What Kind Of Person Were You During Your Adolescence?

I have been having some severe problems with my oldest daughter lately. She says she has been down or depressed ever since she was in elementry school. When she finally opened up and told us why she said it was because of the verbal insults she got from her classmates. It is effecting her even now(she is 15). She says she just pretends to be happy and lately she has been in lots of trouble.

So I was wondering why do you think kids are so mean to other kids. What is wrong with us to do such things. I was picked on, mocked and stuff through school to and it got to me some but I still tried to look at the bright side of life. I guess that is why I considered steroids now because I was always kind of skinny when I was young(and got picked on for that too). I know Ben nailed me for considering them since they are illegal but I don’t think I am hurting anybody and since I am not playing sports I am not cheating(which is why the govt made them illegal in the first place) so that is how I rationalize it in my mind. Maybe, I still have a few issues from my youth I need to work out. I guess I just always wanted to be liked.

Anyway, back to the question at hand why? Do somehow these bully type kids learn this stuff from their parents or are we just inheritly mean to one another. And why?

So I was wondering were you a picker on or picked on in school and how did it effect you? If you were a picker on, why did you do it? Why would one human being want to inflict so much hurt on another human being? I just don’t get it. I don’t know if I am making much sense, I am very upset right now and finding it very hard to type. I love my daughter very much and it is killing me to her like this. She cries all the time and lately so do I.

I was a skater chick, with braces, and completely picked on…all the time. I had a ‘cool chick’ smash a blueberry pie in my face in front of everyone in home ec class, and if you don’t think that’s embarrassing, well…I don’t know what is.

I don’t think I was depressed in highschool (I’m depressed now, and I know it’s different), but I knew I was an outsider, I knew that I wasn’t living the ‘typical highschooler’ lifestyle, I didn’t have boyfriends, didn’t get asked to dance, nada.

The thing is, I loved my family so much, that I was perfectly happy hanging out with my mom and dad and sister on the weekends, or having dinner with them every night, or going on trips with them, so I never was lonely or too sad.

I suppose I was actually a big geek. Oh well.

I’m sorry, WB, for your daughter getting picked on. I can only believe that it will make her an interesting person later in life. I know it did for me.

jarbaby

I was picked on. And not just by bullies, but by the people that were supposed to be my friends. And I agree that kids can be downright cruel. I wish I could tell you I got over it, but I didn’t. It still affects me some ten years later. It still hurts to think about sometimes. I developed emotional problems due to it. I hate those bastards nowadays, but I would love to just ask them what the hell went wrong, that they thought it was funny to make fun of someone, to spread rumors about me, and spend recesses and lunch breaks calling me names, telling me how fat i was, that I smelled (which i didn’t, by the way, and I still have no idea where that came from) and much more.

My only consolation now, is that majority of them are crack heads with a bunch of kids, or they’re in jail, or supporting their drug dealer boyfriends.

I just wish I knew the simple answer that would help you stop crying, but I still cry to this day sometimes over it, and the answer just isn’t simple.

Kids are cruel. That’s what I know.

And make sure your daughter knows that they’re just big fat barrels of monkeyspunk and one day, she’ll probably be their boss. :slight_smile:

If I would have been any more withdrawn, I would have been invisible. I got tired of all the jokes that could get tossed at me, and just shut everyone out.

Sheesh. People who loved HS were obviously on top of the pecking order.

WB, I hope it gets better for your daughter, here are a couple of suggestions:

  1. Make it abundandtly clear to here as often as possible how much you and her Mom care about her and love her. At least this will help her to have a “safe haven” from the kids at school. I trust you do this anyway. But be extra careful not to pick on her in a teasing way or degrade her ideas when they don’t jibe with yours 100%

that said, it’s very important for children (and adults) to feel like they fit in somewhere. Some of us use the SDMB for that now. Which leads to:

  1. For your daughter, find somethings she does well or is interested in. Then find a nice, safe accepting area where she can fit in. This could be through music, church, scouting, science, etc. Its unlikely she’s suddenly going to be part of the “in crowd” if she has always been picked on, so try instead to find her niche away from this. The popular crowd is sort of an arbitrary designation for kids anyway, although your daughter probably doesn’t see it that way. It could even be via the internet if there is no one local she fits in well with, but be careful with this with a young girl.

