Differing Libidos

[Incref]

I've been with my partner for almost two years, coming up to a year living together. The sex has never been up to my own desires (at least every second day) but it was weekly. It is now a couple of times a month and the parameters around such love making are becoming more frequent (i.e. we did at one stage have Saturday morning sex, this is now considered 'during the day' which is a no-no).

I feel I'm being petty, but sex is an integral part of what makes me feel loved in a relationship, masturbation doesn't cut it. It's not about climax, it's a about sharing something pleasurable with another person who you think is tops.

So please share Dopers, can it work? There is little interest from my other half to change this situation so I don't think the conventional visit to the sex shop will help. Can I find away to be satisfied with what I have?

[don't ask]

The way sexual relationships work is that both partners get exactly the amount of sex desired by the partner with the lower libido. Learn to live with it or change partners.

[twickster]

Since you're looking for advice, I'll move this to IMHO for you.

twickster, MPSIMS moderator

[Foggy]

Originally Posted by Incref

Can I find away to be satisfied with what I have?

Nope. Kick her to the curb, find someone else. This is based on some personal experience and what I have learn from others.

[Qadgop the Mercotan]

Statistically, it's unlikely that a relationship with such a libido mismatch will result in a long-term mutually satisfying relationship. Not impossible or unheard of, but unlikely.

You could ask your partner for a non-monogamous relationship, so you can find further satisfaction elsewhere. It works for some couples.

[kayT]

Originally Posted by Foggy

Nope. Kick her to the curb, find someone else. This is based on some personal experience and what I have learn from others.

I think it's interesting that you assumed the OP was a man and the lower libido belonged to the woman. This is the stereotype I guess, but in my personal experience this is only correct about half the time.

[Unintentionally Blank]

in 16 years of marriage, our libidos were all over the map. Do not assume that, because it's not working for you now, that is a permanent situation. On of the things that turned it around was my wife getting more excercise...it made her feel better about herself, the endorphins from excercise made her feel better, the added bloodflow and flexibility helped.

At the same time, my libido is 1/3rd what it used to be 10 years ago.

The mismatch MUST be a point of mutual, open, conversation or it WILL become the lever that is blamed for the end of the relationship. It requires compromise by both parties. Yes, you're not getting it as much as you want...but that doesn't make your partner necessarily at fault. There's gotta be compromise for things to work out. Paradoxically, you CAN apply so much pressure as to make your partner actively dislike the act...which doesn't help either of you.

Are there other factors at play? Stress at work, finances, emotional scarring?

[DianaG]

The biggest problem with differing libidos is that it's really difficult to not perceive your partner's lack of interest in sex as a lack of attraction to you, and who wants to be with someone who's not attracted to them?

Add to that the fact that sex is the one thing that it's typically not cool to indulge in without your partner regardless of their lack of interest. I mean, if your partner doesn't like video games or romcoms, s/he generally won't expect you to stop enjoying these things with other people.

Ultimately, simmering resentment tends to be bad for relationships.

[ZenBeam]

Originally Posted by kayT

I think it's interesting that you assumed the OP was a man and the lower libido belonged to the woman. This is the stereotype I guess, but in my personal experience this is only correct about half the time.

The OP and partner could also be same-sex.

Incref, you need to have a serious discussion with your partner about your relationship. It's not just about sex.

[heathen earthling]

I've been in a situation like this, and I think it can become less of a big deal with age. And a woman's libido can be repressed quite a lot just by birth control pills, so it isn't always something personal. I wouldn't recommend breaking up over it if the relationship is otherwise good.

Originally Posted by Incref

(i.e. we did at one stage have Saturday morning sex, this is now considered 'during the day' which is a no-no).

Having strict rules like this does strike me as a little weird and unhealthy, however.

[Lamia]

Originally Posted by Incref

I've been with my partner for almost two years, coming up to a year living together. The sex has never been up to my own desires (at least every second day) but it was weekly. It is now a couple of times a month and the parameters around such love making are becoming more frequent (i.e. we did at one stage have Saturday morning sex, this is now considered 'during the day' which is a no-no).

The bolded part seems very odd to me, and suggests there's something bigger going on with your partner than a diminished libido.

So please share Dopers, can it work? There is little interest from my other half to change this situation so I don't think the conventional visit to the sex shop will help. Can I find away to be satisfied with what I have?

