What is behind the desire for 'meaningful work'

Great Debates
1

I was watching PBS’s fronteir house last weekend and I remember many of the men talking about how the work they were doing felt really meaningful, like them doing something or failing to do it meant the difference between life and death, there were tangible benefits to the work they did.

Is this why we have an inborn desire to find meaningful work? From an evolutionarly perspective you can assume most work had direct benefits to the worker through most of human history. Collecting food meant there would be no starvation pains and building shelter meant you wouldn’t get frostbite there was no indirect benefit/punishment system via money like we have now where any job can give you money and the work you do is not tied into the goods and services the work provides. Is this direct relationship between work and the punishments of failing to do work that historically people have experienced before the 19th century what causes our modern desire for ‘meaningful work’ or is the desire for meaningful work due to something else. Meaningful work to me has always meant you personally were invested and personally interested in the goals that your work accomplished and what is more directly invested than growing your own food and building your own shelter?

Then again I know alot of philosophers say that people need more than just food and shelter to be content, and work that revolves around just providing food and shelter would get pretty old and boring.

2

I could give a Christian response but I doubt it would be welcome here. This question is very connected to the ultimate human question: “why are we here?” Each of us wants a purpose, a meaning. Something that gives our life value. Meaningful work is purpose, and helps to satisfy the urge to leave a mark on the world. Any positive work that connects our unique strengths, talents, personality, and values and also pushes our lives towards leaving a mark on the world will probably be meaningful.

3

prisoner: *I could give a Christian response but I doubt it would be welcome here. *

Well, it probably wouldn’t be welcome if you attempted to argue that it ought to be applicable to everybody, Christians and non-Christians alike. However, I don’t think you need feel shy about saying “From a Christian perspective…” or “Many Christians interpret this as meaning…” followed by your ideas.

Myself, I think “meaningful work” has a couple of different components. As Wesley said, most people do find meaning in work that gives them direct tangible benefits (anybody who’s tended their own garden over the course of a summer, or helped build or repair their own house, probably has experienced this feeling of satisfaction.

But people also often desire “meaningful work” that satisfies needs beyond the physical requirements of food and shelter. Acting in accordance with one’s ethical convictions, trying to bring about changes that one believes are morally imperative, etc., satisfy moral needs. Exploring a subject that one finds interesting, discovering new facts or ideas, etc., satisfy intellectual needs.

I’d say any kind of work that directly addresses an issue you really care about—whether it’s your own physical well-being and that of your family, or a more abstract desire for a particular kind of accomplishment or knowledge—is going to feel “meaningful” to you.

4

So, the people in this make-believe for TV play frontier house were spewing bullshit about “meaningful work” and you bought it? You must be a rasslin’ fan.

5

I spent some time working collections and process serving. I was desperate and it was fun to find people. If I had no choice but to do that again I would cut my wrists.

I spent 7 years in Quality Control in manufacturing, the only time anyone really wanted to see me was when a customer was coming for an audit. I was like God when they wanted impressive charts and graphs (general bullsh*t) to make them look good, other times I was a red-headed stepchild. It was great money, I would rather die of the clap.

Today, I install septic tanks, fix air conditioners and other civil projects as I am completing my degree in civil engineering. I personally would like to do something that someone wants done, something that makes their life better. Maybe if I stick to this I will never have to have myself committed again or be committed again against my will, who knows?

6

Thanks, I try to improve my IQ by posting on SD because its filled with knowledgable people so I can gain life experience but I usually just end up fighting with people. Sucks.

7

It’s an interesting question. Sort of a variation on the endlessly fascinating, “Why do people do what they do?” In this case, “Why do people want to do what they do?”

