You're on the Jedi Council. Make 'em less stupid.

The link worked for me in Opera. I suspect your Firefox is as broken as the Jedi Council.

Meanwhile, in on topic land, it was my understanding that Anakin was specially created by the Force, for the purpose of “restoring balance.” And the Council knew it. When the mystical power you worship is trying to destroy you, that’s a pretty good sign you’re doing it wrong. So my response to the OP would be to try to make the Jedi a little more like the Sith and stop trying to deny all of their emotions. I would also constantly remind them that the important distinction is that you can’t let your emotions make all of your judgements for you.

But convince me why this is a good thing.

The Sith/Dark Side position is obviously a rebellion against this rather preposterous requirement. Asking emotional beings to suppress specific emotions is absurd. It doesn’t work for humans, and one must presume wouldn’t for many other intelligent races.

Guess you’re not in the know about Luke going to the Dark Side. The point was, once you let it into your heart it’s always going to be there, whispering at you, tempting you.

I don’t have to convince you of anything. That’s how the Force works in Star Wars. Someone who is emotional is going to be tempted to use their emotions to fuel their powers in times of distress. That leads to the Dark Side.

That’s how the Jedi – or at least Yoda & Obi-Wan – say the Force works. There’s plenty of textual evidence that they’re full of crap.

Yes, that’s how the Jedi say the Force works and that’s how it works. The Jedi have it right. It’s even stated as fact by third-party sources such as the Power of the Jedi sourcebooks, which are as canonical as Expanded Universe materials, which, incidentally, also support this view. You can blame Lucas for having created such a dumb system. That’s why I asked you back on the first page:

Your psychological assumptions here lack plausible causal lines. Those trained as Jedi from near-infancy would only know the Jedi life. No reason not to think that some of them would change allegiances just looking for something new. Whereas those who started later might feel they “chose” the Jedi.

Your lack of skepticism is … disturbing.

:cool:

Well, since I’m on the Jedi Council, and there seems to be such a die-hard undercurrent of Orthodox Jediism floating around, I’ll do better than just go with it…I’ll improve on it. Since feelings and emotional attachments are detrimental to Good Jedi, but suppressing them is unnatural and detrimental to most sapient life, the answer is simply to recruit Jedi from disciplined, unemotional forms of life.

And if I cannot find them, they must be created.

Cyberneticizing existing force-sensitives may be an option, but for the proper numbers and reliability, I’d prefer to go with a non-organic approach. Silicon based Jedi with droid bodies are not unknown, but I would attempt to create wholly AI controlled Jedi droids—perhaps using cell cultures or harvested biological material from force-sensitives, housed within a droid body.

“There is no emotion, there is peace.
There is no passion, there is serenity.
There is no ignorance, there is knowledge.
There is no flesh, there is a mere vessel.
Hand over your flesh, The Force demands it.”

Fool of a Took!

You mean you find my lack of skepticism disturbing?

So why do they so often get it wrong?

We’re being asked to interfere in the SW universe here, and the way I’d interfere in it is to do away with the rules* that to all appearances had serious unintended consequences.*

Like when?

Keep in mind that when I say “the Jedi have it right” I’m referring to their stated beliefs regarding how the Force functions. Individual Jedi are of course capable of being wrong, often disastrously so. Example: Allowing Anakin to begin training despite being too old. They were really wrong there.

Come up with your own insipid, repetitive, boring catchphrase to overuse until have the board wants you dead, please. That one’s mine.

I have no interest in making it my catchphrase. I only use it when I’m talking to you!

Disagree. Those exposed to Jedi during their formative years are likely to be a lot more trustworthy with power than those not. You can never get the kind of “buy-in” from someone who’s not used ot it no matter how much they might seem to like it. Once your personality is formed, you’ll never totally belong to anything else.

I disagree. There are always those who will be tempted by whatever pleasures lie outside their experience. The Grass Is Always Greener is a powerful driving force.

Serious or not, are you?

:confused:

That… is why you fail.

We might be approaching this problem from the wrong angle. We have, at length described the problems of Jedi but were talking about a group with thousands of years of institutional inertia. I don’t think one person can productively alter that trajectory in a small time frame, from the inside.

We’ve all seen the movies, we know what the schemes are and where the betrayals happen. I submit that it’s the Sith who are better positioned to be the change agents. Off Palpatine, it can’t be impossible and assume his position. Who says there has to be an empire? Or if there is one, why not one that’s sorta laid back and life affirming?

The clone army stays, as a balance against the Jedi but we totally re-work general order 66. Instead of a hidden “trap door” addenda, it’s completely open and in fact part of the clone armies stated mission. And it’s no longer to kill the Jedi, it’s to dope slap them and tell them to stop being stupid any time they display over ridged adherence to some of the more ridiculous things Lucas wrote into them.

So you want to turn the Clone Troopers into the Templars from Dragon Age: Origins?

Let’s see:
Not everyone in the overall organization needs to be a warrior. Some of us will be negotiators, librarians, healers, councillors. Others will be Knights:
A more lenient attitude to mixing Dark and Light powers. A Gray stance, if you will
Armour - something in red, maybe, with some Cortosis in it somewhere, say…a gauntlet?
Allegiance and duty ultimately to the Force, not some impermanent political entity, be it Republic or Imperial
Standard-issue sabres, not this “mystical weapon” crap. Also, guns.
Celibacy go bye-bye.
Cut the ascetic bullshit - your choice of off-duty clothing, regular pay, civilian friends.
Does any of that sound…familiar?

Oh, and paid-for Twy’lek hookers for any Jedi who don’t want fixed relationships.