I believe it's possible for a relationship to work even when one person wants sex more often than the other does, but only if both people are willing to talk about the issue openly and decide that they're willing to make changes or compromises in order to save the relationship. But if your partner keeps making up increasingly strict rules about sex and is unwilling to consider changing then I don't think you should be satisfied with the relationship, at least not as it is now.

[lavenderviolet]

It might help if you gave more details. Genders and age of both parties could help put things in context. I am very curious about how these "parameters" came about. What was the conversation like when the other partner said there would no longer be daytime sex and so on?

[DianaG]

Yeah, I'd be very curious to know whether things like "no daytime sex" are actual explicitly spoken rules, or just observations on the OP's part.

[Lamia]

Originally Posted by DianaG

Yeah, I'd be very curious to know whether things like "no daytime sex" are actual explicitly spoken rules, or just observations on the OP's part.

That's a good point. I assumed that the partner had said that daytime sex was no longer an option, but if it's instead that the partner just hasn't agreed to have sex during the day recently then I find that a lot less troubling than someone who started unilaterally making rules about when sex was to be permitted.

[AClockworkMelon]

Originally Posted by kayT

I think it's interesting that you assumed the OP was a man and the lower libido belonged to the woman. This is the stereotype I guess, but in my personal experience this is only correct about half the time.

Originally Posted by ZenBeam

The OP and partner could also be same-sex.

Here the OP says she's a gay female.

[DSeid]

One partner sees physical intimacy as a need and as a means to connect, and the other is both uninterested in anywhere near the same frequency and not interested in trying to address the difference between them.

I don't care if that's same sex or who is what gender, that is a recipe for a "sex starved marriage", even if it is not officially a marriage, and unless it is addressed long term unhappiness awaits both partners. IMHO.

[Incref]

Thanks for all the replies thus far.

As a previous poster cleverly deducted we're both women. I'm 26 and my partner is 23. I would never have described her as very sexual but it's become more of an issue in the last couple of months. I wouldn't say there is anything in particular that could have caused this, 2011 was a tumultuous year and that didn't seem to have any bearing on the frequency.

The 'no sex during day light hours' has been explicitly stated. It was always one of her quirks but one that wasn't really enforced if we were already in bed. Other rules include no sex if either one of us is menstruating (which can rule out two weeks a month) and no sex other than in the bed. Writing this down actually makes it sound a lot more bizarre than I thought it was.

I have mentioned the open relationship idea, in fact I sent her an article about it last night. Not home until later this evening so I'm not sure how she's taken that one.

In all other aspects the relationship is pretty healthy, we enjoy each others company immensely, laugh and talk passionately about all manner of things. I'm really hoping this isn't a deal breaker, she knows how I feel and I don't think she wants to talk about it anymore.

[raspberry hunter]

I am much more willing to have sex before a certain time of night (the exact time of which has changed as our lifestyle has changed). After that point, I'm almost always too tired and sex keeps me up late enough that I'm cranky the next day, and I'm just not happy about it. Could there be anything like that going on? I don't have a daytime thing myself, but I could sort of see that if one had body issues or anything like that, that it might be uncomfortable to have sex in the daytime. We also have a no-sex-while-menstruating rule, mostly because I am the one who washes the sheets and I just don't want to deal with blood on the sheets (if he washes the sheets I'm happy to change that) but of course for us that's only one week/month.

Also, if it's just a couple of months... that's not very long. My poor husband had to put up with reduced libido from me for a year. Twice. The first time it seemed inexplicable, but it turned out to be a low thyroid function (actually... your partner may want to get a checkup and blood test if she hasn't had one in a while; not saying it's thyroid on her part, but it's always nice to get checked out every once in a while to make sure everything is working all right), and the second time it was because I had just had a baby and refused to have sex for about a year. Fortunately he was very patient with me, and it paid off in the end, I hope

ETA: I would have had a fit if after two months of my reduced libido my husband had asked me to do an open relationship. On the other hand, we were pretty open to talking about my libido, so there's that.

[corkboard]

Originally Posted by Incref

... she knows how I feel and I don't think she wants to talk about it anymore.

Here's the problem. Once you've stopped talking about it, it's not going to get any better.

[Truman Burbank]

I see a lot of red flags here, especially given your relative youth and newness of the relationship. I would not make a committment today assuming it will get better later...

[Incref]

Thanks for all your responses.

