It’s certainly bittersweet to hear America disavow bigotry of one kind — electing a (half) African-American President — while affirming bigotry of another — the 4 for 4 voting against homosexuals as equal citizens of the nation.
Arizona: Ban on Gay Marriage
56% – 44% pass
California: Ban on Gay Marriage
52% – 48% pass
Florida: Ban on Gay Marriage
62% – 38% pass
Arkansas: Ban on Gay Couples Adopting Children
57% – 43% pass
America, my frenemy.
Ok, but I was happy to hear Obama include homosexuals in last night’s speech. It’s clear that there is still a lot of intolerance in the USA, but when you elect people like Obama, you are setting the tone for a change. If the message of tolerance is held on to for long enough, even these people will have to change their minds. And if not, at least their children will.
Small steps.
I’m sorry. My BIL recently married in California and is a resident. This directly affects him. All I can say is be patient. As the older generations move on, this will change. 40 years ago Wallace won 5 states as a segregationist. So in only 40 years America has come very far indeed. You will in all probability need to wait another 20 years or move to the North East where I think things are changing quicker.
It is not just gays either. It is very tough to be a Muslim in the US currently. They are not restricted from marriage but the US still has a long way to go in being tolerant. Yesterday was a great day in affirming that the US is changing. However change is measured in generations and does not come all at once.
Jim
The impact on existing marriages is unclear, but some analysts are saying that the amendment is not retroactive. An older girl living across the street from us when I was growing up, along with her partner, turned out to be the first couple married in the Los Angeles area when the California Supreme Court lifted the ban, so I am concerned for them. I imagine questions will arise on a situation by situation basis, as institutions such as schools, hospitals, and adoption agencies now become uncertain as to whether they have to honor the same-sex marriages that were executed while it was legal to do so. So even if their marriage isn’t invalidated by governmental edict, I can certainly understand what they mean when they say “a state of limbo”.
I’m angry for them. I’m angry that only a 50.01% majority is needed to change a state constitution to take away a right from anyone. I’m angry that the success of the ban was achieved largely, IMO, by asserting that the right of the majority to be intolerant is more important than the right of a peaceful dissenting minority to go about its business. And the ads were misleading and vicious, not least the one featuring Gavin Newsom saying “whether you like it or not!” and waving both hands limp-wristedly (naturally!).
I do not see how the impact on marriages can be unclear. What was done under the law is lawful.
I’m sorry, I don’t think I understand what you are saying. Could you please expand upon this?
**Spectre of Pithecanthropus ** I won’t pretend to know much about the issue. California is a long way from New Jersey and I was not following it. I will say that I was very surprised California passed their initiative.
It’s really sad. My fellow Americans aren’t just apathetic towards my human rights. I could understand Americans being lazy. But a majority of my fellow Americans are motived to get off their fat asses and actively vote against, and/or take away my rights. Fucking sad.
I don’t want to hear “wait 20-40 years. Be patient.” I think we should get militant. No more home decorating shows for you, you fucking bastards!
As proud as I am of my country today, I’m equally ashamed that 102 went through. My only solace is that the anti-gay crowd spent A LOT of money in this state purchasing signs for every street corner, banners on every church, as well as television and radio ads.
Opponents of 102 were not able to raise the kind of money needed to meet that level of exposure, not by a country mile.
That said, the largest form of advertising against Prop 102 came from citizens so fed up with being marginalized (or watching others be marginalized) that they painted over the Yes on 102 for Marriage with “No on 102 for Equality”.
I know some of you may respond with sneers of how vandalism never solves anything, but members of my community stood up in the face of well-funded hate, and spoke truth to power at the risk of arrest.
I am proud that, in light of the dollars spent and the saturation of advertising, that many rallied to do what they could with what they had available.
It took me 35+ years to realize I was being stupid and bigoted and irrational about gay marriage. I was on the other side of this issue just 10 years ago and I am not even religious. I probably qualified as homophobic 20 years ago but not as bad as most of my friends. It takes time and educations and young people being more active in voting and older frighten folk that don’t know better not voting anymore. There is no way around it.
