Those other folks who are “coming on to him” may think that “Partner” only means business partner, not life partner. I have had a few business partners, but only one life partner. Your partner might try saying “Life Partner” instead of just partner, it may help.
As to the OP, I do not know what this sales woman’s purpose was in talking about her BF & father. In the same situation, I would assume that she is talking about her experiences that relate to what I am asking about.
OTOH, I never even think that a lady is giving me a second thought as far as getting together is concerned. I do look in the mirror every morning. I am a big, ugly, biker-looking dude. Yet, my wife thinks I am good looking.
Here’s two larger social problems colliding: women in service jobs fending off unwanted attention, and guys who don’t want to foist any unwanted attention but just want to get through their day with a little dignity, just like she does. The MRA boys over at Reddit call this “creep-shaming,” and it happens. A reasonable woman calls a man who persists in making unwanted advances a creep. An entitled woman calls any unattractive man sharing her space a creep. Creepy guys boost their egos by treating women as their hit-on targets. Bitches boost their egos by making sure you know you have no chance of ever being found attractive, even if you entertained no such notions.
Women have to deal with creeps all the time. At least non-creepy but unattractive guys only have to deal with bitches at venues where women are hoping to meet men, and alcohol is flowing.
So if you’re really worried about getting your feelings hurt when you go to buy a shirt, before she drops the boyfriend bomb, tell her she reminds you of your daughter or sister.
No, the bitchy women you describe assume any guy who talks to them is trying to pick them up, and thus do it to everyone. The worst is when they are also in a position where they have to talk to guys, like in sales.
But the boyfriend thing–while it can be a lot of things–is not that. At worst it’s a lie specifically to avoid making the guy feel bad. Maybe if you say “I have a boyfriend” in a contemptuous tone it can be that, but not just slipping him into the conversation.
As for the OP, while I don’t agree with the contemptuous tone a (pleasantly) few posters have taken, I do agree that you’re overanalyzing things, including your own body language, which is probably not helping you socially. Individual body language signals are never reliable. Widening your eyes is not the be-all end-all way to show attraction, and is pretty much irrelevant.
Similarly, there are multiple reasons for the boyfriend thing, and they are all nice. Maybe she wanted to help you out. Maybe she felt the spark and did want to let you know that she was unavailable. Maybe she wanted to clear up any misunderstanding. And maybe she felt you were attracted to her and let you know in a polite manner.
This holds for any casual use of “boyfriend” in conversation. There’s no one answer.
Sometimes, it’s a case of the woman feeling attraction that makes her uncomfortable. Sometimes it’s a case of tipping you off that she’s not on the market.
It’s truly awesome how some Dopers rush in to assure you that absolutely none of these women are attracted to you, at all. Because they can sense these things.
How is telling you they have a boyfriend ever bitchy though? And how does knowing a woman met somebody before they met you mean that they could never find you attractive? Even if she is only saying it to keep you from hitting on her, it’s just about the kindest most innocent way possible.
I mean, unless she’s saying something like, “oh my boyfriend loves those yoga pants… but they actually look good on him, because he doesn’t have a fat ass like you do, disgusting freak. Get those pants off and get out of my store.” But I think everyone would agree that’s quite bitchy and poor saleswomanship to boot.
Ummm… after those 3-4 overly aggressive responses to JSgoddess, the OP is wondering why the salesgirls, who are forced to stay at their stations, keep reminding him that they have boyfriends or husbands?
Huh.
Wait… wait… I’m sensing something here… its coming in hazy… could the OP be … a sheep? No, that’s not it… A Veep? No… Asleep! That must be it. The Op must be asleep!
I have read this thread in amazement. Sometimes people do things that you misinterpret or misunderstand and that’s understandable. But what reading this thread has really taught me is that Lululemon sells men’s clothes.
It’s not that it’s impossible that they are attracted to him. It’s just not the most likely explanation. The number of times a salesperson is so overwhelmingly attracted to a random dude that they fall into massive guilt is much, much smaller than the number of times a salesperson feels uncomfortable due to unwanted attention.
That fact, combined with the hostility the OP seems to express toward women, starts to paint a picture.
Anyway, the idea that a woman is going to feel guilty over just seeing a guy she finds attractive is not credible. You might feel guilty over a workplace crush, or some other longer flirtation that starts to cross the line. But thinking “he’s hot” about a rando you are never going to see again? This isn’t something anyone is going to be having complex emotional reactions to.
