That is a lot of hand waving for no reason. The claim was made that the Muslims were nasty people and the “evidence” cited was an opinion poll taken in Egypt. You can dance to your heart’s content, and none of the people thus polled are going to run for the U.S. Presidency.
Take the same poll in Dearborn and see whether you get similar results or else stop being silly.
I sense a little bit of a desire to avert your gaze from this (though not as much as one could hope for).
Say the Chair of the Federal Reserve converts to Islam and announces that he does not intend to resign, but to keep his position and help “move the Fed in a direction that does not rely on riba”. A pundit, “Ken Barson”, says the Chair’s religious beliefs make him ineligible to run a modern Central Bank. Religious bigotry?
You are the one who dropped an Egyptian poll into a discussion of the U.S. presidential race.
As to what Carson might have thought, I have already quoted his beliefs, (including his ignorance and lies).
BZZZT!
Your attempt fails. If the Fed Chair announced a specific action, the response would be to that action, not to a presupposition based on his religion. If Carson wants to oppose radicalized, fundamentalist, Wahhabist Muslims, he is free to do so. That is not what he said. His original statement indicated that he presumed that any Muslim running for office was such a person. He then demanded that the person would renounce his religion before Carson would support him and then claimed that any Muslim whom he could support would be condemned by the Muslim community. That sort of nonsense is nothing but ignorant bigotry.
No, Carson did not say that. :smack:
The poll surveyed Muslims from countries as diverse as Niger, Djibouti, Jordan, Pakistan and Malaysia. I think you are correct that far fewer American Muslims are in favor or executing apostates.
Could you hazard a guess or point to some research that shows what percentage or Islamic Dearbornites support Islamic financial concepts ? Are such concepts compatible with the job of a Central Banker or other financial regulator?
Is your “point” that Port Authority Carson wouldn’t support it personally, not that it shouldn’t be permitted at all? Not a great choice of hill to die on, but suit yourself.
The 86% figure was specific to Egypt with the additional provision I noted. And the interesting thing about those polls is that those countries are not enacting laws to support those opinions. I cannot identify the exact disconnect, but the reality is that anti-apostasy laws (in the rare places that have them), have only resulted in a half dozen convictions in the last few years, (and far fewer before that), have occurred almost exclusively in backwater regions of those countries, and have tended to be overthrown by higher courts.
I have no idea how many Muslims in Dearborn favor Islamic or Capitalist economic policies. I can’t imagine how it would mean anything. No one who opposes Capitalism is going to get elected to any office higher then mayor or state legislator in the U.S. Anyone who ran for POTUS on such a platform would have to drop out for lack of funds within a month.
That is not what Carson opposed, however, and that was not the extent of his calumny.
Quote:
CHUCK TODD:
Let me wrap this up by finally dealing with what’s been going on, Donald Trump, and a deal with a questioner that claimed that the president was Muslim. Let me ask you the question this way: Should a President’s faith matter? Should your faith matter to voters?
DR. BEN CARSON:
Well, I guess it depends on what that faith is. If it’s inconsistent with the values and principles of America, then of course it should matter. But if it fits within the realm of America and consistent with the constitution, no problem.
CHUCK TODD:
So do you believe that Islam is consistent with the constitution?
DR. BEN CARSON:
No, I don’t, I do not.
CHUCK TODD:
So you–
DR. BEN CARSON:
I would not advocate that we put a Muslim in charge of this nation. I absolutely would not agree with that.
CHUCK TODD:
And would you ever consider voting for a Muslim for Congress?
DR. BEN CARSON:
Congress is a different story, but it depends on who that Muslim is and what their policies are, just as it depends on what anybody else says, you know. And, you know, if there’s somebody who’s of any faith, but they say things, and their life has been consistent with things that will elevate this nation and make it possible for everybody to succeed, and bring peace and harmony, then I’m with them.
CHUCK TODD:
And I take it you believe the president was born in the United States and is a Christian?
DR. BEN CARSON:
I believe that he is. I have no reason to doubt what he says.
CHUCK TODD:
All right, Dr. Carson I will leave it there, I look forward to speaking with you again soon.
DR. BEN CARSON:
All right, thank you very much.
Yup, he sure did. But I’m only a little outraged because I expect no more from Republicans. The stupid hate thing isn’t working. Neither is denying that a hateful comment was intended in a hateful way. He can qualify the statement after the fact in any half assed way he chooses, but he ain’t fooling anyone.
Just shut up.
I actually agree with Carson 100% on all of those statements. Now all he has to do is call out Fundamentalist Christians* running for office substituting “Bible” for “Qur’an” and “What the Bible says” for “Sharia Law”.
*aka Teabaggers
Here we have a thread that is all about calling Carson a hateful bigot because of what he said about Muslims. Is there no irony in people saying “If you substitute Christian for Muslim, it is fine” ?
Here is a story that mentions a very smart, fundamentalist person who believes something that most modern people do not: that it is wrong to violate the prohibition in Deuteronomy 22:11 against clothes made of wool and linen. If Aumann was running for President, would it be religious bigotry to use this fact to urge that he not be elected? This belief of his probably would not make a lot of difference in the conduct of his office. Electing a Christian Scientist to be head of the CDC might be another matter, as might selecting a Muslim who believes in Islamic Finance to be the Secretary of the Treasury.
I don’t think one is a hateful bigot if given candidates C and C’, C’ being a young-earth creationist, you prefer C to C’. Nor M to M’ where M’ is in favor of laws that criminalize insulting Mohammed.
Are they the same people?
No.
Carson said that no Muslim should be president, which is more bigoted than saying that no Muslim fundamentalist should be president, which is in turn more bigoted than saying no Christian or Muslim fundamentalist.
P.S. excellent work on quote-mining. Saint Cad clearly implied that Carson should disavow Christian Fundamentalism in addition to Muslim Fundamentalism, despite what your out-of-context quotation implies.
I thought I was pointing out the irony that while he demands that a Muslim should run this country according to the Constitution rather than the Qur’an (which I agree with), no Pub seems to want to call out Christian politicians (e.g. Kim Davis) that think the[ir interpretation of the] Bible should run this country rather than the Constitution. But I agree with your inference of what I said too.
If I saw evidemce pr heard the candidate making statements that their religious beliefs are more important tha the law of the land. THAT would be sufficient in my mind not to vote for them. But even then. I wouldn’t claim they shouldn’t be eligible to run. Yet in my mind I’d still be comfortable thinking they’re not fit to be President.
But that is not the point. I’m all in favor of a politician living their religious code in their private lives. The problem is when they believe everyone should live by their religious codes because that is what Allah/Jehovah/Yahweh/FSM commands. Hey if Aumann doesn’t want to mix fibers good for him but don’t make a law preventing me from wearing 95% cotton/5% poly blends.
Alan Greenspan was a disciple of Ayn Rand. If he used Randian economics, instead of accepted economic theory, in running the Fed he should be kicked out. If your off-the-wall hypothetical Muslim rejected sound economic theory he should be kicked out also. Religion has nothing to do with it.
Greenspan’s screw-ups were not from Randianism.
Oh My! I’m devastated. How will I be able to get 8 hours of sleep tonight? :eek:
Bwahahahaha. :rolleyes:
I did not carefully read what Saint Cad wrote, and his post is not an example of what I meant. It is not hard to find in this thread, though.
Carson is at a disadvantage in that he is a specific example, whereas “Muslim” and “typical Republican” are general terms the definition of which people can disagree on.