As you might infer from this note, I was not really the picked on or the picker, I was more a mediator in school. I could fit in with the cool folks when I felt like it, but was more comfortable championing the underdogs. I couldn’t say I never picked on anyone, I was seven years old once upon a time, but I even recall sticking up for other kids at that age. And I could fight quite well, so some bullies did get their comeuppance.

Also, FWIW, I can tell you that a lot of the popular kids were often as insecure as the unpopular ones, it’s a part of adolescence. Sometimes the picking on other kids was a sick way of making them feel better about themselves.

Good luck.

I’m still an adolescent (just finally out of high school and in college). I was made fun of from 4th grade until I graduated (although, when I was a senior, I had made friends of enough people that I felt confident enough to be bitchy towards those who were bitchy to me).

I remember people making fun of my clothes (I went through stages–skater stage, hippie stage, goth stage) and the way I talk (I’ve never had much of a southern drawl). I even was laughed at because I stopped playing sports in high school and pursued the fine arts instead.

Now I’m in college, in a program and a dorm with people just like me. I’m here on (almost full) scholarship–when the “popular” people were out partying, I was studying, or writing music with my friends, or rehearsing for my school’s theatre productions–and it landed me here, finally somewhat content to be who I am.

I feel very sorry for your daughter, Bill. I understand the depression that stems from your peer’s disapproval. Just tell her that there is someone who was in the same situation thinking about her right now. My email is in my profile–if you or she have any questions, feel free to email me.

I concur in full with the ohters; Kids are very cruel.

Middle school was very tough for me. Reckon I was around, actually a little less than your daughter’s age. Bad trouble at home, just moved. No friends and no respect.

Things changed, though. By late high school, I was still not popular, but I had a lot of friends (we were the geeks), I had to work for a living after school and I had a girlfriend. And, with a temper s bad as mine was at the time, nobody made fun of me any more because I would have broken their face.

As it is, it was just a long, arduous growning experience.

Now I have a career, a wife (yup, my old girlfriend), a kid on the way and a complete control over my once-frightening temper.

Adolescence is an awkward time for everyone. If you survive it, though, you’re usually better off for it.

I was neither a pickerer or a pickeree. In fact, the vast majority of people at my school were the same. Frankly, the “oh, I’m so trendy I could just frickin’ die” group were more often than not, objects of scorn. So there is hope out there (in another continent, but still …) :slight_smile:

I remember once in grade 9 I took a brief fall from grace and picked mercilessly on this one girl. We’re great friends now, but at the time I absolutely loathed her. Although it’s a cliche, it was a self-esteem thing. She was on a half-scholarship to the school and I felt threatened by her, even though I had a full-scholarship. I pretended it was other stuff, but in reality, I didn’t believe I deserved my scholarship and was petrified that she was smarter than me. Ridiculous stuff in hindsight, but it made her (and me) miserable for months.

Man! This post brings back some nightmare memories!

Kids have a remarkable resiliency because of their youth and can bounce back from almost anything and even lead something like a dual lifestyle when something goes wrong, hiding their feelings and appearing cheerful.

In high school, including junior high, I was a mess! Being tall and thin and not willing to fight, plus being shy as hell I was picked on from the day I entered seventh grade (where we went from one cozy class all year, to 6 different ones every day) until I graduated. Plus I had a firm set of moral standards, like not picking on weaker kids, not making fun of different people, not agreeing with the ‘rule of the fist’ and I hated sports. (Still do.)