Po Bronson has written a fine book on the subject, What Should I Do with My Life?. http://www.pobronson.com/index_what_should_I_do_with_my_life.htm

8

I can only tell you what I think based on what I’ve figured out about myself over the last few years.
For 10 years, I taught special ed. It was more than my job or a decent career–it was my mission field. I identified myself, TO myself, as a teacher. I knew that I was put on my path for specific reasons, and that in the end, I had no choice–this was what I had to do. If ever I could pinpoint a time that God laid a finger on my shoulder, I would say it was when I picked my college major on an apparent whim.
Then one day I realized I was done. Whatever I’d been put into that particular school to accomplish, I’d done it. And again–and I am speaking as a pretty non-religious person here–I felt…released, somehow. As if someone patted me on the shoulder, said “Good job!” and sent me off for a vacation.
So I quit teaching (I got pregnant shortly after, and never went back after maternity leave) and settled into homemaking and childrearing. That was nearly five years ago.
I’m just now getting to a point where I feel really comfortable in my choices, and you know why? Because I’ve finally realized that what I’m doing right now is a different sort of mission: I’m here to raise my kids, help my sister raise her daughter, be a good steward to the animals that find me, and bring some happiness and comfort into the lives of those around me. It’s my New Improved Mission. :slight_smile:
The real question is: Is this really a mission, or am I rationalizing my choices by maximizing their importance? I don’t know, really.
But I know I feel better since I came to peace with it. And I know I NEED a mission (or as Wesley puts it, meaningful work) in my life.

9

Modern life has made automotons and robots out of our lives. It’s like watching “Groundhog Day” over and over and over again. Thank you Industrial Revolution!

Humans are not meant to do the same thing day after day.

Everyday should be a new adventure, like the summers when we were kids.

Remember?

10

I’ll accept that as a heartfelt plea for enlightenment, and help you out.

For most people who work, work is slavery. They do things they don’t really want to do for eight or more hours a day, five days a week, to earn enough money to keep themselves fed, clothed, sheltered and Internetted. Most people cannot admit this simple truth to themselves, so they come up with bullshit about meaningful work and so forth, but it’s pretty obvious bullshit.

Some few people have the good fortune to have work that is fulfilling to them in some way – rewarding in terms of creativity, like an artist or a musician, or rewarding in terms of helping others grow, like bodypoet’s work, byt they’re a tiny minority. Most work is mind-numbing, soul-destroying shitwork, shuffling papers, shuffling data on a computer, cleaning chickens for processing, doing phone sales, etc. Most work absolutely stinks on ice. People find work they can stand and call it a career.

To be meaningful, work has to connect in some way with who you are as a person, and there’s not much of that work around. Mostly it’s employers using your hands or your eyes or a very small part of your brain’s capacities, on a rental basis. The problem is, with workdays that use up most of our time (with lunch and commuting) and most of our energy, there’s very little of us left for our own use. That’s why most people watch TV and drink beer in the evenings – they don’t want to be awake and conscious to watch the destruction of everything they might have been as a human being, hour by hour, day by day, week by week. It’s not escapism, it’s self-medication, to avoid the pain.

Sound grim? Well, it is, if you have any sense of what might be. TLC1 is on the right track.

Of course, people do complain about not having jobs, but what they’re really complaining about is not having a steady income, enough to live on. If they could get the one without the other, they would. That’s why the lottery is so popular.

11

I wholly agree with Evil Captor’s last post. Damn, I could have written that myself.

I also think that the disconnect between work and survival (i.e. people having jobs that do not directly connect to individual survival/survival of the species) is the reason why the rates of “mental illness” have skyrocketed in recent decades. I mean, yeah the income is related to survival but I’m talking about the task. There is a real sense of honor in doing something that needs to be done, and a real horror in doing something that really isn’t all that necessary. Ninety-five percent of jobs aren’t really necessary for species survival. If you want to have a higher society, one that isn’t totally fixated on food and shelter all the time, that percentage would increase to maybe ninety percent. But when you get right down to it, most people in this (modern) society are expendable, and expendability doesn’t exactly make for happiness.

12

I’ve certainly held my share of jobs I didn’t like in order to keep myself fed, clothed, and sheltered but I’ve never seen employment as slavery.

Marc

13

I’ve had a lot of jobs, and oddly enough one of the most satisfying was one most people would regard as the lowest of the low.

