When Cops Lie

Factual Questions
1

I was on the highway and this cop pulled me over. He wrote me a ticket for going 74 in a 55. He said that he could have given me a ticket for going 75 and that would have gotten me a reckless driving conviction so that no insurance company would deal with me afterward. Like I’m supposed to be grateful to him for being such a nice guy.

The fact is, he lied. My cruise control had been set at 68 or 69. Sure, I was speeding, but the tacit rule on that highway is that they don’t pull you over below 70, and I always make sure to stay below 70. If he had written me a ticket for going 69, he would have been within his rights and I wouldn’t protest. But he lied and made it 74 for no reason I can see, other than to be abusive of his power.

So if I go to court and tell the truth, and the cop lies, who do you think the judge will believe? Am I SOL? Is there any way truth can prevail? Would a lawyer be able to help?

2

It’s always worth a shot. If yuo have a pretty convincing case the judge may let you off, especially since most people who know they were speeding wouldn’t go through the trouble of going to court to lie about it which would look good on your part where you tell the truth. I just confused myself somehow.

3

I’m confused. Is there a difference between a 74 mph ticket and a 69 mph ticket? I mean, you’re still going to court and you’re still getting a ticket since you admit to going 14 miles an hour above the speed limit. (You must live in a relatively lax jurisdiction. In Chicago, 5 mph has always been the tacit rule. Not that anyone really abides by it half the time anyway.)

I generally go to court on speeding tickets, but not to actually have my case heard - the judge generally allows you to bargain down your ticket. Basically, in Chicago this mean “probation,” in which you pay the fine, but it doesn’t go on your record unless you get another ticket in 6 months (or maybe it was a year.) And even then it’s unlikely to get on your record. (I got two speeding tickets in 3 months, got probation for both of them, yet somehow they never ended up on my driving record. Beats the hell out of traffic school, I’ll tell you that.)

Who do I think the judge will believe? The cop, of course. Unless you have a convincing case, but it sounds like it’s just a case of his word vs your word.

4

Is it possible that your speedometer isn’t absolutely correct?

Was the officer using radar? Did he say that he clocked you at 75 or above or simply that he had the power to write you a ticket despite that?

I’m just wondering if this is truly a case of lying or if there are other possibilities.

5

In Virginia, speeding is divided into three “classes” of offenses: 1-9 miles per hour over the speed limit, which nets you a three point reduction on your license; 10-19 mph over, a four-point offense; and 20 or more mph over, a six-point offense.

In the scenario described in the OP, if it happened in Virginia, there would be no difference between the points assessed, regardless of which version the court accepted as the truth. There is a system of fines, however, pegged to the actual speed - on the order of $3 per mph over. In this example, the OP would be paying roughly $18 less with his story.

In my experience, a judge would be very likely to accept a guilty plea to 68 and set the fine accordingly, since the points remain the same and the Commonwealth is only losing $18 with the deal.

  • Rick
6

I’ve wondered for awhile how accurate spedometers are. Occasionally the police put up a sign with a radar detector, something like "Your speed is: " and then whatever the gun picked up for your speed. I’ve found that my spedometer always reads about 5mph faster than what that setup displays. So I guess it’s possible that spedometers aren’t very precise. But it does seem to me that since you did set your cruise control to the lower speed, and all you’ve got to tell you how fast you’re going is the spedometer, it’s worth going to court to explain things, especially if the fine is significantly larger for the higher speed (which it would be around here).

7

What exactly is your point? If you were insisting that you were below the speed limit, that’s one thing, but you were at least 13 mph above it.

And there is no rule that you can speed. Most cops don’t bother if you’re an mph or two above, but you were 13 mph over. Of course you’re going to get a ticket.

The idea that they won’t pull you over under 70 is just plain nuts. If you were going 55 in a 30 mile zone, you can bet they’ll pull you over.

As for the exact figures – I doubt the cop was lying. Your speedometer may have be off, or the cop may have mismeasured. But given the facts, that difference doesn’t take away the fact you were speeding, and you would have to admit you were speeding in court in order to make your arguement. It’s pretty dumb to tell them right off you were guilty.

8

Why speeding? I was on a trip to US last month, we were in a car suddenly a car next to me stop cuz a motor cycle stop in front of it, so the car behind the car (confusing but i got no time to explain) hit the front car back but no the middle, hit the corner so it fly & flip up side down RIGHT behind us. My dad saw that the car is flipping so he speed up so fast to excape the accident, it was rlly close. The question is why do we need to speed up if nothing important happening like ur wife is rdy to deliver or sending someone to hospital. Right???

I am learning to drive next year. So happy

9

I expect that cops differ in what they accept as speeding. In your jurisdiction, it may not be acceptable to drive 70mph in a 55, in my area you’ll almost never be pulled over for anything less than 16mph over in a 55. I’ve gone right by speed traps more times than I can count and they just don’t bother. On the freeways, the posted limit is 70, speed of traffic is usually 85 and once again I can almost guarantee you will never be pulled over at 85… unless its the middle of the night and the cop is bored or trying to nail drunks.

peace,
~mixie

10

A lot of you are saying he was at least 13 miles over the speed limit. Perhaps, but not necessarily. There are lots of major highways that now have 65 MPH limits. The NJ turnpike for example. I-80 I think as well. I’m sure there are others as well. Not to mention that stretch in Montana(I think thats where it is, assuming it hasn’t changed) with no posted limit. If he was on a 65 stretch, there’s a big difference between 68 and 74, especially since a lot of the states that have 65 zones double the fines and/or points in those zones.