I made it through high school without my folks realizing that there was something wrong with me and I did not confess my ‘cowardliness’ to them because I was ashamed and did not want them to think poorly of me. (Not that they would have.) Because of being ridiculed and picked on, I did not enjoy my school years and never rose to my full potential. It affected my grades, my social abilities, and my perception of people in general. (I’ve had therapy, can you tell?)

I missed the Prom, being terrified of my ‘enemies’ embarrassing and threatening me there, never dated in school because my self image was too low to believe a girl would want me, and being terribly shy, missed Senior Skip Day - where all graduating seniors got the day off at a beach hotel for a big pool party (like skinny me was going to walk around there in a bathing suit while the tough ‘he-men’ were looking for such targets to pick on to impress the chicks with).

I developed a long lasting depression and a nice group of anxieties that have lasted for years and have taken professional therapy to help alleviate.

Conversely, being young, I also had good times during this hell. I was in Scouts and did well, I later became a Scout Master, I was creative, had good times with my friends, my family, laughed a lot, did a lot of reading (the library was my port in the storm and I guess I need to thank the bullies for that because I love to read to this day) and I excelled at my first real job with major responsibilities and went to college.

However, the damage done in school showed up later in my social life, in my work and in how I dealt with people and later by a severe depression. It ruined my self confidence because I was so insecure that I never managed to rise beyond a certain level in my jobs, being afraid and intimidated by bosses, and not being able to get along in certain jobs with certain types of people, like in construction. At one time, I was over confident and that got me into trouble because I over compensated for my inadequacies and felt that I was better than my bosses and wound up getting fired a few times.

Basically, I was convinced in school that because I would not or could not hammer my tormentors into bloody bits, that I was worth little and a Real Man used his fists to settle differences, and since I did not, I was not a Real Man.

I started having anxiety attacks and problems in school and I hid them from my family but my first real bad panic attack happened right after graduation and scared me and my family. It took years to find out what was going on and get a handle on it because, back then, the doctors did not know what a panic attack was.

I’ve avoided class reunions also because of the handful of thugs who tormented me through school and have been in therapy for over 5 years now. It finally reached the point that the suppressed problems and depression could no longer be controlled by me and I started really messing up, screwing up at my job and becoming an alcoholic.

So, today at my late age, I’m in therapy and no longer drink booze and my recollection of my adolescent years is a combination of pleasure and pain with the school time being perceived as 6 years of hell. Had I not been picked on so much and terrified, I probably would have graduated with Honors instead of barely managing to get out of school with a passing grade.

Years later, I was surprised to discover, after some testing, that I actually have a high IQ! In school, thanks to some of the uncaring teachers and the thugs, I figured I was pretty stupid.

I’ve done some remarkable things in my life, but had it not been for being browbeaten most of the time in school, I might have been able to do even more and would not now be living on such a low income and having to have years of therapy to get my head together. I might even have married instead of having a string of broken relationships that were few and far between and I might not have turned into a drunk by using booze to make me feel better about myself and to ease the depression I kept fighting.

Work with your daughter and especially let her know that you do not think poorly of her because she has been picked on. Get her therapy as needed because a depression can smolder in her for years and get real bad later or get real bad now in the blink of an eye. Puberty is hard enough without being picked on in school. A self image is a terrible thing to get kicked out of you and can affect how you grow up.

I was picked on. But I don’t know anyone who WASN’T, to be honest. It sucks, but there’s not an underclass that suffers - pretty much every kid gets it to some degree.

If your daughter is down about being picked on, that’s natural. If it’s affecting her life, though, and she gets into trouble, you may want to explore ways of getting her self-esteem cranked up a little. I would suggest that you encourage her to do other stuff outside school, especially anything that can contribute to building confidence. There’s no quick fix, but sowing the seeds of a good self-image will help her get out of it.

