Based on the weddings I have been to, and the way my family thinks, I assume the B&G are including any children of mine (::shudder:: where is that pukey smile?) in an invitation. Hopefully, in any discussions with the happy couple or relatives, we get it sorted out. I do understand that some people don’t want children at weddings; my family does not see things that way.
OTOH, I think that anyone who actually understand that wishes of the B&G, and does not respect them is being a schmuck. Once I figure out that it’s for >18 y/o’s (or whatever), I go with it. That’s just not my standard mode of thinking, that’s all.
No worries. The whole point to my story was to point out that different people have different expectations for their weddings. …and that some people really have a hard time understanding that an invitation to them is not an invitation to their (non-adult) children. (With the above caveat.)
I can understand these sorts of assumptions to an extent- perhaps if the bride and groom and guests are all members of a small enough group that they’ve all known each other for years and therefore know everyone’s expectations. But I think most weddings involve at least one person who is not a member of such a small group, and I don’t understand why the bride’s cousin should assume her children are invited because “that’s the way we always do it” when she knows nothing about the groom’s culture and traditions. Or why the groom’s friend should make such an assumption when he doesn’t know either family’s traditions. A couple of my husband’s cousins brought uninvited children to our first reception, because “children are always included at Chinese weddings”. Sounds good, but the facts that the invitations were in English, the wedding wasn’t at a Chinese hall and my name isn’t Chinese should have been a tipoff that my traditions might be different and that my husband wasn’t too interested in folowing Chinese customs at this reception.
BTW, the custom in my family of not automatically inviting children has nothing to do with not wanting children present- there nearly always are some children present, such as the nieces and nephews and perhaps younger first cousins of the bride and groom. But when you have a family as large as mine, inviting all the children can really add up- I have a couple of first cousins who haven’t gotten married yet. If Kristina gets married , that’s six first cousins with 12 children on my side of the family and there are another 12 or so first cousins with assorted children on her mother’s side. If she marries a guy with a similar sized family (and most of us have) we’re talking about around 40-50 kids.
Just to throw this into the mix, since some of this thread seems to center around what is understood as traditional etiquette. I was taught that weddings in churches are open to anyone who wants to attend. Of course, that doesn’t include the reception, but a church is a religious ceremony and people may attend if they choose. I went to the wedding of my piano teacher when I was 12. I behaved like the little miss goody two shoes I was and I went home when it was over. And I was in a Roman Catholic wedding some years ago where there were people attending for the mass, not for the wedding.
Just for the record, I would never dream of taking children to a wedding reception where they weren’t invited and we have done the babysitter thing when necessary. (Just didn’t want anybody lumping me in with the people who don’t pay attention.)
Interesting to see the differing opinions here. I’m getting married on 25th February 2006 and went through the same dilemmas.
For us, the no kids rule was a no-brainer, we simply don’t have relationships with the kids that would potentially have been invited. Our own friends don’t have kids, and our relations and family friends all live in different cities and we have never even met some of their kids.
The only exceptions have been made for neices and nephews and they have received seperate invitations inviting them to the ceremony from 3.30pm to 4.30pm.
I couldn’t bring myself to write ‘no kids’ on the invitation itself, so sent the invitations to the named guests. When people RSVP, my mum is sending them back some info about the wine register, transportation inforamtion, then finally “we respectfully advise that this is an adults-only occasion, and we are unable to cater/provide facilities for children.”
Wow, I must have been a really strange mother. When my kids were little, I was never offended to be invited somewhere without them. And what’s more, if I ever wasn’t sure whether an invitation included them or not, I asked. But I was also raised with the understanding that if your name isn’t on the invitation, you’re not invited, and to this day I don’t bring uninvited guests somewhere without permission. It’s just basic courtesy.
Well, obviously, it isn’t “just basic courtesy” when there are a lot of people who have a different understanding of what an invitation means. To some people it’s “just basic courtesy” that when you invite a couple, you also invite their children. “Just basic courtesy” principles are not universal.
That’s your opinion, but I’d have to disagree with you. My husband and I don’t plan to have children. Does that mean we’re not a family? Yeah, come a little closer and tell me that. :dubious:
Seriously, are people totally oblivious to the fact that although they think their children are the most wonderful, well-behaved angels in the world, not everyone thinks so? Just becuase you want them with you all the time doesn’t mean that I do. I’ve seen many a wedding ruined by screaming children. How is it selfish to want your wedding to be scream-free?
I don’t think that most people are “oblivious” or deluded about their children’s behaviour. The difference is in people’s expectations and concepts of what a wedding is for and what’s appropriate at one. A wedding is the creation of a new family. At such an event, for many people, it is not appropriate for there to be occasional outbursts from children, both vocal and physical. It’s a celebration of family by families, which include children, not some kind of performance art that has to be presented in a perfectly scripted manner. There are many people who believe it is selfish for you to treat a wedding as if these kinds of things will “ruin” it.
My wedding was a religious ritual to symbolize the joining of myself and Mr. Wanna as one in the eyes of God (Whom we believe in, and any guests ought to respect that even if they don’t agree). As such, we felt that noisy outbursts by anyone present were entirely inappropriate (and fortunately didn’t happen, as few of our friends have minor children) - just as it is preferred in our church that parents leave their children under a certain age down in the nursery or in a Sunday school class during services.
And our “family” doesn’t include children. Who is anyone to say that a family must include children.
You see, differences of opinion of the concept of a wedding are indeed part of the reason for disagreements about the appropriateness of young children as guests. And, once again, it is the intent & wishes of the hosts (bride & groom, or their parents), not the guests that take precedence in determining that.
Telling anyone else what their wedding ought or ought not to be is the ultimate rudeness.
I have to ask, do all invitations addressed to a couple also by default include their children even if the children aren’t mentioned? If, in your circle, a couple receives an invitation from the boss to dinner, do they also assume the kids are invited? What about to a neighbor’s New Year’s Eve party? What about to a cookout at the home of a unmarried childless man?
Which is why I’m glad I haven’t done so. Notice I haven’t said once what I believe a wedding should be, because, honestly, I don’t have an opinion on that question.df
My point here is to show that people have different expectations and that there are very good reasons behind differing expectations. I’m not telling you what you should do for your wedding; I am not telling you what my opinion is about your chosen wedding arrangements. What I am disputing is the idea that there is some universal agreement about what a wedding is supposed to be like and that other people should automatically know what your expectations are on the basis of an idea of “basic common courtesy” or somesuch.
All I am saying is that if you don’t want children at your wedding, then you should be prepared to handle the issue delicately and not expect people just to read your mind on the matter. And also expect that some people are going to be offended or disappointed. Those are the consequences of differing expectations. “Why don’t they just know not to bring their children becuase their names are not on the invitation?” is the erroneous question, from my point of view. You’ve got to tell them, explictly, that children are not wanted.
I didn’t say that a family must include children. But if you explicitly disinclude other people’s children then your event is not a family event. Not that there’s anything wrong with that, but, as I said, it is in conflict with some people’s idea of what a wedding is about.
Again, this is not always true. In some cultures, the wishes of the guests are more important than the wishes of the hosts.
