Offering livestock to a girl’s parents,and particularly to her father, for her hand in marriage is treating her as a commodity, not a person. Saying you’ve been planning to do so since she was nine only adds to the insult to her.
But, it is an integral part of many Kenyans’ life — although declining under the influence of western cultural imperialism — many people there ( as well as in other parts of Africa and beyond ), they are not all just ‘Kenyans’, find it useful whether westerners approve or not.
In the case of the Kikuyu:
The Kikuyu are the largest ethnic group or tribe in Kenya, with some 6.6 million Kikuyus, about 23% of the total population here. They come from the central part of the country, centered around Mt. Kenya. Many of my co-workers are Kikuyu. The practice of dowry or the bride price is common throughout all the tribes of Kenya. A man can be expected to pay the equivalent of approximately five years of his projected salary to the family of his fiancé in order for the marriage to be culturally legitimate.
Affrocco Blog
By VERONICA CHEROP
I received this email from a concerned husband:
“I have been in a come-we-stay marriage for six years. My wife and I met at a private university and dated for the duration of our studies before we started living together. We have two children.
“Recently, I went to her parents to start the process of formalising our union, but what I was told has left me in shock. Her family demanded an unattainable target as dowry before they officially recognise me as their son-in-law. Their main argument was that her parents spent a lot of money to educate her in private schools and universities.
*The dowry celebration in Kenya is a very traditional ritual. This ceremony is about cherishing the relationships between the husband and the wife’s families, especially the bride’s parents. The gifts of food and money are offered to the bride’s parents, where the celebration takes place. My sister Dine and I were invited by our host-mother Margaret to go up country, in her home town, to attend her brother’s dowry celebration. The interesting fact here is that her brother has been married to his wife for 16 years, but in Kenya the dowry to a wife’s parents can last a lifetime. *
Trotting All Around Blog ( volunteer in Kenya )
This is too intimate and ingrained to dismiss as African backwardness.
Besides, another fellow offered the same thing for Miss Clinton, mentioned above:
*In 2000, Kenyan man offered cows, goats for Chelsea Clinton’s hand in marriage
In recent town hall meeting, Hillary Clinton says she would convey offer to daughter
Godwin Kipkemoi Chepkurgor is already married, says wife wouldn’t mind
*
CNN
Maybe it’s a rite of manhood for a Kenyan to piss off the US presidency every now and then.
- Kenyan news media, with the same heartwarming and interesting stories that fascinate everyone everywhere. aka ‘We Are Not So Different, You And I’.
From the sidebar:
Senator denies having sex with Nigerian man in car
Kenyatta University warns students to only masturbate in bed
Naked female biker blamed for distracting motorists on City street
I have worn my mtumba shirt for more than 10 years - Former Foreign Affairs minister
Kenyan women not gold diggers contrary to popular belief - Survey
Livestock will die, while a diamond is . . .
I’m with FairyChatMom.
Oh, I agree. But you have to start low, because the parents are going to bargain you up.
Your response is offensive. You take too much of the world’s problems onto yourself, and you want the whole of SDMB to be controlled by your better plans for humanity.
Your response is better than the one I was going to post. 
Just read this one. You’re on a roll, aren’t you!
Envious again, but, I’m above posting another frown smilie.
To be taken seriously, the Nairobi lawyer should throw in 7 years of indentured servitude to the prospective bride’s father.
I imagine that is more or less how he will reply, in more diplomatic terms. And I expect he will pass the offer along to Malia. (Perhaps with some pointed advice)
In cultures with bride-prices, it is still common for the woman’s consent to be required. Many Americans practice the custom of the groom asking permission of the bride’s father. I, personally, find that offensive, but don’t find a bride-price much more offensive. They aren’t really that different.
Meh. As a Peace Corp volunteer in Cameroon, I told would-be suitors that my father required 100 cows. I was always a little worried that someone would come up with it.
One older gentleman tried to bargain me down to a bag full of soap. It was a really big bag, I’ll give him that. But I passed.
Marriage customs are universally weird.
The offer is kind of squicky and it would be creepy if they went through with it…but why is the thread itself offensive? Siam Sam’s just discussing what happened, not endorsing it.
I assumed her own betrothal was livestock based, but was limited to a few guinea hens and a Schistosomes calf.
Amiright?
Chelsea Clinton was also offered marriage by a Kenyan when she was a teen in the White House. 40 goats and 20 cows. I believe the answer he received was along the lines of “Chelsea will decide who she wants to marry when the time comes.” I hope the answer for the request for Malia is the same.
We joke here about the offer of goats and cows but it really serves the same purpose that is the theory behind the engagement ring. The man is proving to a girl’s parents that he can afford to support her financially. Whether or not he actually does this after marriage is another story.
That’s something for me to think about. Thank you.
No, you’re right. I mean, this particular custom and value *is *inferior, but it’s not because it’s a different culture. And I say this as someone who lives in a country where brideprices are very much still a thing. Hell, there’s an app for that shit (which is humourous but telling).
Although I have to say, only 50 cows plus assorted other smaller kine is lowballing it. Malia should be worth more than a princess from fucking Swaziland…
One key difference is that brideprices are paid to the bride’s father, engagement rings are the property of the bride. Which one respects the woman’s agency, again?
no its becky2844
That’s why I brought up the common US custom
of “asking the father for her hand”.
I find it offensive, too, but presumably a man will do it when he knows his lady likes that sort of thing. Again, it’s about the agency of a woman, and I don’t really have a problem with it if the lady has a great relationship with her dad and prefers it this way.
I mean, any man who asked my dad for my permission is a no-go for me, but I expect my fiancé would know that.
But this is a straight up bride price, and I don’t care about the culture, it’s an inferior practice. It’s buying a bride and I can’t stomach it and it makes me sick.
That’s also offensive and just as dated as a cattle brideprice, IMO. At least, if any potential suitor of one of my daughters did that, I’d straight-up laugh at him.