As long as she can get out of high school okay and get to college, she’ll be fine; adults really don’t act the same way. Follow the advice of everyone else in the thread. Be supportive and loving but maintain discipline and rules. Always be complimentary. (Never, ever, ever put a member of your family down, ever, for any reason, but that’s self-evident.) Get her into karate or a summer adventure camp or something. Just keep being a loving Dad. It’ll work out.

wild bill, i am so sorry for your daughter. i was the class “scapegoat” up until my junior year in high school, when i finally found a safe place to fit in. i realized i was a nerd, and joined the other nerds, and we all had a good time together.

that said, i think the best advice you’ve gotten here, so far, is from shibboleth. your daughter needs to have a safe place where she can discover who she is, and what she likes. adolescence is such a scary time, and so many young people worry so very much about what their peers think of them that they don’t know what they think of themselves. it’s really hard to like yourself when the “in crowd” is telling you that you’re worthless. maybe you can find something that she really loves, and is good at, or has always wanted to try, and let her try. something like riding lessons, or golf lessons, or tennis or even swing dancing lessons. if she tries something out, likes it and becomes really good at it, it’ll be a huge boost to her self-esteem. and it sounds like she needs that.

also understand that although you love her dearly, what she really wants is the acceptance of her peers. she loves you too, but you’re not the one hurting her. she wants the people hurting her to stop, and no matter how much you love her, you can’t make them stop. it’s not that your love is worth less than the regard of her peers, it’s that the pain they’re putting her through is, right now, stronger. that can be painful for you, but please try to resist the urge to fell that “my love for her should be enough.” i’m really sorry, but right now, it’s not.

under no circumstances should you try to make things right between her and the other kids. don’t call their parents, or the principal at school. trust me, that will only make the situation much much worse. she needs your love at home, but trying to “fix” things yourself will only cause her great embarrassment.

finally, it might be good for her to talk to somebody else. not the school counselor, because she’ll just be the butt of more jokes if anybody sees her go in. check with your insurance company to see if they cover any kind of outpatient counseling. mine doesn’t, but we have a program through work called the “employee assistance code”, where employees and their families can get up to 5 free visits with a mental health professional, completely confidential and at no charge. your boss won’t even know she’s going.

love her and support her. she needs you more than she knows.

I was picked on mercilessly in elementary and junior high. This was a private school with small classes, so we pretty much grew up with the same people from daycare, but that didn’t matter once people figured out how to be “cool.” It was bad. Then, my family moved to another state as I entered high school, and thus I entered public school for the first time as well. Being picked on before had given me the “bully-magnet” quality that made my freshman year hard, but somehow I learned how to hit back. That didn’t always work, but it helped a little and after that first year, I made more friends and actually gained some respect so that I elevated from someone to zero in on and humiliate to just someone who wasn’t noticed. I was fine with that, I had my friends and family, and high school managed to be a wonderful experience.
As for why people pick on others, I believe it’s just basic human nature. This is not relegated to children or teenagers at all, but its just our corrupt nature to make ourselves feel better by putting someone else down. Even the simple act of calling someone a name is a struggle for power–you’re reducing another individual with the same hopes and fears just like you, to a thing, whether its a “shthead", "fckwad”, or even “loser,” and if they are just that name and nothing else, that means you’re better.
My little brother went thru the same thing, but mom has told me he’s much more a spitfire than I ever was. He’s much more apt to throw down with someone and he takes no crap, and he’s a little guy, smaller than me. I’m so proud he naturally has that instinct to stick up for himself that I and so many others have had to learn the hard way.

Iwannaknow That was very nice. Too bad about your school years. Seems things would have gone better had you just had a couple people to keep you afloat.

Mrs. Heap and I used to do that. We weren’t popular, but we were loud and violent in our way, so people tried not to screw around with us. If we saw the rich kids picking on one of the sickly little nerd types, we’d shoo’em away.

My wife also had soem health problems in high school, and was always relegated to the classes with all the trouble-makers and really low-scoring feebs. They’d pick on her til she’s cry just about every day. Really got me because they’d never do it when I was around because they knew I’d go ballistic. I did mention that temper problem, right?

Anyway, however old you are now, I’m glad you’re doing well, and that was sound advice the Bill for his kid.

