Will all who sincerely search for the Christian deity find Him?

Great Debates
21

If he loves me, then yes, he is sad for my pain and my error. If he’s disgusted by me, or if I think I know him but I’m wrong, and he doesn’t know me - then he’s not sad, I’d guess. Absolute justice, and all that.

I’m trying to find the times Jesus spoke about who doesn’t “get in”, and having no luck right now. For now the Revelation will have to suffice:

I’m fearful. At times I’m unbelieving. I’m abominable, certainly. I murder in my heart almost every day. I’m sure I’m an idolater, and a liar, though I try not to be. I don’t think I’m actually a whoremonger or a sorcerer, but still, it looks like I might be in a lot of trouble.

His4Ever, thanks for the link. I can’t argue with it scripturally; he certainly supports his statements in that regard. However, even after reading the tiny paragraph at the end about how God will spare those who trust in Him, I am not confident I’d make that cut. Do I trust him enough? Will he smite me? Do I only think I’m a Christian, but Jesus will know better?

gobear, that’s certainly the path I’d take if I believed Christianity was false. I believe it’s true - simply that Jesus lived and died for our sins and was raised from the dead. Ergo, I am a Christian. I must try to follow the path but I find it very difficult going and have no internal assurance that it’s the right path. Part of my search is figuring out what position to place the Bible in my faith. I can’t disregard it, but - how can I express this - it freaks me out at every turn. I know the God of Love and comfort is in there, but all the texts on love and comfort are permanently stained for me by all the texts on smiting and wrath and judgment (which, as the website points out, are very much more numerous).

22

The answer is Yes, but only in the sense that “sincerely” is a very hazy concept.

A Christian will tell you that if you looked and didn’t find Him then you haven’t looked “sincerely” enough. That is because the only way to be “sincere” is to accept the existence of a deity that the Christian already believes exists. The requirement makes the outcome axiomatic.

23

Just curious and not trying to argue. Have you made a personal decision in your heart to accept Christ, or is this just a mental belief ar assent that you’re talking about here?

24

His4Ever:

I have made that personal decision as well as I know how to do it. I’ve always felt like there’s a secret password that everyone else has, and I don’t. I said - and believed - the Sinner’s Prayer off the back of the first Chick Tract I ever read, and nothing special happened except disappointment that the angels couldn’t be heard singing, and I didn’t feel like the beaming kids in the tracts post-conversion. That abiding sense of joy and peace that you’re supposed to get when you become a Christian? I never got that. I just muddle along, doing the best I can.

I reject the overt emotionalism of the fundamentalist churches - how I FEEL about my soul, and its place in the universe, is irrelevant to God, in my opinion. I don’t pray for the appropriate religious feelings anymore, and never expect to receive them. This may make my Christianity seem more intellectual than spiritual to you or others.

Christ is the center of my life; I have given up much for him already and intend to follow him wherever he leads. I love him and I’m grateful for his gift to me. Does this qualify as “a personal decision in [my] heart to accept Christ”? I don’t know; I don’t even know what this means anymore.* Perhaps I have done what’s required, and I am as “right with God” as any sinner can be, and I just need to get over myself and stop being so neurotic. Again, I don’t know.

The point of my post to gobear was to assert that I’m a Christian because I believe Christianity is true; not because I think it will comfort me or be good for me or for any other reason. If Christianity - the actual events in the life of Christ that we all believe - were proved false, I’d immediately cease to be a Christian. I’m interested in Truth, and I see literal, factual Truth in Christianity; that’s why I follow it. What else could I do?

*I also don’t know where this very common phrase comes from. It’s not in the Bible, exactly, is it?

25

I just want to thank all of you for taking your time to post on this topic. Alot of these thoughts and feelings etc. are very familiar to me and it is reassuring to me to know that I am not alone in this all.

Yes it seems there is alot of scorn and pain that await those who choose to do evil in there lives, if you read The Bible. But I have learned that the less you worry about yourself, and your own destiny and try and find someone else to worry about and steer them in the right direction the more peace you will find in your own search for truth and peace in your hearts. I believe that we are all born with a simple conscience to guide us towards the light/love/peace in our lives. And this voice although sometimes simple to “hear” is not always so simple to obey, espeacially in a world where it seems obvious the exact opposite of what we know is “right” is like a rushing river trying to wash us all down with it.

Thanx again everyone for your time, I enjoyed them alot.

YiBaiYuan thank you for the warm welcome to “Highlander” and me. Sorry I am not much of a “lurker” but I’ll try to make any post I make something I wanted to say. HAHA ^^) cant say much more about my up coming posts because I am not too good with commitments at this time, but I do have hope.