I've resolved to withdraw a bit sexually and see what to true extent of her desires are. I think my discussing it has made her more inclined to feel less sexy than she already does.

[Illuminatiprimus]

Originally Posted by Incref

Thanks for all your responses.

I've resolved to withdraw a bit sexually and see what to true extent of her desires are. I think my discussing it has made her more inclined to feel less sexy than she already does.

Then your relationship is doomed. If you can't discuss your issues without there being a negative consequence you will never resolve anything, and particularly in the area of sex which (as others have pointed out) can be difficult to get through if people see it different. Based on what you've written I'd say that you should move on, you're too young , and too little into the relationship, to be stuck with someone who wants things fundamentally different to you.

[DSeid]

Originally Posted by corkboard

Here's the problem. Once you've stopped talking about it, it's not going to get any better.

Originally Posted by Incref

... I've resolved to withdraw a bit sexually and see what to true extent of her desires are. I think my discussing it has made her more inclined to feel less sexy than she already does.

Originally Posted by Illuminatiprimus

Then your relationship is doomed. ...

Would the two of you consider a couples counselor with a focus on sex therapy?

It sounds like your partner has a certain amount of anxiety regarding sex. If so then you are right that just your talking about it, especially your honestly sharing how it makes you feel, may raise her anxiety level and be counter-productive. But your not talking about it, getting more hurt and resentful, also only elevates the stakes and slowly increase the anxiety level as well. Navigating through that, if it is to be accomplished at all, may require some professional help; ignoring it, martyring your emotional and physical desires, is likely to only make it harder to deal with it later and cause increasing resentment from both directions.

[Bob Ducca]

Have you read up on Lesbian Bed Death?

According to Schwartz, lesbian couples in committed relationships have less sex than any other type of couple, and they generally experience less sexual intimacy the longer the relationship lasts.

I'm not sure if that study holds up or if it's been found to be a bunch of bullshit, but it seemed relevant enough.

Any chance of infidelity? That can wreak havoc on any couple's sex life, gay or straight.

[Rachellelogram]

If you followed a sex columnist with regularity, you'd find out that mismatched libidos are in no way a petty issue. Read some back issues of Savage Love. You're going to have to change the relationship fundamentally (which is generally unlikely to work) or end it. And in the future, don't allow yourself to get entangled with someone whose libido doesn't fit yours.

It's not easy, but that's your solution.

Also, having read that your girlfriend sets bizarre rules about when you can fuck her leads me to believe that she's an utter control freak. I've never been in a relationship with a partner who set out rules for when sex is ok. That's fucked-up. It sounds like she has some weird-ass sexual hangups, and you don't have to subject yourself to that.

It also doesn't matter how well you get along outside the bedroom. She sounds like a fun friend, but she's undoubtedly not a good girlfriend. Emotional compatibility is important, but you're going to have that with all of your friends. The major difference between a friend and a girlfriend is that you fuck your girlfriend.

[Illuminatiprimus]

Originally Posted by DSeid

Would the two of you consider a couples counselor with a focus on sex therapy?

Originally Posted by rachelellogram

If you followed a sex columnist with regularity, you'd find out that mismatched libidos are in no way a petty issue. Read some back issues of Savage Love.

I read/listen to savage love religiously so I know what Dan's position would be - and I agree with it - because he's given it so often on cases like this: if you have an issue like this so soon into a relationship (and under five years IS soon) and the other person won't communicate about it, AND you're as young as both people are, then it's just better for everyone to end it now and move on to other people. Maybe there's a gal out there for your partner who doesn't see sex as that important either, and is happy with the frequency your partner wants it at. Currently you're stopping her from meeting that person, just as she's stopping you have the level of sex you would like. A couples counsellor this early isn't, in my view, something you should need to resort to, and implies there are significant enough differences between you that you're just not compatible.

rachelellogram makes an extremely good point that a good relationship outside the bedroom, particularly at this early stage of the relationship, can't counter balance the lack of sex. Your girlfriend is supposed to be more than someone you hang out with.

[obbn]

Let me add my thoughts by saying it sound much like my first marriage. The sex was great at the start and got less and less frequent from there. I understood that libido's vary so I wasn't that concerned, but what does have me concerned is the same thing I went through concerning the "rules" of sex.
My ex-wife was very clear. Sex only every other day. I called it "every other day day sex" and it was horrible. Always on a schedule and it NEVER varied. If I was sick on sex day too bad you missed your turn and you have to wait until the next time. Get bonus sex for some reason on an off day? The schedule magically re-set itself so no sex the next night. It got to a point that sex was so predictable (including the act itself, like it was scripted) that I started to prefer masturbation to mounting up on that bat.