My sympathies, WB. I’ve got two adolescent daughters also, and it really tears me up when I see them suffer at the hands of their peers. They’re doing pretty well now, but it seems it’s always touch and go for the duration of middle and high school.

Others have already given good advice here, especially giving them both structure and unconditional love at home.

I don’t know why people are the way they are. It seems that people are the problem. Yet, they’re also all we have to work with towards the solution, too.

My own adolescence was hell until 11th grade, when I started at a new school. Then I managed to just keep a low profile, find a few friends, and do stuff we enjoyed, while avoiding the notice of the popular and/or nasty people. I managed this by joining a few clubs at the new school, and finding others with common interests. I always had lots of love and support at home, and that helped, but my parents were powerless when it came to making things better for me at school; that was something I just had to deal with by myself.

(physician persona on now) It might not be a bad idea to consider having her assessed for depression by a competent physician or mental health professional. Sometime it’s hard to sort out what’s a normal up-and-down life for a teen, and what’s a bigger problem. (Real person persona resumed).

Anyway, all the best to your daughter, Bill. And I hope you keep sharing this stuff. Pains shared are pains lessened (dang, I sound like Stuart Smalley now).
[sub]and leave the steroids alone![/sub]

Qadgop

This is sort of long. I apologize…

From 3rd grade on, I was abused. I would say teased, but it got progressively worse as the years went on – without a break.

I did not have a safe haven to go to at home, as my parents always thought us kids did everything wrong. Not a good relationship there… My siblings teased me because I was the youngest and it was fun for them.

Having nowhere to turn during those years has led me to having major chronic depression (clinical diagnosis). I have very few friends (3, basically) and have a very hard time making new friends because it usually comes down to them betraying me in some fashion. Trust is a big issue with me.

My experiences have taught me that people pretend to like me long enough to gain information, then use that against me from that point on. I was foolish enough to belive that getting out of school and into the workforce would make some kind of difference. I was wrong. Big time.

It started with taking my stuff and playing keep away. I cried because they didn’t realize what kind of trouble I’d be in if I lost any of my things.

Later it was clothes and hair. (being the youngest of seven doesn’t lend to fashion or hair, but I never cared about that stuff anyway).

By the time high school came around, two grade schools blended in to one and then I had a whole new set of peers to gang up with the old ones. This is when the physical abuse started. Gym class was just a cover for seeing how much physical pain they could inflict on me.

One day, when we were at the driving range for gym, some students thought it would be fun to get a bucket of golf balls and pelt me with them as I tried to practice my drive.
The teachers thought this was hilarious and did nothing to stop them.

I developed a nasty slice that would almost boomerang a ball behind me to try and hit them. Unfortunately, now I can’t get rid of it!!

My opinion: Kids are cruel. I learned from my psychologist that the reason things started in 3rd grade (I was everyone’s friend up until then) is due to social cues. I apparently didn’t learn them at home and didn’t react to situations as they thought I should. It comes down to the battle of the fittest.

Adults can be just as bad, if not worse.

Basically, I wouldn’t wish my life on my worst enemy – but I can’t say I’m unhappy when things go horriby wrong in the lives of those who tormented me throughout my life.

WB, make sure your daughter knows you love her (and not with just words, but deeds). That can go a LONG way into helping her become an adult with a positive self image.

Bill, have you and Mrs. Bill considered having your daughter seeing a psychologist?

Perhaps I am in the minority, but I have had a very good High School experience so far. (Im a junior.) I was never really picked on in 4-8th grade, I just kept a low profile. People didn’t notice me. Now, in HS, I dont know of anyone bullying, but if it did happen to me I would do something about it. In fact, I dont think anyone has ever confronted me with anything that could even got to a heated verbal argument, let alone a physical one. I attribute that to the fact that I am not mean to anybody I don’t know well enough to judge their character. Having friends that will throw down with you helps too.