If anyone here feels that God does speak to them I am curious as to what it is they think The creator is saying.

Also I must let you all know in advance I am a fool in many many ways so plz take anything i say in that light. thanx

Shalom to you !! (means peace to YOU with GOD, you know peace between you 2)

also Kol Tuv!! (a blessing of all “GOOD” things to you)
cya happy holidayz, jason

26

Hello masonite. There isn’t any secret password. God’s made the plan of salvation so clear!:slight_smile: If you’ve prayed the sinner’s prayer and meant it, then you belong to Him. When I accepted Him, I didn’t hear angels singing or have special feelings other than the fact that I knew there was a change. I knew He’d come in and I started wanting to go to church again after not going for years. I wanted to please Him, though I’ve managed to fail many times since then. I’ve asked His forgiveness and gone on.

I, too, sometimes struggle and doubt my salvation. Satan knows my weak points and will get me focused on my performance and get me to doubting. So you’re not alone in this, I hope that helps.
Don’t give up. I’ve talked to other Christians who sometimes tend to doubt their salvation also so it’s not an isolated thing.

Merry Christmas in the season of celebrating our Lord’s birth into this world!

27

Thank you for your kindness. :slight_smile:

I believe we’re all stumbling in the dark to a degree; the fullness of the Light has not yet been revealed to any of us. It’s easy to get confused in the meantime. That’s why we try to help each other. Merry Christmas to you too.

: doing a lousy job of “staying on the sidelines”, just reading :

28

masonite, you’ve stated this better than I ever could have. :slight_smile:

29

Let’s have a brief review of logic, shall we?

Inductive logic proceeds from examples in the world to underlying principles that describe those examples. Deductive logic proceeds from underlying principles to conclusions about what the world will do.

Some individuals claim that any sincere person will “find” God. However, they rarely provide empirical definitions of sincerity that would allow us to apply inductive logic. Instead, they use only deductive logic, which allows them to conclude that those people who don’t find God weren’t actually sincere. After all, if they were, they would have found Him, yes?

Since they’re not willing to question the veracity of their assumed claims, they apply logic to their principles, and find that the world never contradicts their conclusions. (Of course, that’s because they’re using a cramped and mutilated version of logic, but try telling them that…)

30

Lel,

Searching for the Lord is not necessary. He is with you now. He cannot be lost, nor can you. There is no place you can hide from Him, nor is there any barrier that can separate you from Him.

Over and over, in scripture, the Lord says that legalism, in its many forms is not truth. Love is truth. The case where He says He will say “I did not know you.” is not a description of those who sought Him. It is a warning to those who claim to have spoken in His name, and who proclaim their own righteousness, while doing nothing for the souls of ordinary people that they know. At the same time He said that those who say “But we did not know You!” will learn that they had found Him when they loved others, in the ordinary lives of men, on earth.

So, give your heart to those whom the Lord loves, and you will thereby give your heart to Him. The Lord loves us each, and all. No one is beyond His love. That is your path to find Him. It is a very hard path to keep, you know. Some of us, though we are His beloved children are real assholes, when you meet us. But, we need to love each other, anyway.

Look at those who have not the intelligence to even know what the word God means. Some who cannot accept the sacrifice of the savior, because they cannot even understand the concept of cause and effect. But they are souls, and beloved souls, and children of the Lord. He loves them, though they cannot choose between willful Idolotry, or true Christian Theology, whatever that might be. Could you love someone who would condemn and abandon a soul so benighted? No. No one could. But the message of Christ is that no one earns the love of God. It is given, freely. And all that must be done is to love in your turn.

Love each soul you meet, as if that was the soul of God Himself. One day, it will be. And if the atheists are right, and we are wrong, then we will have spent our lives on love, and there will be no reward for us but the love we have given and received. I am willing to take the chance. (Although I have no doubt that He is.)

Predestination? Condemnation? Well, God is in your heart. Look there. This is the image of God that you are building. It will be the face of God that you allow yourself to see. Now do you fear the sin of greed, or pride, or hate? When you see yourself to be the recipient of your own sins, you understand how sin is death. You are choosing your fate, every moment of your life. But God has one more miracle to offer. Forgiveness. That too, is love. Forgive, and be forgiven. Judge, and be judged. Rules are cold and law is only just. Who would choose justice, if mercy were offered? Not I.

So, you need faith. Go then, and be faithful to others. So, you need kindness and compassion. Go then, and be kind, and feel the sorrows of those with whom you share this world. So you need joy. Go then, and give joy to all you can reach. Leave heaven to the Lord, and make this part of the world as much like it as your heart can build.

Tris

“Being deeply loved by someone gives you strength; loving someone deeply gives you courage.” ~ Lao-Tzu ~