11

Nanook, from the OP: …ticket for going 74 in a 55.

12

The mile markers on most major hiways and byways can be used to check your speedometer. They are not exact, but sample several and check it out. Grab a stop watch, set the cruise to 60, and check to see if you really are going a mile a minute. Don’t set the cruise to 60 if the posted speed limit is 30 :slight_smile:

13

The point(s) seem pretty clear to me. Jomo’s Nutopia may very well have a higher fine for a 74 mph offense. Furthermore, whether or not Jomo was breaking the law, exaggeration of the offense is still wrong. And every untruth leaves The Man’s pooper exposed, even if only for a moment. I have a couple of recommendations.

If you’ve got the cash (usually in the $50-$100 range), go get your car put on a dynamometer. Make sure to get it tested as close to 70 mph as is allowed. If your speedo is in fact off, many judges will cut you some slack on the fine or even reduce the offense. Second, you need to know for sure that your car is doing the advertised 69 mph in cruise control, or this can happen again.

Go to court. You have several ways to win, all of them low probability but nevertheless possible. The officer may be unable to show up in court that day, and your case may be dismissed. If your dynamometer test showed that your speedo was reading 6 mph low, the judge may credit the cost of the test against your fine, which at least nets you a free dyno ride. If it came out more than 6 mph low, well, there be another angle which probably shouldn’t be discussed–remember, people can be impeached for lying about blow jobs these days.

If the prosecution is claiming they got you on radar, you can ask for the radar printout. This defense is less surefire than you might suspect, because the 5-0 may have tagged some other car at 75, and that could bite you before the bench. Still, it’s worth a try. Then there is radar gun calibration. Here’s a line of questioning I’ve always wanted to try:

You: “When was your radar set last calibrated?”

Cop: “Our radar sets are calibrated daily.”

You: “You need to calibrate them daily, eh? Well, then certainly you have a record of how far off the radar gun was at the end of that day…”

I’ll bet you they don’t. Whether or not the judge will care is another thing entirely.

Finally, you might want to consider exercising your possilbe right to a continuance. You never know, Johnny Law might have found a job in another state six months down the line, records might be lost, the backlog might be so great that marginal offenses are dismissed en masse, or the world might end in firey death for us all. Continuing the case may also allow time for older tickets to drop off your record and hold your insurance rate in check. It will at the very least delay the increase. And of course, it will put further pressure on the no doubt already overburdened Nutopian traffic court system, which is just what the bastards deserve for turning road travel into a petty and annoying form of direct taxation by the police.

14

FYI - I sat in traffic court one day while a nice young man made a very similar case. He very intelligently and cogently explained that he was not in such excess of the speed limit as the officer had claimed. The judge listened carefully and said, “Ok, now the policeman says you were speeding and YOU say you were speeding, and you’re asking me to say that you weren’t speeding? Not going to happen. Guilty.”

15

No offense, Mojo, but you are going to argue to the judge that the cop lied, even though he had nothing to gain by it.

And that you are telling the truth about the margin by which you were violating the law you have already confessed to breaking, and the fact that you will save a hundred bucks or so if you are believed.

Good luck, I guess.

Regards,
Shodan

16

Only way to beat a ticket in court or in front of a magistrate is to peck away at the cop’s case:

  1. You were NOT speeding (if you cannot tell this lie, pay the fine - you’re done)

  2. Did the police officer notice the rather large semi passing you? Maybe he picked up that vehicle…

Most other excuses will get tossed. Your best bet was to talk yourself out of the ticket on the roadside. Acting like a real jerk is the best and most consistent ploy I’ve seen work. Seems John Q. simply cannot resist the opportunity to show that he is a nicer person that a jerk like you - 50% chance of being let off with a warning.

The above statement is intentionally misogynistic. It simply doesn’t work with female cops, or so I’ve been told.

Good luck.

17

** Jomo Mojo ** (paraphrasing, not quoting!) You see, Judge, I was deliberately flauting the law and had consciously set my crusie control above the speed limit, just like always do 'cos I reckon I can get away with it. But that cop’s a liar.

Judge: So you’re admitting to breaking the law in this occasion, breaking the law habitually, and calling the honesty of this police officer into question?

Hmm, not a line of defense I’d recommend. But then, IANAL.

18

I would show up in court, and hope the officer doesn’t show up. That’s a pretty good shot right there.

If he does show up, all you can really hope for is to plea down the fine.

If you were the judge, who would you believe? The cop, who may have been filling a quota, but had no reason to inflate the speed on an admittedly deserved ticket, or the perp, whose only real defense is “I wasn’t breaking the law as much as he said I was” and who has a financial stake in getting the ticket thrown out.

19

i think the point the cop was trying to make to the OP, perhaps, was that a full twenty miles per hour over the speed limit is an offense called reckless driving–a felony, even. in any case, a conviction for reckless driving would raise his insurance rates and come with a steep fine, no doubt. the cop cut him a break, methinks.

20

Not to be contrarian, but usually when a cop says that he’s giving you a break on the MPH and you KNOW that you weren’t going as fast as they claim, they actually don’t know who they got with the gun.

If you can lie about your speed in court and sleep at night, I’d have my day in court and hammer on the cop. It’s sleazy and dishonest, but so are speed traps used as revenue generation.