I really appreciate it. I haven’t slept to good the past week. I really feel for alot of people that have posted what happened to them in their youth. I thought I had it bad. I guess there are alot kids that get picked on and have trouble later because of it. Maybe schools should start having seminars and assemblies(sp) on why kids shouldn’t pick on other kids especially in light of Columbine and other tragedies that have happened.

Guin,

Yes, she has an appointment tomorrow. We have also pulled her out of the public school system. She will be starting private school soon(this is by her request btw). I think it will do her good she has been caught up with the wrong group of friends and they are leading down the primrose path. I can not believe the kids today. The things they do are just unreal.

Also Guin,

How was your school days?

I’ve always felt that it’s basically a power issue. When you’re growing up, you’re trying to figure out “who you are”, and part of that involves a desire to feel like you’re strong/powerful. And an easy way to do that is to pick on someone, boosting your ego, and deluding yourself into believing that you have some kind of power or control over others.

A desire to fit in also probably plays a part; if the rest of your “group” is picking on someone, it’s difficult to stand up and say “Hey guys! This isn’t right, cut it out.” At best, a person in that situation may simply keep quiet; at worst, he/she will join in. This isn’t limited to kids, either; adults can exhibit “me too” and “trying to fit in” behaviour. It’s just that, as adults, I think we’re somewhat better equipped to handle situations like that if we’re the target of others’ insults, as we’ve all experienced it before.

Myself, I wasn’t much of anything. I never picked on people, but wasn’t picked on much either. I received the usual tauntings all kids get, but I’d usually just ignore them with a “Yeah, whatever. If you say so.” rolleyes type of attitude. It stops being fun for the bullies if they can’t provoke a reaction and they move on. Being a decently large guy and an arrogant SOB in general probably helped a lot in those types of situations.

Depressed.
I was the only ‘gifted’ child in elementary (They gave us all IQ tests) had to take seperate classes from the rest of the kids for the first few years. Didn’t know how to socialize with my peers. Eccentric, introverted, antisocial. I loved books and animals. I could play sports until I screwed something up, got angry, and played worse, got angrier, cried, well, obviously I wasn’t very well adjusted. Moved to a different school for Junior High and so did some of the other kids in my class, things got worse there, puberty, real depression hit. My grades stayed good but I had no friends. This is a low-population area, so there wasn’t even really a ‘freaks’ group. If you were different, you were isolated. I finally got a few friends later on, one of whom is a sadistic bitch who, next time I see her, will be eating my fist. I’m not joking. Sheree, I hope you’re reading this. She got off on turning Erin and I against each other, telling Erin I slept with her boyfriend, telling me Erin was telling my then crush about what I was saying about him, etc etc etc. I hate remembering this stuff. Spent most of HS either crying in class, slacking, on the computer, fighting with my mother, cutting class oh so rarely as I was a goody twoshoes, grades dropping because I was getting stoned at night, getting kicked out of class as I learned how to flirt, wow, graduation already? Sometime in there I turned into an auto-sexually obsessed nymphomaniacal virgin. (well, the virgin part was already there)

Going back into that school building turns me back into the awkward, depressed, repressed, antisocial person I was. I am not so much now (with the depressed as an aside… god this is a shitty day) as it was only 4 years ago. I thought about suicide often. No counselor ever offered to help me. My father wasn’t around often (worked away on contract) my mother didn’t know how to deal with a severely depressed teenager. There were no suicide attempts, I don’t know why as I was totally miserable (to the point of literally fearing getting on the bus each day, then fearing when I got halfway there, then fearing getting off the bus, walking to class, etc) and didn’t want to be around anyone. At all. Ever. Hey, I still feel like that today. (I’ll be ok in the morning.) I used to think up the most outlandish ways to kill myself in public. I never told anyone about those.

Excuse the stream of consciousness format.
WB, just be there for her, and talk to her. TALK. If she looks very upset, talk to her about anything but that, until she calms down. I know when I am feeling very depressed, talking about it usually breaks me down. Like right now.