What does ‘committed relationship’ even mean from a legal standpoint? I would think the courts understand married and not married, but how would they define a relationship as committed? I’m not a lawyer, but that sounds like a non-issue in court.
The point of alimony is to provide support to the spouse until they can get back on their feet. Just because she’s in a committed relationship doesn’t mean her boyfriend is contributing financially to support her. That’s why it would seem to be a non-issue in terms of alimony. Either she’s married or she’s not. Either she’s eligible for alimony or she’s not. I don’t see how a boyfriend would play into the outcome.
It sounds like the OP’s mom and her boyfriend are actually engaged, but they aren’t getting married because that would stop her alimony/pension payments. She is definitely not playing fair by the spirit of alimony, if it is intended to help her out until she gets back on her feet. She is avoiding getting on with her life because she doesn’t want the free money that she (arguably) doesn’t deserve to stop. Not only does she not want it to stop, she is trying to get more money she doesn’t deserve.
My dad was in a relationship with a woman who was in this situation. They exchanged rings but couldn’t get married, because she was collecting a fat pension. But she never bragged on facebook, because she isn’t an idiot. Also, she and her ex-husband were sufficiently geographically-separated that the relationship was never found out. And, she wasn’t stupid enough to try to take him to court for even MORE free money.
Some people are just unbelievable. You can bet if one of my parents pulled this shit on the other, I’d be taking sides in a flash. But that’s just me.
While I certainly agree that the best policy is to stay out of it, I’d preface that action by telling mom that I won’t stand by while she does what she’s doing. Maybe something like, “Look, you and I both know what you filed against Dad is fraudulent at best. I want to be clear here: I will not lie for you. I also will not stand by while you lie in an attempt to defraud my father. You know why? Because YOU raised me better than to be that kind of person.” Then I’d start following the advice of the others: if she calls and mentions one word about this whole situation (other than that she’s seen the err of her ways and is dropping it), tell her, “I told you I’m not going to talk about this anymore. Call me when you want to talk about something else.” And hang up.
Anyway, my point here is that I think you should lay out on the line what your position is-- that’s not taking sides, that’s stating facts. Perhaps I’m like this because things need to be simply explained to my own mother. . . but hey, give it a try, especially since that’ll stop her from being able to say you weren’t clear.
And I’m with phreesh. I can’t imagine not taking sides here, mostly because your mom is being a scumbag of the highest order. If my choice was to sit back passively and let my mom be a jerk or to potentially lose her relationship. . . well, I don’t need liars and cheaters in my life. If she’s willing to do that to him, it’s only a matter of time before she does it to you.
You’re assuming that the OP can stop anything. By not taking sides, I mean he should stay out of all ongoing fights, telephone relays, he-said-she-said’s between his parents. If the court asks him to testify, he should tell the truth. By telling the truth, he is making what contribution he can make, and that is all he should do. By getting deeply involved in the fights, arguments, name-calling, and rancor he will not stop one person from stealing from another. He will just add to the noise without adding to the clarity.
I don’t know that the OP can stop anything, but I really doubt he (?) can stay out of it either. If he stays neutral, and gets called into court, and then says “yeah, Mom has been in a relationship with this guy for years and they own property together” Mom is going to think he just screwed her over. As he said in the OP, a big ugly rift is coming…no one gets to remain “neutral” in these things - or you can try, but you still get blamed. Therefore, to me, it makes the most sense to have a come to Jesus talk with Mom to keep the rift from becoming large, where the potential downsides of her course of action are explained.
He’ll get blamed if he gets into it and blamed if he chooses to stay out of it. Less overall damage in the second instance IMHO. There are NO winners here. The goal, to me, is to avoid casualties by limiting how many jump into the pit. I’m withdrawing from the discussion, having shared my thoughts. Peace.
I saw a case sorta kinda like this where a local doc was paying his wife about $ 30,000 annually in alimony (not CS) and had a requirement in the divorce decree that his ex not set up permanent housekeeping (ie permanently live with) with other men in the house where she was taking care of the kids.
She was in a relationship with a prison guard who would come and stay Monday through Saturday, Leave Sunday so he was not there the whole week and then re-up on Monday. A PI took videos of him coming and going.
The Judge decided this was a violation of the spirit of the agreement and banged the gavel once and she was out $ 30,000 a year just like that.
Your mother has no real chance of getting alimony re-instated, it’s delusional and if your father has a lick of sense he will have documented your mother’s relationship. The key here is that your mother’s attorney is playing her and figures that with sufficient churning he can probably bill for 10-20K by the time this is done.
Here’s what is going to happen -
1: Your mother will not get alimony
2: She will be billed at least $ 10,000 to discover this
3: Depending on your state law there might be a possibility she will lose the pension if the Judge rules she has been deceitful about the nature of her relationship
Your mother is behaving like the worst kind of con artist. I would tell her this point blank. That everybody wants you to scamper to the sidelines in this scenario is kind of sickening.
That sort of depends on how much responsibility he needs to take for stupid ol mom as she ages. I financially support more than one relative, and if any of my relatives endangered their income, it would be my problem. Which is why I don’t think you can stay out of it. Not if Mom is ever going to look for emotional or financial support once she screws herself over.
This. I wonder what the penalty for perjury would be in a case like this. Your mom may be a fine person otherwise, but she’s wrong when it comes to this situation, and she’s on a very dangerous path.
I would have one serious talk with her about this.
This thread makes me feel good. I divorced a real cunt, yet never, ever said a bad word about her to my kids. In fact I’d correct them when they would complain about her. Today, I’m best friends with two adults wo appreciate and understand.
The one thing I do really take concern with was my dad’s ultimatum that I not spend any time around my mom and her fiancee (his justification being that if she’s changing her tone to them not being in a relationship, then spending time with them together would be approving their deceit). I don’t feel right making judgements without hearing both sides of the story first, but neither am I gonna call up my mom and say “so what’s this stuff my dad’s been talking about?” as that would just drag me into this even further. I’m just gonna wait and see if my mom ever brings this up…
I don’t want to take the mom’s side but, the part of the pension she gets is no different than the part of the pension he gets. It is money that came to them when they were married and is split when they divorce. I don’t think that is uncommon and it certainly isn’t the same as alimony. I mean, the dad continues to get a check from some long past employer and nobody is calling him a deadbeat for it. It may be that she might lose her share of the pension if she remarries, I don’t know.
The rest of the story I agree with everyone else. Stay out of it, she is being greedy, let the court decide. Any parent asking a child to take sides in situations like this has lost sight of what is important.
I spent the weekend at my mom’s house. She mentioned not a word about what was going on here. I spoke to my dad tonight and he said right now everything is in the lawyers’ hands, and they will be fighting it out. Even if her side backs down, he is going to continue to pursue this to make sure she doesn’t try something like this again down the road.
Couldn’t have phrased it better myself. Unfortunately, if she loses and loses all financial support from her ex, she’ll blame him for doing her wrong and never see her own hand in it.