I haven’t read the whole thread yet but just want to add my two cents. When chatting with some guy at the dog park or whatever I always reference my husband but in my mind it’s more to put the guy at ease. As in, don’t worry, I’m only here for the pleasant conversation and nothing more. Then they usually mention their girlfriend or whatever and the conversation carries on pleasantly.
Back in my “retail days” there were a few times when guys mistook my have-to-be-friendly customer service as personal interest in them. I totally understand why some women who work in customer service would automatically reference a boyfriend or husband just to shut down any perceived awkwardness.
Those aren’t even the only two possibilities. Sometimes people just mention their significant others or parents for reasons having absolutely nothing to do with the dude they’re selling yoga pants to. I know I couldn’t have a long conversation with a woman about yoga pants without mentioning my wife in some way. I’m sure if I were an actual yoga pants salesman I would get all kinds of advanced training but as of today all I have to say is they’re often very flattering on women and my wife loves fleece lined yoga pants in the winter.
It’s extra useful as a man to mention your wife early, because women are often extra in need of easing when talking to strange men. It’s nice to get it out of the way and has nothing to do with reassuring ourselves.
Women in general are hit on often, but women in retail especially. I obviously didn’t see the interaction the OP had with the saleswoman, but I’m sure that the same woman has had a customer who there was much less chemistry between them, who then got upset when he hit on her and she wasn’t receptive.
From what you posted in the OP, you don’t seem like a creep. And you know that you are not a creep, and your friends and loved ones know that you are not a creep. I don’t think you need to change your creepy ways, but I think you could maybe understand a bit more what women go through in terms of unwanted attention. For the saleswoman, every customer is Schrödinger’s Creepster. There might be no romantic hints the whole time, and he behaves normally. He might ask her out but accept the rejection gracefully. Or he might take the rejection less well, and call her a stupid bitch, or keep coming back to the store to try to change her mind, or try to wait for her in the parking lot, or any number of other things. She can’t read minds, she doesn’t who’s going to read her friendly behavior as a come-on, and she know if who’s going to start behaving crazily until that person starts doing something crazy. So, it makes sense for her to be a bit on guard at all times for all customers, since she doesn’t know who’s going to be a creep.
I’m paraphrasing the somewhat famous blog post Schrödinger’s Rapist. It’s an guide for men about how to approach women without being maced, and though you weren’t trying to ask out the saleswoman, the blog post may help explain women’s mindset of being on guard even when it doesn’t make sense to you to be on guard.
Simply stating that her dad and boyfriend like the item doesn’t seem gratuitous to me, but the same statement could be made to sound that way with different tone or inflection. If that was the case it should have been reported in the OP and this thread might have gone differently. Barring that, it sounds to me like the lady was just trying to convince you to buy whatever you were trying on.
So, a salesperson who mentions a boyfriend in a situationally appropriate context (such as when selling men’s clothing) actually is masking her unspoken and guilty desire to get into your pants? And you know this because of the unspoken signals you’re really good at picking up?
This is a very self-centered, self-aggrandizing perspective on the events that happened to you, and it would behoove you to try an interpretation that doesn’t make your attractiveness the key motivator of the saleswoman’s actions. Because it wasn’t.
Given that a guy on the prowl for a new girlfriend (if I’m reading it right) talks to a very friendly sales “gal” (is that still commonly used?), and feels “a spark of attraction” between them, if asked which is the more likely scenario between the saleswoman really feeling this spark and thus feeling it necessary to verbalize her commitment as some sort of public display of guilt versus her sensing that the guy thinks there is a spark and wants to head it off, my money would be on the latter any day.
As everyone is saying, women get hit on all the time. Women in service industries get hit on more and very friendly women in retail are under a deluge of attention.
This really conveys the assumption that I object to. It seems to be offering the dichotomy that either the guy was attracted when the woman wasn’t, which makes him a creep and a loser, or the girl was attracted, which makes her feel guilt and shame.
A woman can define herself as “not looking to date an individual” without automatically labeling that individual as “not someone worthy of dating”.
I didn’t read Slithy Tove’s post that way. I thought he or she was saying the same thing you are, that a woman can be giving this information without any judgment being made about the man.
