In the context of this discussion, I’m not sure anybody cares. But I do enjoy the symmetry of Omg a Black Conservative that Republicans are the true party for Jews and you’re response that true Jews vote Republican.
I agree unless there Jewish or familiar with the current demographic trends in Judaism and the State by state politics they wouldn’t care but if you understand that the further left religiously you go the much farther under the replacement level you get and the more religious you get the much higher growth you get and that the area with the highest growth is the most likely to vote republican and the area with highest shrinking is most likely to vote democrat then I would think they care (and just for the record there is no way there wasn’t a big Orthodox under-count in the jewish polls do to Orthodox jews speaking to posters much less then the avg jew and in the communities that are the most likley to vote republican at rates higher then any other demographic group in the country they are the most unwilling to speak to pollsters). but the fact remains that Orthodox jews and Russian Jews put Turner in instead of Weprin precisely for the reasons that true Judaism is closer (not aligned which is why in a few elections the democrat will get the Orthodox non block vote more then secular jews) at this point in time to the Republicans then the Democrats.
and you can go policy by policy and look which party is closer to Jewish values and needs on all issues and you’ll see that in most cases republicans are better (same gender “marriages”, abortion, school vouchers, crime, Israel, Iran ext.).
but if you want to understand why jews currently vote democrat you have to look towards the historical understanding of what was going on the beginning of the 20th century and realize reform jews today are voting based on there only link to Judaism which was replaced by the democratic party.
you might appreciate this study
Your definition of Judaism seems approximately equivalent to that of Christians who attempt to define Catholics as “non-Christian”, and is pretty much equally useful (that is to say, totally wrong and not useful at all).
No, you are not, and no you do not. Freely claimed, freely refuted.
If you’re going to be dismissive and insulting, why should we collectively bother to engage with you?
Let me make my position clear: I think Orthodox chauvinism, as a movement, is destructive and pointless. Furthermore, it has no place in a discussion about “American Jewish voters”, because no matter how hard you try you cannot keep Reform, Reconstructionist, and Conservative jews from going to shul, giving to Israeli charity, and talking about their political views in the context of their religion, which remains Judaism no matter how much you try to define them out of existence.
You can certainly say “the more a Jew identifies with Orthodox Judaism, the more conservative they are”, but this no true scotsman stuff is irrelevant.
As a side note, a good portion of the Jews I know are Chasidim, very Orthodox, and all vote Democrat on the basis of social justice issues. The Chasidim rabbis that I know all have gone out on a limb to say that social justice issues are the ONLY issues that should concern an observant Jew, and we should leave the morality to the rabbis and the synagogue.
Well obviously he does indeed know a trillion times more about Judaism than you, or for that matter any other person in the entire history of the world.
After all, he has the word “JEW” in great big letters, spelled right out in his user name. What more proof could you need?
CASE CLOSED
The strongest anti-Obama groups within Jewish-Americans are Hassidic/Orthodox, who polled 69%-17%. Next came Conservative Jews (50%-38%), and then Jewish-Americans with family or friends living in Israel (50%-42%).
Reform Jews still support Obama by a slim margin of 52%-36%.
those chasidic rabbies are loosing there power by the day because they are corrupt (and social justice means more money for them) and most of them no one truly respects anyway.
Therefore those “Chasic rabbis have gone out on a limb to say that social justice issues are the ONLY issues that should concern an observant Jew” because there trying to keep there power structure which is rapidly declining.
http://www.matziv.com/pictures/flatbushpsakonweprin
assuming you know anything of Judaism you’ll know how respected some of these rabbis are.
most reform jews would either vote for Hitler or at least not vote for the republican opposition candidate if Hitler ran on a final solution platform (provided they were immune from it?) especially if he was in favor of abominations like gay “marriage” (I know he wouldn’t be)
That’s a pretty repulsive thing to say in any circumstance, but for a Jew to say it about other Jews based on differences in religious doctrine (ones most people don’t care about in the first place) is that much worse.
give me any measure of what it means to be jewish ranging from quistions like how important being jewish is to you to how much do you give to jewish charities and you’ll find that Orthodox Jews (who vote republican in recent elections at higher rates sometimes then any other demographic group in the country) do much better then Conservative jews (who vote Republican more then reform) who in turn do better then reform (who are the most loyal demorats).
I doubt that that is comparable to any other non religious group (or religous group for that matter)
lets be honest for a second if I would ask anyone here in what area of the country had the most McCain ED with more then 100 votes and what demographic it was would anyone here pick NJ and Jewish.
or how about if i asked someone to name the only contiguous area in the whole country to have 50,000 people to vote for McCain at a 90% rate (and also happens to be compact and non gerrymandered like) would any one honestly pick that it was in NYC and the voting demographic was jewish?
if you (this is addressing everyone not the person who I’m commenting on) knew that or at least would guess it then lecture me about me not knowing about jews politics ext.
repulsive but true look at the American reforms response (and actively hurting rescue efforts) during the Holocaust and realize that jews were a lot more concerned with world jewery at that time and tell me where I’m wrong
I don’t think it needs to be explained, and I have better ways to spend my time.
how do you explain the fact that many reform leaders sabotaged rescue efforts led by groups like Vaad Hatzlah, Peters Burgsons group (non Orthodox) ext.
the facts remain that most normal jews realize that Obama is the most anti semtic president since at least Carter and for some reason reform jews don’t see it or more likely couldn’t care less as long as it doesn’t effect them.
explain to me why most non Orthodox jews voted for Dinkins (not an antisemite but had zero courage to stand up to them) is it not for the fact that couldn’t care less about other Jews in danger if it (interferes with their liberal agenda) and the misreporting of the secular jewish media to turn a anti semtic pogrom in to a race riot at best also shows you where most of American Jewery stands.
Meh, the only important measure of “what it is to be Jewish” is whether or not you say “I am a Jew” when asked.
Same as any other religion. There’s no central authority, no Pope, no Inquisitors.
As for you, I think your views are frankly unique enough that I will certainly ask you if I want to know what insular Jews in a particular section of Brooklyn think, but I don’t think you have much to say about Judaism in general (especially as you’ve essentially called my wife and daughter “not Jewish”, which is by my way of thinking a pretty reprehensible thing to do to people who volunteer with the synagogue and attend every week.)
your wife and daughter are Jewish (assuming your wife’s mother is jewish) . don’t interpret into my words more then I said
And the fact is I still understand the non Orthodox jewish vote quite well to but the historical side is the true reason why your wife most likely votes democrat. and what I said was that the closer you are practicing Judaism the way your supposed to then the more likely you are to vote republician a the avg election.
and just for the record I never lived in what anyone would call a insular community.
and what I said was the after a certain point which includes things like intermarriage but not only it’s, someone who is unaffiliated intermarried has no more positive connection to (the land, people or country) Israel then Micronesia never gives money to jewish charities and is what I called “**barley know their jewish **” (you decide yourself weather your wife fits this category and weather and she follows what the demographic trends are) then they start voting trending the other direction towards the avg American. (the facts bare this out in all the polls that Orthodox are the most Republican followed by a big then Conservative then unaffiliated then reform) if you don’t like my interpretation give me yours but make sure it fits in with the facts like I did (as opposed to being PC)
That’s … like … just your opinion, man.
I can barley (sic) understand what he’s trying to say. Punctuation and capitalization would help.
wrong for example
no rational non ignorant person can possibly say that a jew who eats pork for example under non life threatening situations is following Judaism.
Funny. Usually when people take a really strict view of dietary laws, they also think the Sabbath should be kept holy and you shouldn’t spend it writing.