25 and never been in a relationship

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
121

Well, hell, I don’t really know how to define a “deep emotional level.” I just know that I have lots of drinking buddies and I get along great with people at work, but I don’t have anyone I’d ask to be best man at my wedding, you know? If someone is throwing a party or people are going out the the bars I’ll probably get invited, but I’ll be the one going home alone every time.

I guess people see me as this really calm, rational, quiet dude, and for the most part I am. It’s just that when I try to express some kind of emotion it never comes out right. At work, some guys go to the back room and yell and cuss or they have really animated conversations with other people, but when I try to do the same thing I start seeing looks like this: :dubious:

After a while things just get old. I’m tired of hanging out with a new group of people every two years. Every time I meet a girl it gets screwed up somehow. Now I’m at that age where I see people getting married and settling down and they talk to their friends about the crazy times they had and how they are bros for life or whatever and I just think to myself, “I don’t have any of that.”

And then my stupid parents keep asking if I’ve found a girlfriend yet and my mom said something about grandkids a while back that really got under my skin. They say things like, “you don’t have a girlfriend? Why not?” They just ask “why not?” as if it is as easy a picking up a loaf of bread from the store or something. I have stopped talking to them as much because their badgering is really not helping the situation. They aren’t the easiest people to talk to either. It seems like every time I talk to someone in my family they always want to know about my love life (or lack thereof) and I have to tell them that, no, nothing has changed. So I don’t even like talking to my family any more because I have nothing to report and it seems like they always want me to tell them different but I never can.
Reading back over some of this stuff, I can see how some things look like they might conflict or don’t make sense. Honestly, I’m trying to be as transparent here as I can. I don’t have any reason to lie to a bunch of people on the internet who don’t know who I am.

122

The “strong silent type” is hard to pull off. If a guy doesn’t look the part of the strongman then he just comes off as the “silent” type, and nobody likes that. Girls are more attracted to the “strong” part of the “strong silent type” than the “silent” part.

You should talk a lot. Just don’t be overbearing.

Watch Pretty In Pink. Take note of the “Ducky” character. You do not want to be like that. Also take note of Andrew McCarthy’s character.You do not want to be like that. Then pay close attention to James Spader’s character…wait, you do not want to be like that.

OK, forget that approach.

Watch any movie with John David Carson in it. Basically you want to be like that. Here, go to 2:25 in this clip from “Murder, She Wrote.” You want to aim for that kind of conversational tone.

123

Man, I’m going to have to agree with some of the others here. You do sound rather depressed.

What are you passionate about? What really gets you going? Anything? What do you do for work, school, or fun?

If there’s nothing, maybe it’s time to start looking. Calm, rational and quiet isn’t going to get you anywhere when it comes to relating with other people. Honestly, it isn’t. You can’t reason your way into emotional bonds.

In fact, your emotions sound completely foreign to you, like you’ve walled them off or not let them be felt enough or something. Yeah, this is the “get in touch with your emotions” speech. Sorry to get all Freudian on your ass, but did you not have many chances to connect with people as a kid? Were your parents distant? Did something traumatizing happen?

I’d go so far as to suggest you start hating yourself, if that’s what it takes, if only so you can get your blood boiling enough to really, really want to change – from an inner, burning desire, not from an out-of-body, purely analytical “logic dictates I probably should” kinda way – and then maybe you can start seeking out some of life’s thrills. If there’s one thing worse than feeling bad it’s feeling nothing at all; that emotional numbness is a wasteland that neither you nor anyone around you wants to be in.

The “be yourself” bullshit only works if the real you is a cool guy hindered by surface nervousness, not if you’re a total bore underneath. On the other hand, this doesn’t have to be a “game” or a mere act either. Instead of pretending to be someone else and tricking dumb girls into bed (which doesn’t seem to be your goal anyway), you can change from within; eventually, the resulting emotions, demeanor, and confidence that you project will be the real deal. It’s the harder road, but it may well pay off in the end if you survive it.

In the meantime… man, live a little. Your posts sound robotic. The good news is that you do get invited to parties, and you do have drinking buddies, and you do get asked out – so clearly there’s a part of you that’s alive and animated enough that people don’t completely write you off. That’s more than a good start. That’s a damned great “in”, if you only cultivate it more and let it grow. Let go. Feel. Get fucking wasted and ask one of your buddies what they think. Be vulnerable enough to joke around with a gal even if you say the stupidest thing in the world or get smacked in the face… whatever, it’s just part of the process.

