I think it’s all interconnected as part of the culture of bullying and sexism. Vilda had only survived in his position so long as Rubiales was there to protect him; and Vilda was part of the despicable efforts to get women players to show support for Rubiales (and to lie about it when they would not do so).
I think this is a #MeToo moment and when people believe that these creeps are no longer in a position of unchallenged power much more is going to come out. There’s a bizarre story that until a few years ago Vilda had a rule that women players could not lock their hotel doors until midnight, so that he could go and “check on them”.
But, therein lies the problem. We live in a society and have to get along as a group. If you, personally, are totally opposed to being touched in any manner then when do you get to decide to call the cops?
I have been in many crowds. Concerts, festivals, and so on. Played sports where contact happens and smacks on the back/butt happen. I have been in bars when a sports team has won and people are hugging all around…maybe even a MWAH kiss (in my case a few Bull’s championships and Cubs World Series). Hugging all around. Not groping. Not Frenching anyone within reach. Just general exuberance.
I’d suggest if you (general you) are a person who is not ok with any of that then you do not put yourself in such places. If you do put yourself in such places then you have to accept the norm for that place.
We all know that’s the thought that kept us up at night.
To me, and I’m certainly not a 15 year old girl (but I did grow up in the 80s), the intent wasn’t meant as a blanket granting of consent to anyone who had a crush on her, but rather the expression of a fantasy, that if certain guys had a crush on her, it would be fun if they kissed her without asking. A “swept off her feet” fantasy.
But that is exactly it: society HAS established a legal procedure to determine whether the contact the person experiences rises to the level of deserving punishment. So it may be used.
And “be nowhere where that may happen” is not an answer.
Actually post #75 is the more relevant one. And in case of TL;DR: yes, it is possibly a crime, the judge will decide about that, the prosecution has already presented a case, as has the player, Ms Hermoso, and the potential penalty ranges from a fine to four years in prison.
IANAL, but from context I guess the verdict will be: guilty, and the sentence will be just under two years, so Mr. Rubiales will be granted automatic probation, but Ms Hermoso will be able to claim he is guilty. Oh, and probably a fine of about 300,000 Euro (six months worth of his salary in Spain, not counting bonuses and FIFA salaries and perks). I may well be completely off.
I was a 15 year old girl ( although slightly before the 80s) and I would say 1) that she was giving him permission to kiss her and 2) that she never would have said that to someone she didn’t want to kiss
I mean, maybe–and I did realize it at the time. I was certainly mooning about, and she was probably exasperated with me, and just wanted it out in the open. But see: painfully shy. Knowing all that just made me more miserable. (Eventually she started dating someone else, and I wrote her a letter full of self-pitying confessions of my feelings, and she wrote me back a letter that was like, “what is even wrong with you, your ideas about romance are jacked,” and it was something of a wakeup call for me).
Thing is, even though it seemed like a good idea to her at the time, it’s no way to run a society. What she thought might have worked for her in that moment is not what would work in millions of other moments. Unsolicited kisses are real risky in how they’re gonna make the recipient feel.
If you are in a bar and a local sports team wins and someone hugs without your consent do you think calling the police and pressing charges is appropriate?
Yeah. We are in a much better place today. She was playing by the rules at the time, which were kinda broken. Today, it would be okay for her explicitly express sexual interest in you (a huge non-no at the time for “nice girls”) including initiating that kiss herself, either verbally or by physically inviting you to meet her extended lips. Not just with an ambiguous statement like what she actually said.
And I’d suggest that even in situation like that, some people are leaning into the action, and others are holding back, and you shouldn’t reach out towards those who aren’t into it.
Consent doesn’t have to be verbal. Consent often isn’t verbal. One person reaches their arms out and the other joins them in an embrace – that’s totally and explicitly consensual. It’s usually not hard to tell who in the crowd WANTS a hug. As I said above, I DO frequent situations where strangers hug each other, and we all manage to negotiate it and not hug the minority who prefer to pass.
Wouldn’t the facing charges or not be determined by the authority receiving the complaint, and then would come the decision on jailing or not?
Really, the incident triggering the thread is a case of what looks like an inappropriate, unwanted, unwelcomed trespass of personal boundaries, which the trespasser refused to address in a context of social courtesy or labor relations, so, failing that, she escalates to the Law. You use the tools you are given.