Yeah, narcissistic personality disorder, sociopathy, psychopathy, uncontrollable, pure impulse with no filters, yada yada yada.
But what if he knows what he is doing? Sociopaths for instance know, they just don’t care.
And what about those who have latched on to a crazy man, who are sane, and know he is a mental case? - Bannon, Conway, Giuliani, Flynn (who really is fucking crazy), etc
And how about those who support him out of pure spite, to “fuck” everyone else?
Trump hasn’t had time to commit treason yet since he really hasn’t taken any direct action whats-so-ever internationally, and I doubt that he has a had the opportunity to leak national secrets to the Russians.
As to whether he is a Russian plant, or is being black mailed by Russia, there is a lot of circumstantial evidence that he has some interest in advancing Putin’s goals beyond what one would normally expect from an American politician. There is also some very flimsy evidence that Russia has blackmail material on him, but this is a distance away from being an out and out puppet of Putin.
Overall I think it is likely that Trump will take some actions that benefit Putin for reasons that are related to personal rather than national intersts, but I doubt that they will go so far as to include what I would consider treason. For example I would consider weakening sanctions on luxury goods sent to Russia in exchange for the building of Trump hotels, simple graft rather than treason.
That said there is clearly more evidence that Trump is a Manchurian candidate by an order of magnitude than there is of the claims that say Obama was born in Kenya, or that there 4 Million fraudulent vote all of which were for Clinton.
Poor, poor Donald Trump. All he ever wanted to be was an honest businessman and philanthropist, someone who’d give the shirt off his back to help those in need, never asking anything in return, and somehow the guy just can’t catch a break. It’s goddamned unfair, is what it is.
Oh for fuck’s sake, you’ve got to be kidding.
The only sacrifice Trump ever made is getting rich (if you believe he is rich).
He may or may not have guilty of treason. Of one thing, there is no non-laughable argument against: he actively hates the values and principles America is based on (the aspirational, better-angels-of-our-nature ones we try to instil in our children).
The same holds true for his supporters.
The media is trying their best to be objective, but Trump makes it too hard. Maybe this article will help you understand they’re not out to undermine the prez, but probably not, because you’ve fused yourself into the “us vs them” mentality and give entirely too much credit to the imagined enemy.
Trump needs to understand that his truth can’t be applied universally, but he never will because of his staggering ego. Have you ever got the impression he thinks about the consequences of his words and actions? Try to take away the “liberal agenda” mindset and think about objectivity, not malice aforethought.
Trump hates the idea of only land-owning white males being allowed to vote??? I find this unlikely.
And I find it unlikely that an honest reading of my post can possibly lead one to the conclusion that only land-owning white males being allowed to vote falls into the category of the aspirational, better-angels-of-our-nature [values and principles] we try to instil in our children.
Since this is in the Pit, I say the OP is an idiot. I didn’t vote for Trump and I can’t wait until he’s out office. But I believe that Trump is a traitor about as much as I believe the moon landings were faked by Stanley Kubrick or that 9/11 was an inside job. In other words, not one fucking bit.
Ask Trumpy Wumpy if he’s a traitor. You know what he’ll say? “Trader? Of course, I’m a trader. The biggest and best trader.”
:rolleyes:
1- My thread was asking people to weigh in on the quality of the (circumstantial) evidence that has been presented by the media and others that points to Trump putting another country’s interests above his own. IE: lifting russian sanctions.
You just settled that debate all by yourself when you said “not enough evidence”. I think you made the wrong call, Jonathan.
I’m guessing we don’t use the same definition of the words “evidence”. I did state it was all circumstantial. There is evidence and then there is “hard” evidence.
For example: testimony is evidence. Videotape is hard evidence. Evidence is not proof, it’s just things that point in a certain direction.
As you can see I’ve provided quite a bit of circumstantial evidence, and I bet you were already aware of all of it.
I did not intend for this to be in the pit. I won’t name call you and I think it was rude of you to do so. I’ll just ask you this: IF there is a compromising tape of trump, and IF the russians are leaning on him to drop the sanctions, would that be enough to consider him a traitor in your book?
You mean his “alternate truth”, and waiting for the Orange Abomination to understand anything at all, is foolish. It will never ever happen.
In his world, the universe revolves around him, it exists to serve him, it’s all about him, and fuck everyone else.
You may not have intended for this to be in the Pit, but it’s here now and rudeness is allowed here. If this were still in GD, I wouldn’t have called you an idiot there, but I still would have called you one in my head. I find your OP to be an idiotic concept. In the absence. of evidence it has no factual basis.
Non-zero. Other than that, I don’t have enough information.
I have never had that thought about any president or major presidential candidate in my lifetime before now. I’ve thought some of them stupid and wrong headed, but never considered them as traitors.
In retrospect Nixon getting South Vietnam to mess up the Paris peace talks prior to the 1968 election and Reagan getting Iran to hold the US hostages prior to the 1980 election might be considered traitorous acts, but I was unaware of them until after their administrations were over.
I’ll get behind any reason to get rid of Trump. Calling him a traitor is as good as any.
A History of Donald Trump’s Bromance With Vladimir Putin
The Curious World of Donald Trump’s Private Russian Connections
Putin’s Puppet
Trump’s Russian connections
Inside Trump’s financial ties to Russia and his unusual flattery of Vladimir Putin
FBI, 5 other agencies probe possible covert Kremlin aid to Trump
This is the closest I’ve ever seen Trump go towards criticizing Putin.
To to mention more recent news, such as celebrating Russian officials, or the dossier. Everyone focused on the potential prostitute pee tape because hey, sex, but there was plenty of other interesting things in there too.
The US Intelligence community uses the promise of citizenship and immigration as a recruitment tool for foreign assets. Now those people are banned from entering the US.
Of all of the countries the 9/11 hijackers came from, none of those countries are on Trump’s list. And of all of the countries where Trump has business interests, none of those countries are on Trump’s list.
Trump is totally corrupt but lacks the intelligence to be a real traitor. I’d consider “useful idiot” a better description. As President, he’s extremely useful.
Benedict Arnold is the Classic American Traitor whose actions could have lost us the Revolution–even though he started out as a hero. (Trump was never a hero.) Even so, Peggy Shippen Arnold was probably the brain behind her husband.
Poor Melania is innocent–is she back in NYC? But certain of Trump’s handlers may be consciously coordinating with Russia…or with contacts in the countries that harbor terrorists (but were left off That List).
100%, unqualified, Trump is a traitor, a betrayer. He’s in the betrayal business; stiffing and robbing is his idea of being a “good negotiator.”
Is he, in this day and hour, actively working for a foreign power? If he is, he plans to betray them too. It’s his modus operandi, and all he wants to do.
No, I’m not. I believe in giving credit where credit is due. That comment just demonstrates your blind hatred.