You’re a stiff in a shell, man. Let your passions break through from within and let others’ break through to you… listen to them, find out what it is that makes them excited about whatever it is they’re excited about, and imagine yourself in their shoes and be excited too. That part of you does exist; it just sounds like you haven’t used it very much lately. So start!

[/pontification]

124

Actually, ejtx, you should disregard my previous post. Upon re-reading it, it became obvious I really don’t know what I’m talking about. Listen to the more experienced posters here instead. Sorry. :smack:

125

Nononono… I liked it. I think you’re right.
But this:

Now see this is exactly what I’m talking about. Do I really sound robotic here? Fuck, I feel like I’m pouring my heart out and this is the same kind of thing someone would say in real life.

126

What you sound like in text format on a message board is not an indication of what you are like in person. It doesn’t matter what you type here - it’s not really a reflection of your personality. I don’t think you’re “robotic,” anyway.

127

Does your anxiety come from the fact that you don’t HAVE any close bonds, or that you don’t WANT them when other people think you SHOULD? Maybe you’re happy being a loner, but you’re afraid that you’re missing out on something you think you should want, or disappointing your parents.

Look deep within yourself and answer honestly. Do you really want deeper connections, or are afraid by not having them you’re not measuring up to some standard?

We’re taught from a very young age that the ultimate measuring sticks of self worth are marriage, kids, and status/money. Is that what you’re concerned about? Because it’s not true. Fuck everyone else. You’re not less of a man if you haven’t “scored” despite what all the stupid teen coming of age movies want you to think. Nobody has a Hollywood romance. Lots of people end up settling. It’s called “settling down” for a reason. Sometimes it’s a matter of desperation or financial security. Tons of people get married when they don’t want it and end up feeling trapped and miserable for the rest of their lives. Nobody is as happy as they appear.

Likewise, you’re not a worthless human being if you never graduate to the top of your career. When you’re dead and gone, the only thing that will have mattered is what YOU wanted out of life. Not your parents or what you think you SHOULD have wanted. If you’re most happiest when you go home alone, play XBox and jerk off, so be it. It’s your life. Find out what your goals are. I mean YOUR goals. Write them down if you have to. If you really, truly want closer bonds, go to a shrink and start working out your issues. If you don’t, then go work on what will make you happy.

128

No. Inhibited, yes, but you already knew that.

129

I kinda get the vibe that you think sexuality is some sort of dirty evil thing that you are doing to these poor girls. Hint: they like it.

As to your larger issue. You’ve heard this in kindergarten, but it’s really true, you have to be a friend to make a friend. If you meet people that you get along with, you are essentially friends, but from there it’s up to you to reciprocate some kind of friendliness. If you meet people and never try and hang out or do things like that, they are going to stop reciprocating if you don’t meet them half way.

130

This is important. So people invite you to go out to bars, parties and all that. But do you invite people to do things? Hang out, do any kinds of social things? Not just girls you might want to date, but guys & girls you’re not interested in romantically.

Having a large group of people to party with is fun, but it’s not really a great way to get close to people if that’s all you’re doing with them.

131

Do you have decent medical coverage? You might really benefit from some group therapy where you could interact with other people dealing with similar issues. Being forced to act emotional in front of other people would be good practice. Maybe someone will tell you why you seem so damn robotic.

For what it’s worth, I feel somewhat similar to your situation except that I’ve managed to avoid all the bad parts. For instance, most people would describe me as emotionally distant if you asked. Even the people I’m closest to often express regret that they’re don`t feel closer to me emotionally.

Where we differ - vastly - is that people for some reason find my extremely easy to open up to. I’m a good listener and I come off like I really genuinely care whether I do or not. So my friends sometimes stop and think about the fact that they don`t really know what’s going on inside my head, but most of the time they feel close to me because I know everything that’s going on in theirs (because they told me).

It works with women - like Argent Towers said, strong silent type. It works with friends. It works with everyone for me. So I don`t want to change.

I talked to a psychologist about it when I was younger and dealing with the death of a relative. He actually suggested the group therapy idea to get better at sharing my feelings, which is where I got the idea for you. I ultimately didn’t pursue it because as I said, being me works really well for me.

132

Being a good listener is important too but if all you do is listen, you’ll be a “friend” forever. You have to be assertive too.