It seemed to make her feel in control and it made me feel terrible all the time. Like I wasn't wanted and was being "serviced" and not loved. Since I said this is my ex you know how it turned out. Funny thing is she was married before me and I talked once to her ex about it, same deal. She is married again (trying to break Liz Taylor's record I suppose) and every time I see her and her new husband I have to laugh a bit knowing what he is going through. It caused a lot of problems during our marriage and I would certainly not entertain marrying your partner until you get this worked out. You will grow to resent them for it.

Now, on the good side I am re-married myself to a wonderful woman who has a healthy attitude about sex. We have sex constantly and it is initiated by both of us. I never knew how bad my sex life was until I actually had a great one with someone else. I am very happy and feel very loved and wanted. I do realize that some of our female Dopers might think that the only thing that matters to me in a marriage is sex and you would be wrong. But, sex is such a major issue that if it isn't working right it can bring down the whole house of cards by itself.

Oh and my use of the term "bat" above. She slept hanging upside down, wrapped in a cocoon of her own wings so the term is accurate. As you can tell I just love my ex-wife!

[Unintentionally Blank]

Originally Posted by obbn

Oh and my use of the term "bat" above. She slept hanging upside down, wrapped in a cocoon of her own wings so the term is accurate. As you can tell I just love my ex-wife!

I find myself more and more wanting a way to upvote posts on this board, a la Reddit.

[Ludy]

As someone with a low libido you have to be careful that sex does not turn into a chore. I will fully admit that there are times when I have sex with my husband just because it has been a little while. I don't particularly want to but I go through the motions because I feel like I have to.

It is a fine line between talking about it openly and having the low libido partner feel like you are harassing them for sex.

I think you should have a frank talk about why she doesn't want to have sex at particular times. I don't like having sex when I'm menstrating or late at night. My husband likes to stay up late and I have to be up early with our toddler and baby. Often times I will just closing my book and closing my eyes when my husband will come into bed, snuggle up and want to have sex. This will cut 30-45 minutes out of my sleep, and when you have a baby that still might be getting up at night to feed, and a toddler that is up at 6 like clockwork, that sleep is needed.

Another example is daytime sex. He will stay up late, and then sleep in. I'll head into the bedroom at about 11am after being awake for 5 hours to get something and he will want to have sex. He is great at tuning out the kids, I am not. So again I have to turn him down because I can't enjoy it whith a baby crying and a toddler pounding on the door yelling for her Mom.

It's not that I don't want to have sex, it's just that I don't want to have sex then.

Now neither of these examples work for you, but it might be something besides just a difference in libido.

[Unintentionally Blank]

While I preface this: it's nobody's fault and nobody's to blame, it's like a deaf person making a hearing person stay in a room with a piercing alarm.

No libido- no problem

Libido not getting enough: a nagging itch that just won't stop.

And the person that doesn't want it has more and more and more reasons why now is not a good time, and the other person remembers when it wasn't such an awful chore...you know...like they felt wanted. Because in a relationship, the feeling that your mate would be MUCH happier doing ANTHING else is quite the turn-on. You don't come first, you don't come second, you come 64th. If must see TV isn't on. :dubious

[DSeid]

Originally Posted by Ludy

It is a fine line between talking about it openly and having the low libido partner feel like you are harassing them for sex....

Indeed the solution cannot be having sex reluctantly. The low libido partner does not want to feel harassed or be felt like they are an object. But that lower libido has to understand that the higher libido partner may experience being told "not right now" over and over again as a deep and very hurtful rejection. The higher libido partner may, with some good reason, think that if their partner loved her/him then (s)he would desire her/him, and even if the desire for sex wasn't there at that moment, that their would be some pleasure in giving the other pleasure ... at least a great deal of sensitivity to how much the higher libido sense of self gets hurt by the perception of not being desired. Maybe Ludy you have sex when you are not in the mood and it has been a while not because you feel you "have to", but because you want your partner to know that you enjoy their enjoyment and because you know that sex is how he understands he is loved much more than saying the words communicate it to him.

Maybe even with professional help it is hopeless, but managing those minefields without it? Impossible.