Rick is a controlling asshole who has found a religious backing that supports and encourages his controlling tendencies, and apparently a larger family that mainly feels the same way.
I feel for Lori, but as his co-worker and friend presumably before she married him, it’s on her to decide what she’s willing to put up with.
I had one boyfriend who told me what I was or was not allowed to do. I remained willing to date him, but decided then and there that he wasn’t marriage material.
If Lori wants to be with Rick for whatever reasons, then that’s her unfortunate life. In a perfect world, sure, Scald’s happily liberated atheist wife would pull Lori aside for some encouragement to keep her pants and finish her goddamned degree and for fucks sake get a secret account in her name that Rick doesn’t know about, but this isn’t a perfect world, and a 50 year old woman is demonstrably a grownup.
On the other hand, as she is older, perhaps she is from a more traditional natal family, and she feels comfortable settling into the motherly housewife role. Who knows? It seems to make Mother Duggar happy.
I think this is the best advice. Stepping in directly isn’t going to do much – Rick is just going to get pissed off, and I doubt Lori will listen to any warnings at this time. Even if it’s just a “Hey, if you ever need to get in touch with us for any reason, blah blah blah”, that’s probably the best.
It is definitely controlling and demeaning behavior on Rick’s part, but some women are ok with that. She may be have grown up in an environment that has her thinking the way he’s treating her is normal and perfectly alright. Does she know he wants her to quit school? Could you talk to your sister, or someone in the family who may have more of a rapport with Lori and see if that person might be willing to call Lori up from time to time and let her know she’s got some support if she ever feels she needs it?
I know a lot of “Ricks” one of them is actually named Rick. Jerks the lot of them. But Lori may not want to go past 50 alone. Could be Rick is “Her” jerk for ever after.
That’s probably why he feels comfortable controlling her and why she lets him. A lot of guys (though we could probably reverse genders) would rather go for someone they see “beneath” them, as they are seen as easier to control and having less options to do better. And many unattractive people will accept dating “beneath” them personality-wise, rather than extend their decades of going dateless.
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3) It’s true that marriage has shifted, in the minds of many, from having a distinct leader and a follower, a superior and a subordinate, to being a supposed ‘partnership of equals’. You’ll of course pardon me if I don’t view that as a good thing, and view it as part of the breakdown of authority in the liberal west.
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I dunno. When I worked in supported living for disabled people, one thing we did was provide respite care to people who had a disabled family member, foster child, or were householders (they received a stipend to have a disabled person living with them, and facilitated that person being involved in the community). I had three families on my caseload who were Pentecostal, and while they all did adhere to gender roles, and the women didn’t wear pants, except for culottes, or very occasionally sweats that were pink under skirt for some very specific activity (the rule was that women couldn’t wear men’s clothes, not that women had to wear skirts). Anyway, the women often worked outside the home if they did not have small children, albeit, they were in “pink collar” professions, like nursing, but they also often ran the household, including controlling thew household budget, and being the one to pay the “domestic” bills, like utilities, and having a debit card to pay for groceries when they went shopping. The women would probably tell you they obeyed their husbands, but they probably also had the power and autonomy to leave if he hurt them or their children.
I feel weird being in the position of defending fundamentalist Christians, but I’m just saying that it’s giving Rick too much credit to chalk his behavior up to his religion.
Yes, huge red flags. In the end it is up to her to decide if she wants to live her life with a controlling partner. What can you do about the situation? Probably nothing. I’d be curious to see how long they last. Hopefully not long enough for “Lori” to become even more of a doormat.
I read the OP and then didn’t (yet) read the thread. Skald, I think you’re over-reacting. While this behavior seems a little odd I don’t see it as too extreme, and if it works for Rick and Lori, then as they say, whatever floats your boat.
Now I’ll read the thread and see how my response fits with the others’.
I’m not sure it’s a red flag as such, but my immediate thought was the 1950’s called and they want their misogynist back.
I’d not go as far as phouka to suggest its grooming for abuse, but there is obviously some gender stereotypes in Rick’s head that are very outdated for contemporary western society. But for all we/you know maybe Lori is happy for it be that way. Maybe she likes being a kept woman.
Rick sounds like a controller. It sounds like you let him know in no uncertain terms what you thought of his controlling behaviour, so good for you.
I have to say though, you sound a bit sexist, with giving a physical description of Lori, but not of Rick. I know that’s not the question you were asking, but maybe you should ask yourself why you did that.
If you want to Pit someone over their view or posts, feel free, but let’s try to avoid bringing in other poster’s posts (from other topics) into one where they haven’t even posted.
Not to answer on behalf of Skald, but if I had been the one doing it, it might be related to the person who is giving up her own power, and a factor that might plausibly explain why she had a motivation to do so. No such consideration would appear to apply to the person who is doing the power grab
Lori is legion even in the liberal Pacific Northwest. I see a Lori about once a week- and that’s in the 24 hours in clinic. Of course there are red flags. However, this Lori as you have posted her made this choice, and other poster’s advice to let her know you (or a more kind member of your family) will listen if needed is spot on, as well as other’s advice to get a bank account again. The advantage here is that she presumably had previously established credit.
It can take me about 4-5 years to get a woman through this process. That isn’t what they see me for but it’s part of the health review- so the Lori has to bring it up. Until she feels it’s a problem it won’t get addressed.
Trust me - I have put up with a lot I didn’t deserve in relationships and made lots of compromises where I felt I was giving in 90% of the time - you are not letting your dislike of Rick cloud your judgement.
But the key thing you left out was her reaction. I’ve dated women who liked to be “controlled” - well control isn’t the right word, but more - want me to make the decisions. It was very awkward at first, but it was clearly what she wanted. She sometimes even wanted me to order for her (this was part due to her shyness - I wouldn’t literally pick the food). She said she was tired of being the “man” in her relationships. But it was nowhere near the type of behavior you are talking about.
So to me the big thing you left out was her reaction/facial expression. If she doesn’t seemed phased by it, likes, or is amused by it - it is possible that this is what attracted her to Rick.
But I’m going to go with the other people. Loneliness is an awful thing and it is an unfortunate fact that unattractive, overweight, older woman have a very hard time (overall) finding someone. She might be willing to give that all up after all these years. And I think if people were honest with themselves - so would many of them.
Some people are ok being alone, but many just feel an empty hole and it isn’t really that she has low self esteem - which I am sure she does - in her mind - and in reality - she probably doesn’t have much of a choice. If she gives this up she risks being alone forever - some people would prefer that - some would not.
Nope, it means we constantly had a shitload of arguments and screaming fights over his controlling and guilt-tripping. Eventually I wised up and realized that just like I wasn’t going to change, neither would he. We’re much better off as casual friends now.
It’s #2 that really set me off. If Lori wants to finish her MBA, who is Rick to say no? That amount of controlling is ridiculous. Grown up people do not need anyone’s permission to anything reasonable. Yes, Rick can put his imput into her decision, but it is her decision.
And I absolutely hate the way some religions believe in subgregating women.
Also, a friend of mine agreed to marry a guy after he got her pregnant. He then told her she couldn’t work anymore in real estate because she’d have to have male customers. She broke it off with him, and tried to keep her son away from him after he displayed more and more outrageous behaviors. In the end, he killed the son and himself.