133

I really think ejtx needs advice beyond women. Becoming closer friends with a few guys would do him a world of good. You’re quite right about women, I just wasn’t intending to address a strategy to be with more women.

134

I think the OP’s problems go a little beyond getting laid by prom here.

And actually what you describe is a pretty worthless human being - no relationships. No aspirations. What is the point of a life isolating yourself from the world and indulging in nothing but fantasy bullshit?

Look, I’m a bit of a loner myself. There’s probably nothing I like better then spending a relaxing Saturday jerking off, playing XBox, watching TV and surfing the internet. Except, of course, doing pretty much anything involving actual people.

I don’t get a sense that the OP is frustrated because he isn’t living up to other people’s expectations for him. I suspect he’s frustrated because his fear or ambivalence or whatever it is that is keeping him from doing what he wants to do is…er…keeping him from doing what he wants to do.

It seems like our OP is very passive and reactive to life. He’ll go along with the courtesy invite to drinks with the after work happy hour crowd or if some girl asks him out he’ll go along with it. Yet he doesn’t have a core group of regular friends nor does he appear to have ever planned out a fun and exciting date. I’m willing to be he goes to a lot of the parties but few people remember him being there. He sound almost unsure of how he is supposed to act or what he’s supposed to do. Almost kind of like he’s a minor side character in the narative of his own life.

Actually, **Reply ** is right. Not that your posts sound robotic. Your behavior does. Kind of like a low-end Terminator model analyzing human interactions and processing for an appropriate response.

Part of developing close relationships with people is getting past the superficial external facade that everyone puts on so as to appear inoffensive and “normal” to the outside world. Why am I closer to friends I see once every few years than my idiot coworkers I see every day? Because when I get together with my friends, we usually have years worth of crazy stories, stupid adventures, and amusing anecdotes. With my coworkers, our only interactions are the standard cordial corporate interactions. In the year that I have been here, I haven’t seen a spark of anything that would make me want to hang out with one over any of the other interchangable fleshdrones in the office.

Because nothing screams “sexy” like Murder, She Wrote.

135

No, no, it’s just his tone of voice and body language in that scene. It’s perfect.

136

Look OP, let’s ignore the hookers and blow sidetrack…

I think the deal is that you feel weird that you feel emotionally isolated from a lot of your peers, including women. You don’t want to have a sexual relationship without a real emotional connection and you feel strange because you don’t feel “into” the woman to the extent that you would-that you can take it or leave it, right? And that this feeling extends to a lot of the people you meet?

I often feel the same way about most people and I am most certainly not clinically depressed. And umm, while I am not a virgin I most certainly don’t subscribe to the ultra-promiscuous Sex and the City philosophy either.

I don’t know any people who have 20 to 30 really really good friends that they’ve known for since the age of 4 (I’m sure they exist in a world full of people, though). I know a lot of people who have a LOT of casual acquaintances they can go drinking with-my opinion is that while many of the very gregarious types thrive on casual/bullshit acquaintance friendships and are energised by that lifestyle and the more introverted/lonerish folk get tired out by it and then wonder what’s wrong with them. Are you sure that your feelings of isolation don’t come from being in the second category? Doing something the way everyone ordains it has to be done (trying to find good friends by going clubbing/to the bars) doesn’t necessarily mean it’s what is going to work for you. Although, I wouldn’t necessarily completely give up that practice because it is important to network throughout life.

Is there something that really interests you? A hobby or something? Try to find people, friends or ladies-who-might-be-more-than-friends who share your quirkier interests-I can be pleasant to someone at a bar without much social anxiety but am really only interested in repeatedly hanging out with people who share my interests or who make me laugh. For instance, I really like fashion (well, shopping at Bebe), cooking, kickboxing, travelling and science fiction novels. I am not into gaming, or wine or playing darts and getting wasted or a million other things.

The thing is that you have to go find these things for yourself. They don’t come to you without that effort because you have to go out and fail at and hate something new before you find something you really like (I mean, my family continually mocks me for Hobby Fail…I try something new every year, f*ck it up and go back to working out, shopping at Bebe and reading trashy sci fi). If you are anxious about doing that, or you don’t feel up to it-yes, I would very much go get help for that.

It’s easier to feel enthusiastic about other people if they’re sharing an experience that makes you enthusiastic and excited.

And sorry about that sounding like a platitude but I think in most cases it’s true.

137

ejtx -

How do your friendships typically end? Do people just sort of fade out, or do you get in to fights (verbal, physical) with them?

