The main pinch I can see is that even with just the first-stage achievement, you can’t advance without running 5-man content because one step in the Order Hall campaign needs that. (As far as I can tell, it doesn’t even require heroic. All of this is for Hunter, the only campaign I’m familiar with, but Blizz tends to structure stuff like this consistently, so I will assume it’s true of other class order campaigns.)
Still, the point that this xpac is bad for altoholics is well taken. My poor alts are all hovering at level 101-102 with a couple at 105 or higher. Just playing your main is too time consuming. (Of course, there are a lot of players who want to just play their main and would run out of useful things to do on that one toon in WoD. No danger of that any more, I think.)
Warlords of Drainer was also bad for altaholics, so Legion is just continuing that trend. I used to have all 10 of my toons at level cap and raid geared before the first year of an xpac was over, now I have a bunch that are still 90 and only a handful that made it to 100. Only got 1 besides my Mage that’s over 101, in fact.
If it was up to me, I’d be on a private server. I don’t like interacting with other players, I hate being in one of those assembly-line situations where a dozen other people are on the same quest-line and you go from quest to quest competing with them for kills, etc.
Up until now, that annoyance hasn’t been enough to make me stop playing. But I’m getting to the end of the quests I can do for either of the two characters I’ve gotten to 110 and if I can’t complete the questlines, why bother playing?
For those who enjoy those 5-man content situations? Be my guest. Play. But once both alts are stuck at dead-ends and I can’t complete any of the basic quests (like the Class Order campaign), I think I’m done.
Wait until you get to the quest to find Illidan. The first step is to get 80 soul essences. Soul essences only drop off of dungeon bosses, and the drop rate is horrible. Someone on one of my WoW podcasts calculated that you have to do at least 150 dungeons with the drop rate as it stands. You can get a better drop rate in Mythics…which does (socially anxious) me about as much good as a three-inch tail.
Plus parts of the Suramar questline require you to enter the Arcway and Court of Stars, and the Pathfinder I achievement (which is the first part of unlocking flying) requires the Suramar story to be completed.
I have social anxiety. I’ve had times when I’ve sat there for an hour with my cursor on the Dungeon Finder button while my heartrate and breathing skyrocketed just from the prospect of having to work with four other people and worry about disappointing them with my suck and getting abuse for it. I’m with you on the “if only we could play this game solo except for the cities”, with scaled instances that detect how many are entering and adjusting the difficulty toward that number.
Well, I won’t dispute what you say, but Blizz hotfixed this so that a soul fragment is guaranteed to drop from the end boss of a heroic 5-man. Of course, if you won’t LFD, that doesn’t help you, but to me that’s a good concession. Everyone has their limits. Trying to pull together a Mythic group is beyond mine, but running a 5-man is only painful while waiting on queue.
Actually, the mythic dungeon quests are optional. You score the “First portion of Suramar campaign” without them.
Fenris and jayjay, I’m sorry that you’re both finding out that the questlines include some objectives that will require you to be grouped with others; perhaps a Massively Multiplayer game is not the best fit for you. [/shrug]
Up 'till now, it has been. I’ve had a vast world to explore, I could usually pretend I was alone* and while there was content I couldn’t access, none if it was mandatory for the primary questline.
It does look as though they’re trying to force player interaction and you’re right that this isn’t what I’m looking for (I’d rather run a game of AD&D or something with IRL friends). I’m just hoping this expansion is an abberation and they’ll go back to making the main storyline** accessible to solo players.
*It’s a sort-of role-playing thing for me. Seeing 50 other people on the same questline, doing the same quests spoils what little illusion I have/had.
**And flight. Goddamn…I do not understand the anti-flight people’s problem. Allow flight for everyone after some levelling and if the anti-flight folks don’t want to fly…then don’t.
You’re forgetting. This is the “Back to Vanilla” XPAC, and soloers were massively handicapped in seeing content in WoW 1.x. Everything of value was a massive progression grind through instances that make modern Mythic raids look like cakewalks.
Much truth is this, but Blizz is schizoid about it. “Hail, (Huntmaster|Deathlord|Highlord|Champion|whatever), leader of our illustrious Hall, and the only person in Azeroth who can save the world. Just like every other player in the hall, who is also the sole and only (Huntmaster|Deathlord|Highlord|Champion|whatever)!”
In other words: ultimately, Blizzard doesn’t really care enough to be internally consistent.
Again some HC eliteism. For some folks, it’s not enough that they win, but that everyone else loses. Because if everyone else has something, it’s of no value to them. Hence, flying restricted to those who “deserve it”. This was a very Vanilla mindset, so Blizz is carefully catering to the nostalgists among their clientele, because they were the ones complaining loudest after MoP.