This is sad. I really don’t understand. I just don’t understand.
What’s not to understand? There is a small percentage of people that are gay and a large percentage of people that are straight.
There is also a small percentage of people that are anti-gay and like to write legislation.
I think that many of the people who voted against gay marriage aren’t necessarily anti-gay. They just don’t have any investment in gay issues.
They are straight people who voted with their “persuasion” and didn’t really think about the consequences.
Too many people think that voting is an “opinion poll”. It’s not. They don’t stop to think that they are repressing somebody else. They just know that they wouldn’t marry somebody of their own sex so therefore they vote their opinion.
I honestly think that you could outlaw the cultivation of broccoli if you put it on a ballot because people who didn’t have a taste for broccoli would treat the proposal as if it were an opinion poll.
Bubba Dog, it’s a very sad thing, but I think you’re 100% right.
Well, a large percentage of straight people voted to continue to allow California gay people to marry. Sadly, very sadly, not enough of us. I don’t think we can excuse those who want to ban gay marriage as simply people who are not “invested” in the issue. As pointed out, they were invested enough to take this right away from their fellow citizens. For this they should be condemned. I might not like broccoli, but I would never vote to take the right to eat broccoli away from someone else.
It makes me very sad that all of those measures passed. I can only hope that we will see those percentages dwindle as time passes and our society matures. In the meantime I can contribute my money and my efforts to fight those who would hurt their fellow Americans under a mistaken impression that their right to be a busybody supercedes the happiness of others.
I think Obama could have done more, especially in the last week or so, when it was apparent that he would win. But I can understand the calculation that led him to demurr, and the calculation that leads to his official anti “gay marriage” policy.
I’m a straight, OK? But I don’t give a crap what you do in your bedroom. Apathy has always been my default position on gay marriage. But watching this debate unfold has turned me into a passionate supporter of equal marriage rights. I intend to continue to work and donate to the cause. So there are little victories like me, as well.
I am happy, I am sad.
What kills me is this is the United Fucking Goddamned States of America. I don’t have to wait a fucking 30 goddamned minutes for a pizza, but I’m supposed to wait fucking goddamned 20-40 years for equal rights? South Africa has fucking goddamned gay marriage.
Hey hopefully I’m wrong, but I doubt it. This country is still to puritanical to give way on this issue easily.
I’m so sorry about this. I can only hope that the aftermath gets some people thinking so that the next time these propositions are on the ballot, the end is different.
I’ve got nothing against broccoli. I just think it should be used vaginally, as God intended.
Let the niggers celebrate, they earned it last night. Yes, I chose my words carefully. That’s how pissed off I am today. :mad:
Guess I’d better explain…even though I’m Not Exactly Gay (Kinsey 1.5) there is someone I know, a friend of the family who likes me, and I might actually have a successful relationship with him. The only problem is, I’ve had extremely poor luck with relationships in the past, regardless of gender (and with women, it’s actually worse than men) – it’s a Major Issue, and I’m still not 100% if I’m ready, including the fact that I’d be “Declaring a Party,” so to speak.
Last night’s passage of Prop 8 really took the wind out of my sails.
This mirrors the feeling in our household last night and today, as well.
My roommate/best friend of 14 years is gay and she doesn’t deserve to feel hated, judged, marginalized and disdained for her orientation. It’s ridiculous. This shit wouldn’t fly for interracial marriage and it shouldn’t fly for gay marriage either.
All I could do was remind her that we’re making progress, an inch at a time.
“An inch. It is small and it is fragile and it is the only thing in the world worth having. We must never lose it or give it away. We must NEVER let them take it from us.”
SCOTUS has a responsibility to this nation to declare that civil rights supercede all of the hate-filled bullshit and if you don’t like it, DONT GET MARRIED TO SOMEONE OF YOUR GENDER! Simple as that. It shouldn’t even be on a state ballot. Fucking ridiculous.
FUCKING. RIDICULOUS.
I seethe with anger, obviously.