I was a janitor. On Thursday nights my task was the campus day-care center, and I went in there and cleaned like mad and when I left I could see that my work had made a difference. Particularly in the 3-year-old room.

The other nights it was just a drag. Clean around the people in offices on campus (I was a graduate student at the time) from 3 to 5, until they all left, then do the really serious vacuuming and floor-buffing. But Thursdays were great.

After a few months of this the graduate student employment office found me an actual job as a graduate assistant, where I got to grade papers and even teach a class occasionally, and since my major was comparative literature this seemed like a very good fit, and I thought my situation had improved. Instead (of course) I got into backbiting office politics–someone has said office politics in academia are so vicious because there is so little at stake–and I found I really missed being able to see a difference at the end of my shift.

(But did I learn from this experience? No–I went ahead and completed a master’s in comparative literature.)

14

If work was fulfilling, they wouldn’t need to pay you to do it.

Or, what Evil Captor said.

15

I don’t really believe that, people who have won the lottery are not content to sit around all day accomplishing nothing. Neither are people who are wealthy by other means like inheritance or entertainment. You seem to say that people just bullshit a meaning out to justify getting money. People who have ample money still seek meaning in their life, so I don’t really buy that explanation.

I bet you get invited to alot of kid’s birthday parties. You’re the guy who sits in the corner sipping scotch with a grimace and mumbing under your breath as you watch the kids play and laugh ‘wait until you grow up you naive little shits’

16

You still have to make a living. And that’s what makes a meaningful job so great. You can look forward to work. Your life has meaning. Do don’t work so you can pay for your time off period. You have a time off period to recuperate enough so you can be more productive at work. Your work isn’t about the weekend. Your weekend is about your work. That’s meaningful work.

And like Cicada2003 showed, a lot of jobs that you might find tedious are great for other people. I’ll just bet that if Cicada2003 found a janitorial job that was as respected as and was paid as well as comparative literature job (whatever that might be) he might consider it. Though a job that needs a masters in comparative literature sounds like it might be pretty neat. Potential for advancement is important, and the idea of being a janitor for the next 30 years would oppress just about anybody, I’m sure. Even if they found meaning in the duty.

17

When did he say lottery winners sit around accomplishing nothing? Presumably they would still “work,” but it would be much more fulfilling work, a kind of work that’s usually called a “hobby” by non-lottery winners.

And they don’t “bullshit a meaning out.” There is no meaning. Cynicism is your friend, dude.

18

I love my job. No,really. :slight_smile: I’ve worked my share of shit jobs, office jobs, sales jobs and it was always slavery. But now I work for Habitat for Humanity. It makes my work so much more fullfilling. For 2 reasons.

1.) It accomplishes a task that I really beleive in. (making home ownership affordable)
2.) It is an activity realted to a basic need for surival. (shelter)
3.) Bye,Opal :frowning:

19

That’s really sad. I feel sorry for you guys.

I think that we want meaningful work since most of us are conditioned, whether genetically or socially, not to steal, which in this case means money for nothing. I do researchy type things, and the happiest I am is when I can easily see a direct impact on quality or the bottom line. Happily my bosses tend to see my value as higher than I do.

hlanelee, why was Quality Control so awful? Did your company pay lip service to quality, so you shipped crap, or did you actually screen out bad product? My wife worked as quality control director in a vegetable cannery for a while, and keeping people from getting sick seemed meaningful to her. I work in quality related field, and I am very satisfied when something I have done improves quality for our customers.

As for getting paid - it makes me spend time on the satisfying stuff my company wants me to do, as opposed to a dozen other satisfying things I can be doing also. I don’t have any trouble getting out of bed to go to work in the morning. If you have ever had a meaningful job, you’d know what I mean.

20

Thats the point, they still want ‘meaningful work’. People are not content spending all day doing something, they want their activities to have some meaning. Because work takes up 40+ hours a week people try to unite this desire for meaningful activities and what they do for money but why do we desire to have meaningful activities in the first place? I still assume it has something to do wtih the fact that these emotions evolved when our activities had a direct effect on our own survival.