I think gnoitall offered some relevant interpretations of where Blizzard is regarding solo and grouped content with this xpac. I think it’s also just an inherent part of the game. If you don’t raid, you never killed the Lich King, for example, so you’ve already missed out on quite a bit of story arc and development.
Although I prefer PvP to solo play, I prefer solo play to grouped PvE. But I find that since the implementation of LFG and LFR, people are much more workmanlike regarding instances and raids. There is little talking except to communicate regarding the imminent encounter. In groups there is little if any chat at all; I know I’ve done whole Heroics and Mythics with nothing said until the end (“gga”, “ty”, etc.). It makes it easier to do the group things now that I don’t have to be in a raiding guild to get things done.
And since now you can look for Mythic or Raid groups with pretty much the same tool, I’ve found it fairly easy to get even the Normal Raid quests done. When I get down on it, I just remember that it’s an epic quest, and they don’t call them “epic” because they were quick and without hardship.
Now, regarding flight: I think the game is better without flight. Getting somewhere takes planning and forethought when you have to use the terrain; it’s simply Death From Above when you can fly. That’s boring, IMO, and way too easy; the game should be both fun AND challenging.
As stated earlier, the mythic dungeons are optional. There is one step of the chain, however, that requires you to kill Xavius in at least LFR (it’s very easy, and is the only boss in that LFR wing of the Emerald Nightmare raid).
It only needs 8. A keystone dungeon chest contains 10, which is the maximum you can get in one week. Thus, one dungeon a week for eight weeks. Lower difficulty content reduces the quantity. The reward is a belt or boots equivalent to Trial of Valor grade raid gear, so that they allow it to be done through normal dungeons (however slowly) is unusual.
Speaking of, the followup quest sends you into that Trial of Valor raid.
You may be right; I vaguely remember that, but I can’t seem to find it in the standard write-ups and guides to the Suramar campaing. /shrug
Well, since the entire Illidan/Light’s Heart quest chain requires at least Heroic 5 runs to continue, that’s already a show-stopper to a dedicated soloer. The raid requirements have all been LFR-compatible, but LFR is no better than a 5-man from that perspective.
So consider that entire campaign dead-ended for anyone who doesn’t want to group up.
Too late to ETA my previous, but you are absolutely right. The final step of the Good Suramaritan – A Growing Crisis campaign segment requires looting something after killing Xavius in the Emerald Nightmare raid (any difficulty). So, one mandatory LFR-compatible raid requirement in the middle of the Suramar campaign.
Looks like there’s a lot of content gated behind a minimum non-zero amount of group play.
Agree with pretty much everything here (except preferences ) If you do not raid, there will always be some degree of lore unavailable to you. WoW is like one of handful of MMORPGs that has had real staying power over the long haul, while there are dozens (or probably hundreds) of single player RPG’s that cater to the solo player. I play WoW because I love the group content, but I’m not going to go into the Witcher 3 thread and complain about the lack of group content.
Anyway, after mostly taking a break from the game during WoD, I can say I’ve loved pretty much everything about Legion. Artifact weapons, world quests, The mythic+ system, the slightly revamped profession systems, long quest chains sending you to multiple dungeons… etc.
Anyone else having fun in Nighthold? My guild is on our second week of having a heck of a time with Spellblade Aluriel, but I’m sure we’ll get her eventually!
I only LFR, so last night would have been my first opportunity, since first wing (Skorpyron/Chronomatic Anomaly/Trilliax) just opened LFR.
In fact, I was queued for it, until I checked my class hall missions board and found a mission that would give me moar l00t for killing Trilliax. So I dequeued and started that mission, which should complete some time tonight. Can’t play tonight much (real life things), but I’ll have that quest in my books before I down Trilliax. Because loot.
I got Kil’jaeden’s Burning Wish (ilvl 910 legendary trinket) from a world quest cache earlier this week. It’s pretty nifty. Works sort of like arcane bomb, in that when I use it, a ball of fire travels to my target and explodes for over 800K damage. Cool down is only 1:15. PVE only, but still lots of fun.
I’m happy to see others who prefer solo play. I’m running into the same wall for my class campaign, and profession quests that require dungeon runs, but I’m fine with waiting until the next expansion to complete these things solo. I have done current 5-man content with a guild before, and soloing is much, much more enjoyable for me.
) If you do not raid, there will always be some degree of lore unavailable to you. WoW is like one of handful of MMORPGs that has had real staying power over the long haul, while there are dozens (or probably hundreds) of single player RPG’s that cater to the solo player. I play WoW because I love the group content, but I’m not going to go into the Witcher 3 thread and complain about the lack of group content.