Do you have any secrets? Who do you tell? When things happen to you, do you tell anyone about how those things make you feel?

What is your favorite thing to do in your spare time? Have you shared that activity with anyone?

ETA: sorry if this sounds like an interrogation - just trying to get to know more about you. Some of the things you’ve said ring very true with me.

138

I had my first serious relationship at the age of 29.

Now, at age 46, I am happily married.

25 is not too late.

Ed

139

Fair enough. I think the problem may be differing priorities. Your position is perfectly valid, however you have to realize that for your/our (just turned 26 myself) peer group it’s usually the opposite. An emotionally involved relationship is seen as a much higher investment than a purely physical one. So even though your opinion differs, in their eyes you’re still asking for a lot more than they’re prepared to give at the moment. You’re in a tough position.

Some will tell you it is, but don’t listen to them. If you won’t even stand up for what you believe, then what’s the point?

Again, I’m guessing the people that roam the bars and parties probably aren’t looking for the same kind of relationship you are.

I’m with you there too brother. Everyone thought I was the guy who couldn’t hold his liquor in college. In reality, sometimes I was almost completely sober. I just had anxiety so bad it made me sick. Things are a lot better now but I STILL find myself sometimes paralyzed by it.

I personally haven’t found the answer yet, but I’ve at least gotten to a point were I’m more than content with the situation. Good luck to you.

140

Woefully late to yet another thread, but: the OP sounds much like me.

I am, what many have commented on (mostly not straight to me), a rock-faced, distant, even a bit scary guy. I have difficulties in relating to others, connecting, socializing. For years I wondered what’s the deal that I can’t get intimate with women: I’m quite good-looking (as told by women), fit and dress sharp, yet ugly slobs hang up with women left and right and I head home alone.

I have high standards of myself as well as of others. For years, almost nothing was good enough for me, and even when I got to talk with very beautiful, charming women, I couldn’t let go of the “über-cool”, detached facade, and felt basically nothing. Girls would approach me, but it never got anywhere, unless I was hammered enough to (apparently) loosen up. Some of my friends were sure I was gay after seeing me with dream girls without any normal signs on my part.

It took me years to realize how wooden I must look out there trying to find company. I thought I had trained a positive, relaxed look on my face while in reality I looked mostly scared. I thought my (forced) good posture sent a positive message to women, yet it made me look odd. Now I know I was even too groomed for most women who don’t want a guy more concerned about his looks than they are.

I had no idea of how to play the “game”, I was really clueless about most social rules. I thought being to-the-point and honest were virtues while they actively drove people away, me being interpreted as a guy with “strong opinions” and “issues”, and rightly so. When I tried to be compassionate or even just witty, it mostly came out all wrong, insulting people or sending confused looks my way. Timing, phrasing, tone, body language etc - all off.

Not until my mid-twenties did I start to unravel the emotional locks I have. The first shrink I ever saw said, before I had revealed anything about my childhood: "It seems to me you are deeply traumatized ". I have a strong suspicion the OP is, too, and really urge him to seek professional councelling. Just talking to someone from the outside can really clear the picture about yourself and start the road to a happier life.

What’s my trauma? A childhood in an emotionally dysfunctional family. My father had multiple mental illnesses and was completely unable to relate to his three children. All through my childhood I was afraid of my father; as a teenager I despised him. My mother, though functional, was a hard, cold woman. My earliest memories consist of her beating me. I grew up feeling worthless, not good enough. I learned to hide my true feelings, to act tough. By my late teens I suffered from undiagnosed depression and anxiety, and a particular fear of social situations. I was angry and felt entitled, and that must’ve reflected on the outside world. I had a hard time accepting women as sexual beings. Sex, while something I really wanted, had a dirty vibe to it (I blame it on the cold mother). Deep down inside I was afraid to let anyone see the true me, yet I was envious of people with close friends. I had none.

It’s been a long road to recovery (councelling, hard self-reflection, and meds to take the edge off the worst anxiety and depression), but I’m happier now than I ever was. I’m more at ease with myself, looser, more confident, and women are way more interested in me (and me in them!) now than before, all the way through to post coitus. My few long-time friends comment on the change. I’m simply more fun to be with, while still a bit obtuse and stiff. The old cliche that you have to like yourself for anyone else to like you is true.

The bottom line: You have issues. Go talk to a psychiatric councellor. It can only be good.